Amiga.org Electrified.

[ElPolloDiabl]

Air con plus heating. Easy for a car with a motor. Not easy for one with a battery in it.

There is a connection btw PowerPC was always sold as a greener CPU.

[Iggy]

Electricity comes from unicorn farts.

No it isn't.
Electricity is just smoke.
I see it every time I break something the runs on electricity.

BTW - As the coffeehouse is for off topic discussions, I'm all in favor of starting this thread.

[amiman99]

I think is OK to have sub forums about topics completely unrelated to Amiga. Maybe you could call it "Current Tech", or "Current Events", something more generic, but that's up to the Admins.

I'm actually are looking into electric cars, I'm eyeing the new Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV, but it looks like is getting delayed.

My reasons to get the PHEV (Plugin Hybrid) is economical and political.
Economical, so I can save money. It's estimated that equivalent cost of electricity is about $1 a "Gallon", compared to $3.50 avg today.
Political, I don't want to support/give money to the Middle East (I know that most oil companies are American or Western), but I want to support my local Electric Company, which is partly owed by the city, which means that my money stays in the community in which I live. also, I hate how the price of oil is tied to the stock market and events throughout the world.

So there is no environment cause in my purchase.

[agami]

electric cars are crap, most people are fooled into the idea that they save the environment
and is an alternative to fuel.

except there is one major problem.
you need more electricity, more electricity equals more nuclear power stations.
or more smoke stacks (coal)

Especially in Australia we are so freaking dumb that the government wont make nuclear power plants. so instead they choose to make more smoke stacks....
so more coal burnt = larger hole in the ozone layer = more problems for everyone.

As a fellow Australian I agree that we should have nuclear power plants.
And whilst more electricity consumption will require more electricity production it need not come from coal, though most of it will in our enormously vacant land.
The side-effect is that there is a reduction of fuel refineries, fuel tankers on the roads, off-shore fuel drilling and oil tankers.

even if you have nuclear power, most countries will still have smoke stacks as well.
making more electricity is not a solution.

Nuclear power plants have cooling towers from which water vapour clouds billow, not smoke.

in fact to be completely blunt with all of you, there is no human solution to this problem!
either way we go we are DOOMED!

Actually, all the solutions to this problem are human. We are not waiting for divine intervention, well not the ones actually working on the solutions.

The fact is, converting electrical energy to the kinetic energy of the vehicles motion is more efficient than that derived from the internal combustion engine. So even with brown coal electric plants, less pollution is created for every kilometer traveled vs. a kilometer backed by fossil fuels.

[SysAdmin]

As in, it draws less power when charging  than an air conditioner? It looks (if I'm reading this right) like  that's marginally true for central AC (3300Kw/h for the Leaf versus  ~3500Kw/h for the AC, about a 6% difference) but not remotely for a  window unit (~1800Kw/h, 54% of the Leaf's power draw.) But the way I  hear it, it takes a Leaf about eight hours to charge (from a dedicated  charging station - more like 15-20 if you don't happen to have one of  those handy and have to use a normal electrical outlet!) and it gets  ~75-100 mi. per charge. Average miles per year for most drivers is about  15,000, so that's 150-200 charges, or 1200-1600 hours of charging per  year. Whereas depending on the part of the country, AC is going to be  running about 8-10 hours a day for about 1/4-2/5 of the year, or  anywhere from 730-1461 hours per year, at no more than 6% greater power  consumption and possibly little more than half.

Yeah, that definitely looks like a lower impact!

Nissan Leaf only takes 3.5 hours to charge if you have a 240 volt  charger. And that's if you have a fully depleted the battery.  It's  unusual to do that unless you drive great distances daily. If that's the  case an EV car is not the right solution for you. Even when I charged  using 110 volt it was done in 10-12 hours. You can even find 480 volt  chargers that charge your car in 30 minutes. If your driving around town  most charging stations are 240 volt and free. If I go shopping I charge  for free and I am able to charge for free close to where I work. Keep  in mind no one is being asked or forced to replace their gas car with an  EV. It just provides another choice in the market. If electric cars get  popular it will make the demand for gas go down and hopefully the  price. Then even if you never buy a EV and still drive a gas car you  benefit from lower gas prices (supply vs demand). I drive 100 miles per day so before the electric car I was paying $380 per month in gas and kept getting slammed with high maintenance costs. Since March when I got the EV my transportation costs have gone to $35 per month (I charge for free at work). And my maintenance costs have been $20 for a cabin filter replacement on my EV. I don't want to breath in unfiltered air from the other cars that are running on gas!

[commodorejohn]

Nobody's being forced to replace their car with an EV car, but a lot of people sure are getting told how unqualifiedly awesome* and Totally The Future Of Driving** they are by EV car advocates...

* (as long as you have a good charging infrastructure everywhere you'll be driving, don't mind decreased driving range when using your climate controls, and have a contingency plan for running out of juice)
** (in <100 mi. hops, with hours of downtime in between)

[SysAdmin]

Nobody's being forced to replace their car with an EV car, but a lot of people sure are getting told how unqualifiedly awesome* and Totally The Future Of Driving** they are by EV car advocates...

* (as long as you have a good charging infrastructure everywhere you'll be driving, don't mind decreased driving range when using your climate controls, and have a contingency plan for running out of juice)
** (in <100 mi. hops, with hours of downtime in between)

I use the A/C in my EV almost every-time I drive and it makes me lose 2 miles of range. All locations don't have an EV infrastructure in place yet and your right that is something to check ahead of time before buying an EV. Electric cars just like sports cars, SUVs, trucks, etc are not the right transportation solution for everyone. Running out of juice or gas would suck in anything you are driving.

[commodorejohn]

The difference is that running out of gas you can catch a ride to the station and take a few gallons in a can - you can't just go and buy another of the monster seat-sized batteries the Leaf uses off the shelf!

[SysAdmin]

The difference is that running out of gas you can catch a ride to the station and take a few gallons in a can - you can't just go and buy another of the monster seat-sized batteries the Leaf uses off the shelf!

I'm not sure about other cities but here in Chicago Nissan gives me free towing and the tow truck can give me a quick charge or tow me to the nearest charging station.

[don27dog]

I am not so much into electric cars but I have been tinkering with e-bikes for a few years now. My current mountain bike runs on 48v 20AH lifepo4 battery with a 2000W controller with a range of about 35 miles and top speed around 35 mph. My next build I am going with a123 prismatic cells 72v with a crystalyte 7240 which should top out at around 50 mph.

[Terminills]

Nissan Leaf only takes 3.5 hours to charge if you have a 240 volt  charger. And that's if you have a fully depleted the battery.  It's  unusual to do that unless you drive great distances daily. If that's the  case an EV car is not the right solution for you. Even when I charged  using 110 volt it was done in 10-12 hours. You can even find 480 volt  chargers that charge your car in 30 minutes. If your driving around town  most charging stations are 240 volt and free. If I go shopping I charge  for free and I am able to charge for free close to where I work. Keep  in mind no one is being asked or forced to replace their gas car with an  EV. It just provides another choice in the market. If electric cars get  popular it will make the demand for gas go down and hopefully the  price. Then even if you never buy a EV and still drive a gas car you  benefit from lower gas prices (supply vs demand). I drive 100 miles per day so before the electric car I was paying $380 per month in gas and kept getting slammed with high maintenance costs. Since March when I got the EV my transportation costs have gone to $35 per month (I charge for free at work). And my maintenance costs have been $20 for a cabin filter replacement on my EV. I don't want to breath in unfiltered air from the other cars that are running on gas!

What's the replacement cost on the battery?

[A6000]

In the case of electric drills, it is cheaper to buy a new drill than just a new battery on its own.
It is probably true for many other electrical devices that use non standard rechargeable batteries.

[Terminills]

In the case of electric drills, it is cheaper to buy a new drill than just a new battery on its own.
It is probably true for many other electrical devices that use non standard rechargeable batteries.

lol that was my point.   I know an electric forklift I've seen a new battery cost as much as $7000.

[spirantho]

What's the replacement cost on the battery?

It doesn't work like that - when you buy the car, you rent the batteries, not buy them. So they should get replaced by the manufacturer every few years I believe.

[som99]

Sorry, but as it looks now Electric cars are nothing for me, the only car I could replace with a electric one are a station wagon and as far as I know I haven't seen any station wagon electrics. Also I would be limited by the distance the car can travel on full charge since I dont live in a big city I got quite the distance to drive to get anywhere also I got 270km (167miles) drive to my work so seems none of them can take me to work on full charge and with that drive to work I don't want to have to spend time waiting for it to charge to lenghten the trip further.

Also since I like cars, I want more horse power then the electrics can give and also a part of cars I enjoy is to repair and tinker with the engine etc myself, also how far would the distance be if you constantly drive at around 93mp/h as I do on the freeway?

Would also miss the sound of a petrol engine

Sure a electric car could work for my wife and me for short distance trips to the store etc but that would be a huge cost in buying the car for verry little use :/
Since I have a big workshop garage with 2 lifts and all tools ever needed it would be such a waste to use it only for changing tyres

Edit: Oh a thought what would happen to all car mechanics if electric cars invaded? Demoted to changing tyres? big chunk of unemployed people

[Terminills]

It doesn't work like that - when you buy the car, you rent the batteries, not buy them. So they should get replaced by the manufacturer every few years I believe.

Not quite.  

http://green.autoblog.com/2013/06/20/nissan-leaf-battery-replacement-will-cost-100-month/

So at the expected 4-6 years it takes the battery to fall below the 70% capacity that puts the cost at $4800-$6000.   You can call it rent if you want but end of the day it's still an added cost.

Add that to the increased cost in electricity as the capacity falls.  Plus the decreased distance you can drive per charge.