Surface 3 - New direction, higher prices and crappy i3

[persia]

A Windows 8 App runs full screen and just like a full screen app on OS X, moving the trackpad/mouse pointer to the top of the screen reveals a hidden bar that allows you to close it.  On OS X of course it also allows you to make it non-full screen, but maybe Windows 9 will add that....

[psxphill]

The difference is Apple never promised you could run Mac applications on the iPad.

When did Microsoft promise you could run desktop applications on Surface RT?
 

Oh wait, I remember I can't easily figure out how to close a Metro app. I guess they just close themselves after not being used for a while like all tablet OS's do? I really don't know, and I shouldn't have to figure out some strange incantation of how to close it, so I just switch back to the desktop view where I had opened the PDF from in Windows Explorer.

Possible ways of closing a metro app
 
Alt f4
click the close button in the top right
right click on the task bar icon and click close
open task manager and end task it
 
The close button and task bar icon might only be in the latest Windows 8.1 update, but Alt f4 even works in Windows 8. Alt-f4 has been used to close windows since the 80's.

[SysAdmin]

When did Microsoft promise you could run desktop applications on Surface RT?

By giving customers the standard Windows Desktop in Surface RT it's implied that it's Windows compatible. It looks like Windows but really isn't since no Windows legacy apps will run. Windows 8 was and is a massive failure, almost all of the team that created it has been fired from Microsoft up to the President of the Windows Division Steven Sinofsky and all the way up to the CEO Steve Ballmer. Microsoft counts all PC's that ship with Win8 as a new Windows 8 customer when in fact most immediately get reimaged with Windows 7. I never thought something could fail more than Visa but Win8 achieved that. Microsoft's best customers Fortune 500 companies shune Windows 8 and refuse to install it in their enterprise. Some do like Windows 8 and that is also a problem since now Microsoft has divided and confused their customer base on a massive scale. No competitor could have done the titanic damage that Microsoft has inflicted on itself.

From Windows Supersite.

"Windows 8 is not well-designed. It's a mess. But Windows 8 is a bigger problem than that. Windows 8 is a disaster in every sense of the word.

This is not open to debate, is not part of some cute imaginary world where everyone's opinion is equally valid or whatever. Windows 8 is a disaster. Period."

http://winsupersite.com/windows-8/what-heck-happening-windows

From Infoworld

"More Microsoft exec departures mark end of a Windows era
With Jon DeVaan and Grant George officially retired and most of rest of Windows 8 team out to pasture, Microsoft silently acknowledges complete lack of faith in Windows 8."

http://www.infoworld.com/t/microsoft-windows/more-microsoft-exec-departures-mark-end-of-windows-era-233279

[commodorejohn]

The dropping of basically everyone responsible for Win8 does give me hope for Win9, but we'll have to see how that all plays out - is Microsoft really willing to own up to the fact that they willfully made a colossal mistake, and go back to the drawing board?

[James2002]

The dropping of basically everyone responsible for Win8 does give me hope for Win9, but we'll have to see how that all plays out - is Microsoft really willing to own up to the fact that they willfully made a colossal mistake, and go back to the drawing board?

They always do a flip-flop before a better operation system.  In theory Windows 9 should be fine.  It be more stable than Windows 7 and Windows 8.

[psxphill]

By giving customers the standard Windows Desktop in Surface RT it's implied that it's Windows compatible.

You said they promised it, not that you inferred it. They never implied it and were always clear that it wouldn't run x86/x64 apps and they wouldn't allow developers to port their apps to arm.
 
 

From Windows Supersite.
 
"Windows 8 is not well-designed. It's a mess. But Windows 8 is a bigger problem than that. Windows 8 is a disaster in every sense of the word.
 
This is not open to debate, is not part of some cute imaginary world where everyone's opinion is equally valid or whatever. Windows 8 is a disaster. Period."

What isn't up for debate is how biased that piece is because it's written to generate clicks to raise advertising revenue.
 
http://winsupersite.com/windows-8/what-heck-happening-windows
 

"More Microsoft exec departures mark end of a Windows era
With Jon DeVaan and Grant George officially retired and most of rest of Windows 8 team out to pasture, Microsoft silently acknowledges complete lack of faith in Windows 8."

By you quoting that web site you silently acknowledge that Windows 8 has been a huge success. See I can do it too.
 
People retire all the time, it doesn't say anything about their past work. It might say something about their ability to perform future work. It might be a case of them making scapegoats of the people involved.
 
Microsoft took a punt with Surface and it didn't pan out, which wasn't because you don't like the start menu & doesn't count as Windows 8 being a failure. Some people might have been moved on because of the loss on hardware, although Microsoft usually are cool with ideas not panning out, they aren't as money driven as someone like Apple.
 
Enterprises not running Windows 8 is not entirely new. When Vista was coming out I was hearing about Enterprises that were still running projects to roll out XP to their NT4 machines. But "enterprises are as annoyed as usual about new version of windows" is not as compelling a headline.

[ElPolloDiabl]

Windows 8 is dodgy on purpose, so you will keep buying upgrades.

[Iggy]

The "Every other major revision sucks" theory seems valid.

ME sucked.
XP was alright.
Vista sucked mightily.
7 was OK.
8 sucks as well, no surprise!

[Oldsmobile_Mike]

When did Microsoft promise you could run desktop applications on Surface RT?



Possible ways of closing a metro app

Alt f4
click the close button in the top right
right click on the task bar icon and click close
open task manager and end task it

The close button and task bar icon might only be in the latest Windows 8.1 update, but Alt f4 even works in Windows 8. Alt-f4 has been used to close windows since the 80's.

The close button has only been added since 8.1, and even then it's only visible if you hover the mouse pointer over a part of the screen. Prior to that the only way I could figure out how to close that rubbish was by grabbing the "window" at the top center of the screen, and dragging it downward entirely off the bottom of the screen. Makes sense if you're using a tablet with your finger, rubbish for use with a mouse. But just wanted to add one more way to your list, lol.

Edit - Ctrl+W might work, also?  It closes windows, haven't tried it in Metro yet.

[psxphill]

Prior to that the only way I could figure out how to close that rubbish was by grabbing the "window" at the top center of the screen, and dragging it downward entirely off the bottom of the screen. Makes sense if you're using a tablet with your finger, rubbish for use with a mouse. But just wanted to add one more way to your list, lol.

In windows 8 you can also close apps running in the background by moving the mouse up to the top left right and clicking close (I've not gotten round to installing 8.1 on this machine).

[SysAdmin]

@psxphill

You sure spend a lot of time trying to get us to buy Windows 8.



I said Windows 7 works fine for me so why do you care what version of Windows I or others in this thread use? Many people hate Windows 8 and won't upgrade to it, maybe Windows 9 will be okay, who knows? Windows Supersite is run by the host of Windows Weekly a big Windows fan. That's why his words ring so true. If you think Windows 8 is a resounding success you are either working for Microsoft or living in a dream world. It's a fact that Windows 8 was a huge failure and most of the team that created it have been fired. Those facts are not debatable they are easily verified. If Microsoft losing 900 million on the Windows 8 based Tablet is success to you I would hate to see what you think failure looks like. That almost 1 billion dollar loss was in one quarter of the year.

http://www.theverge.com/2013/7/18/4535976/microsoft-lost-900-million-on-surface-rt

[persia]

Another problem is that Windows Store apps suck on the desktop, so being able to run them on a desktop is meaningless.  Apple got it right, tablet and phone are different to desktops and laptops.

And touch screens on laptops and desktops will always be secondary to trackpads (or I suppose mice).  The price of the touch interface on the two or three 27 inch or larger monitors you have on your desktop would be better spent on a 4K screen instead.

[commodorejohn]

Touch on the desktop is a fool's errand anyway, because it is just plain uncomfortable to hold your arm up and interact with something in front of your face for extended periods of time.

[SysAdmin]

Touch on the desktop is a fool's errand anyway, because it is just plain uncomfortable to hold your arm up and interact with something in front of your face for extended periods of time.

100% right, they call it Gorilla arm.



http://www.techbroil.com/2012/10/the-gorilla-at-end-of-windows-8-tunnel.html

http://www.wired.com/2010/10/gorilla-arm-multitouch/

[SysAdmin]

Another problem is that Windows Store apps suck on the desktop, so being able to run them on a desktop is meaningless.  Apple got it right, tablet and phone are different to desktops and laptops.

And touch screens on laptops and desktops will always be secondary to trackpads (or I suppose mice).  The price of the touch interface on the two or three 27 inch or larger monitors you have on your desktop would be better spent on a 4K screen instead.

4K yum, this one looks good.

http://www.lg.com/us/monitors/lg-34UM95-P-ultrawide-monitor

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KnrxNfxRK_4

[SysAdmin]

The scale of Windows 8.x’s failure is staggering!

http://betanews.com/2014/05/08/the-scale-of-windows-8-xs-failure-is-staggering/