What's the Deal With CommodoreUSA?

[Iggy]

That's kind of the thing though. Nobody is in a position to provide this on anything other than a hobby level and that doesn't seem to be changing.
 
Morph OS (the one I have the most experience with) is great... if you are coming to it with an Amiga experience in mind. It's hopeless for a mainstream computer user, for a whole host of reasons I won't go into here.

 
I come from a mainstream background and I have no problem with it.

[commodorejohn]

I come from a mainstream background and I have no problem with it.

Seems like most claims of "normal people won't get this" just boil down to "people who are expecting Windows and don't want to hear any different won't get this," in my observation...

[MiAmigo]

This bi-level scheme I propose (currently used by PCs, of course) would serve many purposes:

1. It would allow the new machine (I'm really trying to avoid calling it 'Amiga') to return to the market place, and, more importantly, to a lucrative niche, since buying a 'blank' one would allow the user to do whatever the heck he/she wanted to do with it.

2. This would generate income for...

3. A full return to the sustained development for the platform into the next level of its severely delayed evolution, resuming the same culture of extreme innovation that created it in the first place.

4. The culture can be niche, while the brand could go mainstream. There could be people who buy this thing who honestly never considering doing anything else on it but run Linux (or even Windows), or play old legacy games. This would keep the brand and the name in the market place, and also eventually make it possible...

5. ...for all the innovations in hardware, software, and general use to continue lucratively, and not fall over dead, like all the other attempted reboots. In some crucial way (which I'll save for another thread!) they've all made the same fatal mistakes, one of being forgetting what the Commodore experience was all about in the first place. (The C64 remains the best-selling computer of all time for a reason. If anyone with money who wants to start it up again can't remember why they will surely fail.)

[runequester]

Seems like most claims of "normal people won't get this" just boil down to "people who are expecting Windows and don't want to hear any different won't get this," in my observation...

Colour me jaded, but I have seen tons of people "switch" to OS X or Linux expecting "windows except minus the bad parts" and switched back promptly because of course that was a path for disaster.
Advocates do a tremendously poor job at setting realistic expectations about what you are getting yourself into.
 
I'd not feel very comfortable sending something from windows XP to hunting down MUI classes for a 20 year old email app to work
 
 
 
 
On your previous note, I agree with you that "amiga" in 2012 doesn't have to be a "mainstream" computer thing to be worthwhile. There's a significant faction that feels it should be or can be, and I don't think that's at all plausible given the situation right now. None of the current players have that ability.
 
That's kinda the point I was getting at earlier, and I think I screwed up explaining it.

[Iggy]

Seems like most claims of "normal people won't get this" just boil down to "people who are expecting Windows and don't want to hear any different won't get this," in my observation...

Ah. That makes a lot of sense. I pre-date GUIs so I don't have too many preconceptions.
 
The only Windows feature I really like in MorphOS is the right mouse button click.

[Iggy]

I'd not feel very comfortable sending something from windows XP to hunting down MUI classes for a 20 year old email app to work
 
 

Why would you want to use a 20 year olde-mail app? don't use an e-mail app?
 
Actually, Fab toldme how to get Comcast's e-mail working under OWB, so I don't use an e-mail app.
 
Thanks Fab (you're fab).
 
Most of the rest of the 68K software I use just works.

[runequester]

Why would you want to use a 20 year olde-mail app? don't use an e-mail app?
 
Actually, Fab toldme how to get Comcast's e-mail working under OWB, so I don't use an e-mail app.
 
Thanks Fab (you're fab).
 
Most of the rest of the 68K software I use just works.

Fab is pretty wicked.
 
I happen to really like YAM, so I use it on MOS. My email is a gmail account which works decently (if sometimes a bit quirky) under MOS.

[commodorejohn]

I'd not feel very comfortable sending something from windows XP to hunting down MUI classes for a 20 year old email app to work

That's true enough, though I'dve thought the NG projects would integrate some of that stuff the way ClassicWB does...
 
 

On your previous note, I agree with you that "amiga" in 2012 doesn't have to be a "mainstream" computer thing to be worthwhile. There's a significant faction that feels it should be or can be, and I don't think that's at all plausible given the situation right now. None of the current players have that ability.

Exactly. It seems like a lot of hope and enthusiasm is wasted on pie-in-the-sky dreams of world conquest, which is a shame when there's so much humble but genuinely neat stuff going on right here in the actual real-world present-day Amiga community...

[k4lmp]

That's par for the course.

Linux seems to be the 'fall back' OS for everyone looking for a viable alternative to Windows, and also, a cheap one. (My personal tastes is that Linux only exists as a rebellion to the Windows regime. This in and of itself is not bad, or wrong, but when something is created solely for that type of response to something else, then real innovation suffers, since it doesn't seem to have been the original purpose for creating the thing. So, no, I am not a Linux fan for that reason, and a few others.)

"Different for difference sake" is not as good as "different because this new way is better".

Linux also has gained the somewhat dubious reputation of being the 'fast, easy, and cheap' way to go when you need an OS in your device, and you don't want to pay Billy Gates. That entire philosophy leaves a rather bad taste in my mouth, so its not surprising that CUSA would immediately jump on the bandwagon for their OS, after all. You can download it for free, do bare minimum (to no) tweaking, and voila!

Like many here, I enthusiastically sent them a slew of my best ideas, which were promptly ignored - not so much as an acknowledgement of ever having received anything from me. This small snub (not even an auto-responder?) seems to set the tone for what they want, and what they're after.

We won't have to worry about them much longer. In the immortal words of Bones, "I think he's dead, Jim." just about describes where they'll be this time next year, if not sooner.

You forgot that Linux is much more stable than Windows, and is what most of the servers in the world use everyday.  I work for a telephone company, and we are also an internet company, and do digital video over ethernet via fiber to the home.  This provides a 1 gb connection to each home.  Every server we use (many) runs Linux.  I see how stable it is everyday at work, that is why I run it at home as well.  I am submitting this reply from my Linux PC.  Windows has its place, and I run XP under Virtualbox on my Linux PC.  I like Windows XP, which is why I still use it from time to time.  At one time, I ran W7 and put XP on a VirtualBox machine under W7, and it did nothing but crash.  I am not dissing Windows, like I said, it has its place, but Linux is superior IMHO, which is why most people use it on their servers.  Don't even get me started on W8.  

But, to get back on subject, I have used Commodore OS Vision, under VirtualBox on my machine, and I like it.  I wouldn't buy from them, as they are way overpriced.  You could get a heck of a nice machine for what they are asking for their hardware.  I don't really care for how they are doing things, as I cut my teeth on Commodore hardware years ago.  I have only been using Amigas for around a year or less, simply because I couldn't afford one back in the day.  I was really excited when I heard that Commodore was coming back, but, this is not my Commodore...that company is long gone.  These people have no interest in us, or any of the Commodore/Amiga geeks.  That, I think will be one of their downfalls.

[MiAmigo]

Let's just forget about Linux for the sake of this conversation. I am one of many that feel that the OS actually has no place on a 'real' Amiga-style platform.

A proper reboot and re-introduction of this technology practically DEMANDS its own OS for the flagship machine. (The so-called 'blank' machines of the line, however, can run whatever or nothing, anything from full-blown Windows, to even a 32-64 bit version of DOS).

Let's agree to drag Linux, (its merits and/or lack thereof) out of the conversation simply because its not what most of us want - which is a native Amiga hardware platform (no Intel guts!) running a native Amiga OS.

This is, of course, exactly opposite of what CUSA offers, Intel guts running Linux.

How is that an Amiga? Its not, its an expensive emulator, which, actually, either one of us could build ourselves a whole lot cheaper than what they're asking for. (Again, reference the link from my very first post that started this thread - the Maximum PC article on doing your own pc-in-a-commodore 64 chasis.)

I'll forget everything I currently feel about that venerable OS, and pretend that its the best OS in the world! (That was hard for me!) I would still have to say it has no place on a new Amiga platform.

I refuse to believe that the Human Race can't come up with another third OS solution to compete with Linux and Windows.

[kedawa]

The original OS for the A1000 didn't start out as an OS for Amiga.
I don't see why we should hold anything new to a higher standard.
QNX is perfectly adequate.

[MiAmigo]

The original OS for the A1000 didn't start out as an OS for Amiga.
I don't see why we should hold anything new to a higher standard.
QNX is perfectly adequate.

Wow. I totally and very civilly disagree, for more reason than I can list here! :python:

[commodorejohn]

The original OS for the A1000 didn't start out as an OS for Amiga.

Correct me if I'm wrong, someone, but yes it did. The original version of AmigaDOS was based on TripOS, but the other components (Exec and the other libraries, not to mention Workbench) were developed specifically for the Amiga. Certainly the project as a whole wasn't designed for some other computer and then hacked to support the Amiga because Commodore just happened to need something to run on it.

[ChaosLord]

RJ Mical coded Intuition.library specifically for the Amiga.
Graphics.library was coded specifically for the Amiga.
Diskfont.library was coded specifically for the Amiga.
OFS was coded specifically for the Amiga.
Carl Sassenrath coded Exec.library specifically for the Amiga.

etc. etc. etc. (I leave it to others to type other examples)

[persia]

What needs to be done is to build a new AmigaOS on top of a Linux or BSD foundation à la OS X.

[MiAmigo]

What needs to be done is to build a new AmigaOS on top of a Linux or BSD foundation à la OS X.

For the life of me, I still don't understand why Linux 'needs' to be a part  of the core system at all.