**Need Setup HELP** with Classic Amiga 2000 HARD DISK (Bridgeboard)

[darkage]

From bridgeboard guide -

    Floppy Disks: Supports up to 2 standard PC floppy disk drives:
        5.25" Drives: 360KB (Comes standard with 360KB drive)
        3.5" Drives: 720KB (Uses Amiga external floppies drives on the external floppy connector)

[wbrejnia]

From bridgeboard guide -

Floppy Disks: Supports up to 2 standard PC floppy disk drives:
5.25" Drives: 360KB (Comes standard with 360KB drive)
3.5" Drives: 720KB (Uses Amiga external floppies drives on the external floppy connector)

What is weird about the above is I formatted the 5.25" floppy 720K and it worked. Now doesn't. Can't make another (no B: drive)

I can't format a 3.5" Floppy 720KB (DOS won't let me).  Same Floppy will  Format 1.2 M .
 
 Does the disk have to be a certain kind (hole on case? No Hole?). How does DOS know or decide if format is not possible? (DISK DRIVE makes decision)?
 
 I figure that any higher density disk can be formatted LOWER Capacity (No the other way around)

[Oldsmobile_Mike]

I figure that any higher density disk can be formatted LOWER Capacity (No the other way around)

AFAIR there's a risk of data loss by formatting disks incorrectly, but I don't think it matters much in this case.  

Re: how does the drive detect:

[Pat the Cat]

Try

format   a:/4

http://www.easydos.com/format.html

Have to use a fresh disk. Every time you write data to an HD disk formatted to DD, it degrades.

You try can try resussitating dead High Density floppies by putting them on top of a loud speaker playing music for a few hours, or custom designed hardware to "randomize" the magnetic domains on a disk. Then try formatting them fresh again.

(This one is really deep, don't go there unless you like headaches).

http://retrotechnology.com/herbs_stuff/guzis.html

[wbrejnia]

Pat (is that what I should call you, or do you want the_cat added, you bring up a good point.

I think I "Degaussed", my 5.25" DOS Boot floppies. Place is getting cluttered and I put the floppies on top of all kinds of places. On Top of the Amiga Monitor, Near the Amiga Power Supply Transformer. They may be extra sensitive being OLD.

I'll know once I have a 2nd 5.25" floppy drive. Hoping tonight.

The setup might be fine.

The pain of legacy. Can't just use another computer (have to build one), Can't just go to variety store a pick up a box of 5.25" DOS Formatted Floppies.
 
 I guess there is no SD Floppy Emulator I could plug into the Bridgeboard?  Can't be spending money for some XT Controller Card (at this point at least)

[wbrejnia]

POSSIBLE SOLUTION to Bridgeboard Internal 5.25" disk A: Drive not working.
 
 Stumbled upon this AN (MOD) for Bridgeboard to allow the Externally Connected Floppy Drive to be recognized as Drive A:  not B:
 
 http://www.amiga-stuff.com/hardware/a2088.html
 
 I doubt it, but if I blew that internal Floppy Connector, this might be an option.  Small gotcha is this if for a 5.25" inch disk.
 
 ** MOD is drastic.  Cutting Bridgeboard Circuit Board traces, and running jumpers **
 
 For now, keeping this in my POCKET.

[Pat the Cat]

You could plug in a Gotek drive to a floppy port, but that's just complicating things. Amiga and PC flavours. The snag is, the data is stored as a floppy image, so you have to set them up in advance. So it just makes things 10 times harder.

If you can boot the 486 from a floppy with the controller on it, with an autoconfig file that incudes it the drive should be recognised, IF it was formatted with a PC filesystem (DOS). Any floppy. 5.25 drives sometimes have jumper to switch between DD and HD, which is a great help sometimes.

And yes, this happens a lot when trying to get data from old systems that won't boot up for some reason. First time it's a maze. ESPECIALLY with XT systems. They weren't designed for Hard disks in the first place.

[wbrejnia]

You ain't kidding this is a Maze, the exit is still FAR. This isn't Stabbing in the Dark, this is a DARK MAZE.



*** I GOT THE 386 5.25" Floppy Drive working in the Amiga Explorer WinXP PC **

But the result may not be good for needs.

This at least proves the 5.25 is good, and should have work in the 386 (even same cable).

But depending what I assign the 5.25 in DOS, it either picks up, or does not.

When I assigned it as a 5.25 1.2M, it picked up and I was able to format a Floppy. But it couldn't read the DOS Boot Floppy for the Amiga PC 5.25

When I changed BIOS to 3.25 760K, it gives a "Drive Not Ready Error" for that Same Floppy I just formatted in that 5.25 Drive.

So this will be tricky.

- Will play around with various combinations:
- Might consider bring the Amiga 5.25 Floppy over to Explorer PC
- Or could I possible bring this 5.25 Floppy over to Amiga (probably not since Bridgeboard doesn't support 1.2M)

-> This just proves the 386 Floppy DRIVE is good.
-> This does not prove the 5.25 Floppy BOOTDisk is corrupted (degaussed), or GOOD (if good then something is wrong on Amiga PC bridgeboard)

Photo is to document this point of trial.


NEXT STEPS:

1) Try a few BIOS Setting in Exporer PC (See if I can get a common format that will work in BOTH [ Explorer 5.25" ] and also in [ Bridgeboard 5.25"] )
 *** THAT WOULD BE A BINGO, since I could boot the Amiga PC again !! **
 *** As I was typing Post, I tried another BIO setting.  Doesn't change anything [[[ Therefore must try DOS format options /F: for other Formats **
 *** Maybe the BIOS and Hardware is kind of the MAX capacity, and DOS might be able to go lower *

2) Must get a 3.5" disk working as A: Drive on this Explorer PC to be able to boot a DOS disk, to format a 5.25 DOS boot disk on B:
(Which kind of needed to do #1 above )

3) Other crazy choices (Like move the Amiga Hard Drive and WD Controller into the 386 PC) with some kind of setup. Who knows...

[wbrejnia]

** WOO HOO !! ** (Two Drives a: 3.25" & b: 5.25" ) Working.

After many tries, and all kind of Bios Setting, I got something that works to start playing with HOPE (Hope I can make a Low capacity Disk Amiga PC can read)

Thanks to whoever mentioned the TWIST in the Ribbon cable. First cable was straight and both drives would conflict.

Then it came to figuring out the Right BIOS setting for 5.25"

I'm still not in the Clear, since I need to get a Format the Amiga PC 5.25" can read.

So next step is playing with FORMAT Commands.
Windows XP doesn't have as low level on first Glance.

Will be possible now to create a DOS 6.2, or 3.2 DOS Boot Disk with a Legacy Format Command.

This makes the 386 Obsolete at this point. Maybe later if I persue WD controller since it has the right motherboard Slots.

** One note, in above POST PHOTO and Comments.
That was not a 1.2M Format. I think it took a BIOS change for Japanese Mode 3 Drive to make it format that way by DEFAULT Format Command **

* Documenting my Setup as below so I don't forget **


NOW the Next Step is hopefully (Formatting a 5.25 Floppy the Amiga will recognize).

If that works, I can copy over whatever is needed, to 5.25 Disks for Amiga PC.

And I may get to see that BRIDGEBOARD Bios Type Menu. And Possibly the WD Bios Tool too.

Format: Possibly via DOS, or some utility I can find.

This PC has internet and a Hard Drive so my Abilities are plentiful.

Onward.......

[Pat the Cat]

So next step is playing with FORMAT Commands.
Windows XP doesn't have as low level on first Glance.

Will be possible now to create a DOS 6.2, or 3.2 DOS Boot Disk with a Legacy Format Command.

Yes. You pretty much HAVE to use DOS to rescue an XT system. Windows 95 onwards is not recommended for such a task. It gradually erases true DOS usage as a user choice for doing system tasks. 6 is usually OK, rarely do you have to use an earlier version (usually because the target system has very small memory, does not support the larger memory sizes so DOS 6 does not work).

Not necessarily MS-DOS, like I said, DR-DOS is an alternative. But MS-DOS is what most people use for the task. And a "real" old PC.

OR an Amiga with a Bridgecard, which can read MSDOS drives and file systems. Easier in some ways, trickier in other ways.

[wbrejnia]

iiiiiiii.......ttttttt
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iiiiiiii......sssss
...ii.........ss
...ii.........sssss
...ii..............ss
iiiiiii.......sssss

ALIVE !! (again)


Yes indeed. The Bridgeboard is Good. Amiga PC Boots from 5.25.

(( Yes the 5.25 DOS Disk were Magnetized/Deguassed )) Unreadable


DID The Following with a 6.2 DOS Boot Disk that had "Format" command on it.
 
 (Booted Explorer PC with it, then Format /F:360 /s  and Format /F:720 )


-- Formatted a 5.25 Boot Disk 360K in Explorer PC
-- It Boots of Bridgeboard 5.25 and Amiga PC Has Dos

-- Also Formatted a 3.25" 720K Disk
-- It reads on the Bridgeboard External A1010 3.25" Drive. (Cool, never knew that was possible)

HERE IS LIVING PROOF:



Bit of time wasted on Figuring out 5.25 Boot Disks were bad (the only two I had). Now can make as many as needed.

But learned a Lot. (Now Have an External Bridgeboard 3.25 disk)

And more.

ONWARD to next Steps, which I hope will be more fun.

But next step is some Sleep for Tonight.....

[Pat the Cat]

You might find this helpful, it makes a boot floppy for any western digital controller? Not sure if only for WD disks, not controllers, but it looks like it's a controller access method.

I suggest you make the floppy, but check it over to make sure it doesn't automatically run the EZ Drive software (it shouldn't, but it's best to check);-

http://www.driverguide.com/driver/detail.php?driverid=32531&si=d355eddaec425fe05a5be8474a5f501e

That one seems closest to what you need right now, if you do a search on the site for everything to do with that controller, most hits show "Windows", not "DOS". The "Disk Manager" software looks good if you do go with the 486, as it gives you options to copy data onto another connected hard drive. Do check over any disks made. You want to be sure about this before booting with floppies with the hard drive connected.

http://members.driverguide.com/driver_search.php?q=western+digital&si=d355eddaec425fe05a5be8474a5f501e&st=1485429222&si_prev=cd5e689088f78c3069cae44f526cde53&gqm0=western+digital

What you could do is, setup with the controller card in the Amiga, but with the hard drive disconnected.

When you are sure as you can be the controller is recognized, then switch off, attach the drive and try to access.

[darkage]

Good job!  

My goto website for general bootdisks is this one  http://bootdisk.com/

[Pat the Cat]

Pretty good, but a little bit modern for an XT. These are the sort of systems you are trying to emulate (not very pretty);-

http://www.uncreativelabs.net/index.php?site=xtreview%7Cxtreview.htm

The page mentions a SYS command to make hard disks bootable. Not relevant for what you are trying to do, but maybe explains why you had problems getting it to autoboot to DOS. The Bridgeboard, that is.

[wbrejnia]

Thanks for the info. More Tool choices and options for my Toolbox drawers (right next to the Flint, Stone, Stick and string ).

So now that things are back to normal with Bridgeboard PC Booting to DOS.

Why isn't CTRL-ALT-ESC working to get to the Bridgeboard BIOS? (You don't need SW, it should just work on PC Boot (during or after boot). Correct ?)
[[[[ Does anyone have a bridgeboard that they can get to this BIO with? (One thing I was thiking is putting back my original Kickstart ROM, but better not to take anything apart right now ]]]

I first thought my ESC key isn't working (since it's beside my F1 Key which doesn't work). (What is a quick test to ensure my Keyboard ESC KEY is working?)

Is this BIOS only for the 286/386 bridgeboard or Sandwich Card and not the 2088?

Or am I doing something wrong, or setup is wrong. (I did read something about a guy having problem getting to the BIOS if Amiga-PC memory was not setup properly (Too low).

My thinking for next steps is to go thru that Bridgeboard install manual (which is great), and go step by step (Making a fresh Bridgeboard workbench with proper Config setup). Right now I have been just using the Bridgeboard Native Workbench Install disk without any customization (Good enough to prove my HW is all setup right and WORKING)

BTW, even though I have no recollection from Eons ago, that bridgeboard manual does ring Bells in my head, that I USED THAT MANUAL to setup the WD Controller and that Ocatgon Hard drive. (It is a many step process)

[wbrejnia]

Good job!

My goto website for general bootdisks is this one http://bootdisk.com/

That's a very handy site.  Nice photo's of the pretty ladies too!!