AmigaOne clones?

[Rogue]

Paul_Gadd wrote:
Face facts the TeronONE board and OS4 is a SCAM to force Amiga zealots to buy already out of date machines.

With crap like this you are insulting me and all the people that put their time into OS 4. Why don't you just shut up?

[Rogue]

mips_proc wrote:
bottom line is they dont want to sell OS4 to people like me....people who dont want to buy a 'special"(rebadged teronCX) motherboard to run their OS.... I want OS4 on my Pegasos...they dont want to sell it to me... you can sit and cry and carry on that OS4 needs this massive anti-piracy to keep people from stealing it...but the other side of the coin is...who really cares enough about OS4 to buy an A1 to run it? 'diehards' do... and those diehards would buy OS4 anyway...so there is no 'win' in tieing it to one board...

Are you really *that* clueless, or are you just playing dumb? This almost provokes physical pain.

If you don't care about OS 4, then just shut the hell up and don't buy it. But your incessant whining is enough to provide a clear indication that there is a demand.

Please acknowledge that the people involved feel that they have every right to protect their investment in time and money in the project.

Please, also read Khronos' post. Genesi doesn't care about OS 4. I don't know if this is true or not (I'd venture to say it is), the end result is that they don't cooperate on OS 4 for the Pegasos, and without cooperation such an undertaking isn't going to lead anywhere. I am sick and tired of hearing from people like you that we are withholding or forcing anyone to do something - if you don't want it, go buy something else.

But for god's sake, stop calling us liars. And please stop bashing the old horse of the "rebadged" Teron, it doesn't really matter in the least who in the whole wide world produced the board. I personally wouldn't care if the board was produced by bPlan, MAI, Escena (ok, that was a good one), or the pope. Or do you think the Pegasos is bad because it is also sold as a Linux platform? Probably not.

[Rogue]

Kronos wrote:

Currently MorphOS is leading by a distance and after I read the latest
interviews were all Hyperion-guys said something like "no no I mainly
work on Mac/Linux/?? projects, OS4 is done by someone else"

Ah, twisting the facts as always, are you?

"All" Hyperion-guys that are saying they are working mainly on Mac/Linux is me, and me alone. If you can point me to a place where Thomas said this, I would be rather surprised. You also neglegt to mention the 35+ developers outside of Hyperion that where hired for the purpose, but then, you never really cared about the facts.

[Kronos]

35 ?? Wow that list is still growing ....

But tell me, do you still count Mason (now come on nice icons, but
OS-developers), Strunzi (gives you access to his CVS) and all the
"I'll add a tiny tool to it" ?

O.K. not sure about Thomas, but that would leave exactly one men
working full-time on the core components ........ see you in 04  :-P

Rogue I do respect the people involved.. I just feel what their doing is limiting 'them' ... I think OS4 will be a solid good product... and I would like to be able to use it...thats my main qualm.. I want to use it..I personally might shell out and buy an A1 to use it if/when its all ready...
but by making it run with this rom... It limits the OS I feel..and I think OS4 on pegasos would be a good idea...I agree completely that you have a right to protect your time and investment in it...but do you really think you will sell more OS4 if you rom it to a board? I mean think about... do you think people in this community will just go and steal OS4 after they buy a 500+ dollar board to run it? I dont think it would make sense... I agree with the Genesi thing to an extent they have MOS now and OS4 dosent intrest them... but BeOS didnt intrest apple nor does Linux... and I ran both on a G3 mac a while ago...I dont see where the 'rom' makes this so much more profietable... I'd like to hear your side of how that works? if you could explain...
I also dont think your a liar... you call it an "A1' and HP calls their computers HP(whatevernumber) even though they may be useing ECS boards.... just because I say its a rebadged Teron dosent mean I'm calling 'you' a liar... I just dont go along with the people (not the developers/etc) who sit and say that the board was somehow 'custom' engineered by eyetech or whoever they claim did it.....when it wasnt(from what I've seen).... I also add this is my opinon and it may be flawed but I think if you look at this from an general computer users stance...you can see why people like me think OS4 shouldnt be 'romed' to anything...since all anti-piracy measures to date (virtually all) have not worked for anyone else(companys with quite a deal more R&D to put into it IE:Sony,IBM,Microsoft)... so I dont view it so much as a 'anti-piracy' measure... my view isnt based upon the marketing brochures...and it may be wrong...but I dont view it as anti-piracy.. sure I can respect their intention to say it is... because their working on this alot more then I am...but in the long run is it good for you guys? is it good for eyetech and for everyone? .... I question that...
In any case... I have nothing against any of you personally..and I hope you dont find my posts offensive in a personal nature... you're the only ones really working on AmigaOS right now and I'd hate to see ya quit doing it...

[Minion]

T_Bone wrote:

Minion wrote:
I have to say that when working as a HP/Compaq engineer, when I meet IBM engineers on site they're generally arseholes.

Yea, I'm sure where they work made all the difference in the world. I'm sure there are no arseholes working at Compaqard?
 :-o

I didn't say why.  In the projects where I am working where there are IBM engineers on site its coz we stole the contract off them, and therefore their work, and as most of us are independant contractors aswell, we only gat paid for the days work we do.  Therefore we cost them money.

[Minion]

Paul_Gadd wrote:

OK paul what the solution for ppl who want to run Aos4

I want to see OS4 run on a PPC machine of my choice instead of a poor board what has not even got DDR slots on it which is pathetic,

Guess you dont know much about hardware then.
DDR would make NO DIFFERENCE!
You are a sucker for tech bullsh*tspeak.
The FSB runs at 133MHz, and the CPU only runs at 600-800MHz, for which PC133 memory is fine.

[Rogue]

Kronos wrote:

But tell me, do you still count Mason (now come on nice icons, but
OS-developers), Strunzi (gives you access to his CVS) and all the
"I'll add a tiny tool to it" ?

No, these are people actively working on a component of the OS, not counting GUI designers, Icon designers, and most of all not the translators.

O.K. not sure about Thomas, but that would leave exactly one men
working full-time on the core components ........ see you in 04  :-P

OK, not sure about? No, not OK. Exactly my point. You don't know, yet you feel the urge to post it. Thomas is not the only one working on it, there are others.

But thank you, you just admitted that you post stuff without actually knowing the facts.

[takemehomegrandma]

@ Rogue

Hi. I believe many people are curious about OS4, could you please mention in which state of development it's in now? Is Hyperion aiming to show a finnished and tested product in March? Or will it perhaps even be released then?

Thanks ...

[Rogue]

I'm sorry, I am not going to make any statements about the current state of development anymore. I have stated the reasons for this recently on the AmigaOS4 list on yahoogroups - anything that I say will be intentionally misinterpreted, the facts twisted and talked to death on rumour mills. Examine the list archive if you are interested.

Recent examples prove me point, really...

I'm afraid you will have to wait for official updates. There are too many members of the MIF around here (that 'M' doesn't stand for MorphOS, in case someone wants to flame me for that).

[L8-X]

@Rogue

Oh well, I understand your reasons,  yet another victory for the fud spreaders then :-(

Eyetech will have to wait till OS4 is released then before they get my money. :cry:

[Rogue]

If you want it, ask Genesi to licence it. Porting OS 4 to the Pegasos is not a matter of good or ill will. Like Kronos pointed out, Genesi doesn't care about OS 4, even if some of their customers would want it, but there is nothing that either Hyperion or AI could do about this. A public offer of free hardware on some MorphOS mailing list hardly suffices. A call or an email to those involved would have been a bit less public but a lot more genuine.

Please note that this is not only a matter of licencing - there already was a clear "no" to us long before the licencing scheme ever came up. It's also not about Donglization - a USB dongle would do the same job. It is also not about exclusivity - there is no exclusivity involved in the OS 4 licence, since Eyetech also sells the machines as Linux only.

It is true that anti-piracy methods don't do much good, but they at least prevent some of the casual copies. Put it any way, but piracy is a problem, not only on the Amiga.

All buyers of an AmigaOne will get a licence to OS 4 included. I am not ready to judge how many buyers of a 500 + dollar mobo are going to pirate their stuff - I think the amount of piracy on the Wintel market speaks for itself, they also buy 500 dollar systems and pirate; some (mind you, some) people seem to think that paying for hardware is OK because you can touch it, but paying for software is useless since it is just magnetic bits.

The comparison between Genesi (or any Amiga company) and Apple is rather far fetched - if we could divide the sales that Apple has between all of the Amiga companies in existance, we'd all be considerably better off. Apple doesn't need to care for alternative OSes besides their own.

[MarkTime]

How much is Amiga charging in licensing per unit on AmigaOne boards, $50 dollars?

Amiga is trying to collect its revenues from hardware sales, because at $50 bucks a pop, or whatever the actual number works out too it is going to be hard to hide that fee in anything but a large purchase.

I think we all want to cut Amiga right out of that income stream without any regrets...that doesn't mean we want to pirate OS 4 or not allow Hyperion, or even Amiga, Inc. to profit from OS 4.

But burying a huge fee in the teron board, which they didn't develop and won't be developing, ever....I don't care for that, I'd rather buy a terrasoft board.  You can sell me os 4, if you want, in which case I'll buy it, if you won't sell it to me, don't fault me for not purchasing it.

[Warface]

If you want it, ask Genesi to licence it.

I know that in the light of the current licencing scheme it may sound naive, but...

Why don't you distribute AmigaOS4 as a standalone product? In different versions, onboard rom protection for the AmigaONE (at a discount maybe) and USB dongled version for Teron and Pegasos.

What good comes from forcing hardware manufacturers (with a competing product, not to mention) licence OS4? (Which they most obviously won't, thus limiting OS4 to AmigaONE and CPPC, less income for Hyperion)

Yes, I honestly confess, I have little clue about the contracts made, as most probably only a few know their content, so in light of something I don't know about it all may sound silly. But I see the current licencing scheme as limiting (users have to pay for OS4 anyway) for OS4. (on the other hand grants the income for Eyetech as a return for their vast investments, but a discount on the AmigaONE version may be sufficient in my eyes)

[samface]

MarkTime wrote:
How much is Amiga charging in licensing per unit on AmigaOne boards, $50 dollars?

Amiga is trying to collect its revenues from hardware sales, because at $50 bucks a pop, or whatever the actual number works out too it is going to be hard to hide that fee in anything but a large purchase.

I think we all want to cut Amiga right out of that income stream without any regrets...that doesn't mean we want to pirate OS 4 or not allow Hyperion, or even Amiga, Inc. to profit from OS 4.

But burying a huge fee in the teron board, which they didn't develop and won't be developing, ever....I don't care for that, I'd rather buy a terrasoft board.  You can sell me os 4, if you want, in which case I'll buy it, if you won't sell it to me, don't fault me for not purchasing it.

Do you know wether they charge anything at all? If so, do you know wether they charge per board or as a single one-time fee? If you don't have the answers, stop spreading this FUD. Yes, it is FUD as in Fear, Uncertainty and Doubt. End of story.

Amiga Inc. making money on the brand... LOL! I just can't help myself from laughing everytime I see this weird conspiracy theory popping up on Amiga forums. I mean, how much do you expect them to make out of a nearly extinct and forgotten trademark? Do you really think M$, the most profitable IT business in the world, would strike partership deals with them if they were to be such pathetic swindlers? Yes, they have broken a few release dates, I know. But, does that really make them swindlers that is just trying to make some money out of owning the trademark? I'm sorry but the trademark cost them a whole lot more than they will ever make on trademark licence fees or whatever. It probably won't even pay the interest on the loan. No, the licensing issue is only about protecting their IP from IP thieves like ... sorry, I don't even want make them the favor of mentioning their name here. I think most of us knows what I'm talking about anyway... :roll:

Back to reality, guys. Amiga Inc. and their revolutionary plans of creating a complete new scalable, hardware independent platform and operating environment, has given third parties the ability to continue the classic Amiga product line of hardware and OS. Do you really think the success or downfall of these third party products will effect their plans and/or outcome at all? Do you even see a reason for why Amiga Inc would care about any of this at all if it wasn't for the fact that it is their IP? They wouldn't. The licensing scheme is for protecting the IP against certain illwilling companies out there (you know who), not because they think they will make a fortune from licensing fees.

$50 bucks for each sold board in licensing fees? LOL! Where do people get all this from, really?

[The_Editor]

That (to my way of thinking) actually sounds a good idea, Warface.

Perhaps after Hyperion/Eyetech et al have recouped a decent proportion of their layout, your suggestion might be "the way forward".