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Author Topic: just saw the worrying Poseidon news  (Read 18416 times)

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Offline T_Bone

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Re: just saw the worrying Poseidon news
« Reply #44 on: November 18, 2003, 09:56:54 PM »
> While I agree that it might not have been the
> wisest move to include the anti-piracy code, now
> they have removed it I don't see why CH got so upset.

Maybe he was upset because it's ILLEGAL? He stated very plainly why he was upset. Elbox required an OEM license, yet they were trying to finagle a non-OEM license for an OEM product, this, on TOP of having an ILLEGAL anti-piracy mecanism built into the driver that's supposed to interface to Chris's stack.

Elbox would today, still be licensed, if they simply apologised for the illegal code. if only everyone who's made mistakes had it THAT easy.


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Offline T_Bone

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Re: just saw the worrying Poseidon news
« Reply #45 on: November 18, 2003, 10:00:11 PM »
"If I was cynical I would say that the anti-piracy code was a convenient excuse for CH, after all he has a number of other possibly (<----note the word possibly) conflicting companies using his software!."

How is that an incentive to block Elbox?
A license is a license. Makes no difference to Chris who the card is licensed to, he gets his fee.

That's like saying someone who owns a gas station might POSSIBLY have an ulterior motive for not selling gas to Ford built cars, even though their only income is from selling gas.
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Offline lempkee

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Re: just saw the worrying Poseidon news
« Reply #46 on: November 18, 2003, 11:22:04 PM »
i give a rats ass about all this mumbojumbo , i want to know if i buy cards from other companies..am i in danger then?

maybe i want an extra pci slot? then i will toss out my spider for sure and my soundcard..., if this will do me harm or my amiga then i will get crazy.

lets say , i get a delphina clockport card and a subway usb... if i attach them they wont work because i have a mediator?...
maaaaaaaaaaan i can smell all these new thread on theese forums we use...

now what if it works but it trash your setup? "mediator detected , Time To take REVENGE" BRRRRRRRR

or what on earth is all this about?...

i want an answer and that NOW, i give a #### about the malicious code in spider driver because it would never hurt me anyway, if it had then it would have trashed my system ages ago...nothing ever works here :D

cheers
Whats up with all the hate!
 

Offline tjaoz

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Re: just saw the worrying Poseidon news
« Reply #47 on: November 19, 2003, 12:27:11 AM »
@Kronos

Quote
Switching of keyfiles does NOT violate your rights, cos you only bought
Poseidon 1.x, which still works for you,not 2.x.

Free updates are a friendly gesture, not something that is mandatory.
You have completely no idea how consumer rights work in EU.

You can read about it in my post in the Mediator ML: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Amiga-Mediator/message/16526
 

Offline Targhan

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Re: just saw the worrying Poseidon news
« Reply #48 on: November 19, 2003, 12:29:43 AM »
You never answered my question tjoaz.  Will updating my mediator driver prevent me from using a SubWay card?
Regards,
Targhan
 

Offline tjaoz

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Re: just saw the worrying Poseidon news
« Reply #49 on: November 19, 2003, 12:31:20 AM »
@T_Bone

Quote
You are not really a client. Elbox has "at NO time" had an OEM license for Hodges USB software. Never.
You did not get the point.
I'm a Hodges' client. I bought the registration keys directly from him. Hodges is a seller in this case, not matter what he sells.

Quote
Why does that make Hodges dishonest?
1. He switched off the keys, for which I paid him.
2. He does not fulfil obligations of the agreement that he made with Elbox.
 

Offline tjaoz

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Re: just saw the worrying Poseidon news
« Reply #50 on: November 19, 2003, 12:33:34 AM »
@Acill

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No this is simply untrue. I have a Algor and I have a mediator, both are working just fine.
Which driver versions do you use?
Do you have access to the pci.library 6.0?
 

Offline tjaoz

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Re: just saw the worrying Poseidon news
« Reply #51 on: November 19, 2003, 12:37:32 AM »
@T_Bone

Quote
!!!!

Why?
OK, once again:

My guess is this is a simple response to the Hodges' move.

Stopping Poseidon registration for Spider users promotes other (IMHO obsolete and overpriced) USB  Amiga cards. Hodges agreed with Elbox to be always neutral to users of different hardware USB Amiga solutions.  Hodges move clearly breaks this agreement.

Now Elbox helps Hodges in restoring balance and regaining neutrality for various Amiga USB solutions.
 

Offline tjaoz

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Re: just saw the worrying Poseidon news
« Reply #52 on: November 19, 2003, 12:39:54 AM »
@Targhan

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So, you are now saying that my Mediator driver prevents me from CHOOSING another USB solution for my A1200?!
You can always use old drivers.
 

Offline lempkee

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Re: just saw the worrying Poseidon news
« Reply #53 on: November 19, 2003, 12:41:11 AM »
i give a rats ass about all this mumbojumbo , i want to know if i buy cards from other companies..am i in danger then?

maybe i want an extra pci slot? then i will toss out my spider for sure and my soundcard..., if this will do me harm or my amiga then i will get crazy.

lets say , i get a delphina clockport card and a subway usb... if i attach them they wont work because i have a mediator?...
maaaaaaaaaaan i can smell all these new thread on theese forums we use...

now what if it works but it trash your setup? "mediator detected , Time To take REVENGE" BRRRRRRRR

or what on earth is all this about?...

i want an answer and that NOW, i give a #### about the malicious code in spider driver because it would never hurt me anyway, if it had then it would have trashed my system ages ago...nothing ever works here :D

cheers
Whats up with all the hate!
 

Offline tjaoz

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Re: just saw the worrying Poseidon news
« Reply #54 on: November 19, 2003, 12:42:05 AM »
@Lemmink

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I'm tempted to reply but you obviously have lost the sense for reallity or are just plain dumb, so it won't make sense to talk to you anymore.
Thank you for you kind words. I'm glad not to hear from you any more.
 

Offline Doobrey

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Re: just saw the worrying Poseidon news
« Reply #55 on: November 19, 2003, 01:20:41 AM »
Quote

tjaoz wrote:
@Kronos

Quote
Switching of keyfiles does NOT violate your rights, cos you only bought
Poseidon 1.x, which still works for you,not 2.x.

Free updates are a friendly gesture, not something that is mandatory.
You have completely no idea how consumer rights work in EU.


Neither do you Tjaoz..
By your logic, I should sue Microsoft for not letting me have a free copy of WinXP..since I`m a registered Win95&98 owner..

If your original version of Poseidon stopped working, then I`d agree and say you had a legal case against Chris Hodges ..but it hasn`t has it?
On schedule, and suing
 

Offline tjaoz

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Re: just saw the worrying Poseidon news
« Reply #56 on: November 19, 2003, 01:33:23 AM »
@bhoggett

Quote
Hardly. Not only are you intent on damaging a developer,
No, this is not my intention.
 
It is Hodges who tries to damage his own reputation and his own product with the childish game, he plays against Spider users and against Elbox.

According to me, such behaviour as his should be publicly ostracised.

Hodges did not prepare drivers for Spider. Pawel Stypula, a developer from Elbox did the job. The drivers were prepared on Hodges's request. Now Hodges refusing sales of keys for Mediator users is trying to DESTROY the work of another developer.

At the same time, Hodges tries to destroy the only USB 2.0 controller for Amiga and to help selling out ancient USB 1.1 cards made by his friend from E3B. Sure, same Pegasos fans applause Hodges. They are not really happy with Pegasos having only USB 1.1 support while Spider is a USB 2.0 controller.

Games like that of Hodges' make the Amiga situation as bad as it is now. Sure, for you it's only pleasure - you are not bothering about a computer which you do not have.  

Quote
but you troll by posting 6 replies to every one post.
It seems that you have serious problems with counting. Could you show me these 6 replies of mine to ONE post?

Quote
And why would I do that? I not me who hates Chris Hodges, it's you. It's not ArakAttack users who will not get support with Poseidon, it's Elbox customers.
Why would you do that?
Maybe you posted this 'how-to-crack-Poseidon' guide in order to convince Hodges to finally begin Poseidon registration for ArakAttack users. Now he has no choice, if he does not want to lose money he should very quickly start the Poseidon registration for the ArakAttack users. It looks like Amithlon funs have much more 'effective methods' to convince Hodges to support their platform than Mediator users have ever had.

Quote
I don't have a Spider, since I wouldn't touch any Elbox product with a bargepole, and I don't use ArakAttack as I have no need for USB on the few occasions I use AmigaOS.
As someone completely not 'interested in using the Poseidon stack'  you have very much to talk about. :-)

Quote
Really? Shall we dig up the way they broke the licensing conditions on the P96 dev kit? Or the way they sold the Spider II with "Amithlon support" without telling the general public that they couldn't use it yet? Or the recriminations and name calling they indulged in with Hyperion before agreeing a deal over the Warp3D drivers for Voodoo 3 cards? Or the way they claimed thay had Voodoo 4 and 5 specific drivers when they were only Voodoo 3 drivers that worked with Voodoo 4 and 5 but without the advanced features being supported? Or the viruses they put in their software and the LIES they told when denying the existence of those trojans? Or how about the long list of drivers they said they had in development years ago which have never materialised.
1.  Elbox wrote their own hardware drivers for graphic cards to work with the P96 graphic system. P96 authors did not help Elbox in writing these drivers. Elbox never had any contract with them. What Elbox did in this case is legal and honest. From each point of view it is much more fair than what other companies did with P96.

Maybe you prefer the Ateo way?
I heard that they ordered P96 drivers from P96 team for their Pixel64 card. The Picasso team developed these drivers but Ateo never paid.

2. As far as Spider Amithlon support is concern your accusations are your own fantasies. I remember this amiga.org thread where you were so angry at Elbox that VMC placed on-line their new powerpci.library a few days AFTER Elbox had announced the Spider II Amithlon support.
It so funny that in your eyes Elbox is responsible for everything happening in the world. :-)
It is even more funny taking into account that, as you wrote, you are not interested in USB support at all :-)

3. About Elbox and Hyperion story: Elbox and Hyperion are serious companies. They negotiated the Warp3D contract longer than e.g. Matay did. But remember that Matay do not exist as a company any more, so it is not the best example. Finally both Elbox and Hyperion met their contract obligations. I even heard that Elbox was the only company which paid Warp 3D OEM bills.

BTW As far as I see you are an Amithlon fun.
Do you know that Amithlon does not have Warp 3D support at all?
Do you know that it is because Amithlon authors/editors have not agreed to pay Hyperion for the Warp 3D OEM licence like Elbox did?

Why you do not cry in this case?!

4. Voodoo 4 and Voodoo 5 support: Elbox have their own P96 drivers SPECIFIC for the Voodoo 4 and Voodoo5 cards. Warp 3D drivers for Voodoo 3 support Voodoo 4 and Voodoo 5 thanks to proper initialization of Voodoo4/5 cards by Elbox 2D drivers. Elbox clearly informed about this, e.g. here: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Amiga-Prometheus/message/1057

5. About viruses and trojans: You should learn a little bit more what are the meanings of these words.

Quote
You'd need to extract your head from your rectum before you could see any of that, and we all know that's asking too much of you.
Interesting ideas. Are you practising some yoga games? It must be very hard on your body when you want to write in this position :-)
 

Offline bhoggett

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Re: just saw the worrying Poseidon news
« Reply #57 on: November 19, 2003, 02:17:31 AM »
@tjaoz

Quote
Maybe you posted this 'how-to-crack-Poseidon' guide in order to convince Hodges to finally begin Poseidon registration for ArakAttack users. Now he has no choice, if he does not want to lose money he should very quickly start the Poseidon registration for the ArakAttack users. It looks like Amithlon funs have much more 'effective methods' to convince Hodges to support their platform than Mediator users have ever had.

This is a lie, as I would expect from tjaoz aka Rat.

The person who posted the how-to-crack guide is not an Amithlon "fun" and is most likely not a user either. His name is certainly not Dan Gaines and he is not in the UK either, despite the e-mail address used.

The person in question joined the mailing list less than a week before posting the crack, and that was the only post he ever made. It was cross posted to the amithlonopen, amithlon and Mediator mailing lists. The purpose was simply to damage Chris Hodges and nothing else.

So, considering that you tell lies about what happened and try to blame genuine users, and considering that "Dan Gaines" posted in bad English which showed it was not his native laguage, I'm quite certain the culprit is you.

As for Hodges making Poseidon available with ArakAttack, this was always going to happen in good time, as was posted by the ArakAttack author when he released the driver. The piracy episode has had no effect whatsoever, except to have the bogus address immediately expelled from both amithlon lists. I have no idea how the mediator list reacted since that forum is of no interest to me.

However, any list that condoned such actions or failed to remove the offending message leaves itself open to closure by YahooGroups for abusing their usage conditions.

As far as I'm concerned Elbox are a bunch of virus writers, no different at all from the scum who write all those Outlook worms. It doesn't matter why they did it, only that they did.

You do not have entitlement to Poseidon 2. End of story. You paid for Poseidon v1 and that's what you got. Hodges never "switched off" your key, he just removed it from the list of keys supported by the updates. Unless you have a written guarantee that you are entitled to free updates for life, you have no case.

As for Elbox having an agreement with Hodges, where is the contract? Where does it say that they are allowed to use Poseidon to activate their virus? Both the lack of a contract and Elbox' criminal abuse of his software entitle Hodges to remove all support from Elbox as he has done.

Now Elbox using their updated drivers to disable competitors' hardware from existing users is another matter. That is unquestionably an abuse of consumer rights, and if I was an affected customer I would definitely make an official complaint against them.
Bill Hoggett
 

Offline T_Bone

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Re: just saw the worrying Poseidon news
« Reply #58 on: November 19, 2003, 06:41:26 AM »
tjaoz wrote:
> You did not get the point. I'm a Hodges' client. I bought the
> registration keys directly from him. Hodges is a seller in this
>  case, not matter what he sells.

You still have what you bought from him.

>> Why does that make Hodges dishonest?
>  1. He switched off the keys, for which I paid him.

No, he disabled your key for the versions you DIDNT pay for.
I have a key for photoshop 7, this doesn't mean I'm entitled to Photoshop 8.

> He does not fulfil obligations of the agreement that he made with Elbox.

Chris has a legal and valid reason NOT to, one, no OEM agreement was *ever* made, two, even if one *had* been made, Elbox's illegal action made any agreement incontingent.

Also, let's not forget Chris *did* give Elbox a chance, like I said he made it perfectly clear that they remove all illegal code and apologise, or go fish. Elbox chose to go fish. That was a choice Elbox made. If you disagree with their choice, you should take that up with Elbox.

If Elbox had simply apologised, none of this would have happened.
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Offline Lemmink

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Re: just saw the worrying Poseidon news
« Reply #59 from previous page: November 19, 2003, 06:43:06 AM »
I am astound that some care so less about the RDB deletion code that were in the Elbox drivers. Let`s say some company installs a mechanism in a car that shoots whoever is in the driveing seat, if he tries to move the car without haveing the ignitionkey. There will be a chance of say 1 to 1.000.000 for a system malfunction. Would you dare to drive with such a car ??
Not really interesting, but it`s there.
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