What's the Deal With CommodoreUSA?

[MiAmigo]

It doesn't seem to be going anywhere, but appears to really annoy a lot of classic Amiga and 64 users. Their market presence and advertising are almost non-existent. (But if you've ever visited their website or Facebook page, you'd swear they were BIGGER than Commodore ever was!)

But the reality is, (outside of this forum, in the real world), you've either heard of them, or you have not, and they don't seem to be doing a thing to change that status. (Honestly, the first I ever heard of them I was actually doing a Google search for mini-ITX boards for a cluster project, and for some reason their website popped up as one of the hits.)

So, what's the deal with them? Is it just another quick buck operation, trying to make whatever they can off the brand name?

One other question: We've all seem them come and go, from Escom to CUSA. This begs the question: Why has it been so difficult to do a successful reboot of this enterprise?

Post Scriptum: My attitude towards that thing they make (all of them) is almost the same as my attitude towards emulators, and I'll say no more on that subject!
:angryfire:

[commodorejohn]

They're a fast-buck operation, and the only thing that distinguishes them from any other fast-buck operation is how inept they seem to be at it. They can't design a PC that even sounds convincing on paper (multiple people in the community had to tell them outright they picked an inadequate power supply for their announcement of the "Amiga Mini,") they have absurd delays in shipping that make it clear that Barry doesn't even keep the parts in stock for fear of not getting enough orders to clear it out, and Barry seems to spend far more time fighting with community members than actually conducting business.

The only real question is why they haven't taken the money and run, and I assume that's because they haven't made that much money yet, and are still holding out and hoping that a few more schmucks out of whoever they haven't alienated completely will take the bait. Yeah, good luck with that.

[MiAmigo]

Good points all!

Here's a short-list attempt to answer my own question as to why Amiga/Commodore reboots fail:

1. Don't call it 'Amiga'.

2. Don't call your company 'Commodore'.

3. Don't decide it was the hardware OR the software - it was both. Choosing one over the other leads to more emulators (as if we need more) or travesties where PC guts are summarily shoved into Commodore cases. Neither of these schemes has (or will ever) bring Amiga innovation back to the marketplace.

4. Don't use Intel processors, OR AMD, instead, bring back Motorola (or, really, any new, little known, or innovative CPU manufacturer). Simply because the CPU market is stagnant, and could use more innovation driven by competition. And, of course, when you use Intel/AMD you basically are consigning your creation to the hell of Point Number 3 (see above.)

5. Dont' say 'it' (whatever 'it' is) can't be done. Say 'we haven't figured it out yet, but it can and will be done'. This type of innovation drove the C64  and the Amiga.

6. Screw what the market is doing right now! Even though PCs are extremely advanced, they're little more than appliances, lacking in the 'Fun and Innovation' Department.

7. Reverse emulation, by all means: The best way to get people to buy your new creation is for them to know that they can still run their software/games on it. So, by all means, emulate the hell out of PCs for that type of compatibility, and that's all.

8. Advertise, advertise, advertise!

9. Remember that, above all, the Amiga, and the Commodore 64 before it, were both introduced into a time and marketplace where everybody knew what computers lacked, and yet few seemed to know exactly how to address the problem. Here in the year 2012, the market is much more sophisticated technologically, but still lacking in lots of areas. The bar is certainly higher, but the goal remains the same - blow Wintels out of the technological waters with innovations, advancements and improvements they can't or won't make.

10. Don't call it Amiga or Commodore - these names are doomed to failure!
:hat::hat::hat::hat::hat::hat::hat:

[vox]

Good points all!

Here's a short-list attempt to answer my own question as to why Amiga/Commodore reboots fail:

10. Don't call it Amiga or Commodore - these names are doomed to failure!
:hat::hat::hat::hat::hat::hat::hat:

What is the deal - it can hardly be one.

We tried suggesting the things, but they have their own way.

Now Amiga Mini is dead (just barebone) and yet anything can be it.

http://anticusa.wordpress.com/amiga-mini-is-dead-already-as-well-as-cos-is-non-compatibile-to-many-standard-x64-machines/

[ChuckT]

Back in 1983, Commodore users hated IBM because Commodore put out advertising showing how much the IBM PC Jr cost and how much a Commodore 64 cost.  Commodore was a competitor and set the tone for its users.

Some of the Commodore users never really learned to use a 286 or 386 back then.  I used Dos in College but I wasn't an expert at it.

Since we never learned to use the IBM's Kernal, architecture or assembly language, what makes you think we would drool at Commodore USA putting a PC inside of a Commodore like case?

It is a gimmick and it may appeal to some geeks but then again, I remember when the C-64 was selling for $120 so it is kind of hard to buy an overpriced PC so that Commodore USA can use the name and sell us a case.

The product is not what we want.  We want a successor to the Commodore 64 or 128 which was probably going to be a C-65, run Basic or another language, have Commodore ASCII on the keys, be 80 colums or more, run sprites, have 512K, run at 40 MHZ or more and have new hardware.

If Barry could license the ROMS, license the SID chip, the PLL's, the RAM and use a 65C812S chip, I bet they would be popular.  I bet they could even find a few ex-Commodore engineers to work on it.  It would sell.  It would sell better than the computers they are selling.  I bet they could sell half a million on the first run or more!!!

[Akiko]

Hopefully the end is nigh.

[vox]

Hopefully the end is nigh.

Effectivly they just abuse Linux now.

http://anticusa.wordpress.com/2012/07/14/distrowatch-analysis-vision-is-not-up-to-mint-13-maybe-fusion-will-be/
http://anticusa.wordpress.com/2012/07/02/commodoreos-beta-9-is-mint-that-you-can-download-and-install-free-at-1ghz-pc-1gb/

And how do they respect MINT dem a steal, pirates and lowlifes!

Hi,

They contacted us and we talked about a partnership initially. Then we didn’t hear from them anymore so we assumed they weren’t interested in doing anything with us.

We’re still happy to see our OS used by others and I don’t think there’s any problems in regards to licensing. It’s just a missed opportunity for them and for us to establish what would have been a very good partnership.

Regards,

Clement Lefebvre

——-

There has been much criticism of the company CUSA because of its hype and claims of creating a “new operating system for our computers” and then simply skinning an existing linux distribution. Critics of CUSA and several linux experts have stated that COS development time has been less than 2 weeks time to write some scripts and replace standard mint graphics files with their own

[MiAmigo]

Effectivly they just abuse Linux now.

http://anticusa.wordpress.com/2012/07/14/distrowatch-analysis-vision-is-not-up-to-mint-13-maybe-fusion-will-be/
http://anticusa.wordpress.com/2012/07/02/commodoreos-beta-9-is-mint-that-you-can-download-and-install-free-at-1ghz-pc-1gb/

And how do they respect MINT dem a steal, pirates and lowlifes!



——-

That's par for the course.

Linux seems to be the 'fall back' OS for everyone looking for a viable alternative to Windows, and also, a cheap one. (My personal tastes is that Linux only exists as a rebellion to the Windows regime. This in and of itself is not bad, or wrong, but when something is created solely for that type of response to something else, then real innovation suffers, since it doesn't seem to have been the original purpose for creating the thing. So, no, I am not a Linux fan for that reason, and a few others.)

"Different for difference sake" is not as good as "different because this new way is better".

Linux also has gained the somewhat dubious reputation of being the 'fast, easy, and cheap' way to go when you need an OS in your device, and you don't want to pay Billy Gates. That entire philosophy leaves a rather bad taste in my mouth, so its not surprising that CUSA would immediately jump on the bandwagon for their OS, after all. You can download it for free, do bare minimum (to no) tweaking, and voila!

Like many here, I enthusiastically sent them a slew of my best ideas, which were promptly ignored - not so much as an acknowledgement of ever having received anything from me. This small snub (not even an auto-responder?) seems to set the tone for what they want, and what they're after.

We won't have to worry about them much longer. In the immortal words of Bones, "I think he's dead, Jim." just about describes where they'll be this time next year, if not sooner.

[vox]

That's par for the course.

Like many here, I enthusiastically sent them a slew of my best ideas, which were promptly ignored - not so much as an acknowledgement of ever having received anything from me. This small snub (not even an auto-responder?) seems to set the tone for what they want, and what they're after.

We won't have to worry about them much longer. In the immortal words of Bones, "I think he's dead, Jim." just about describes where they'll be this time next year, if not sooner.

True, they will not be Millionaires unlike Trotters that at least try so hard.

Early back in the days AROS community tried to link up, everyone was entusiastic, their own community tried with forums ... and Nooo ... we just get bunch of insults in Barrons interviews, and the way they wish to go with no reality based PR ...

True example how NOT to conduct bussiness

Even criticism was intended to improve their "services" and "product" but then you face insults on national, religious, health, sexuality and faith grounds.

My example
http://anticusa.wordpress.com/2012/07/03/aussie-get-baron-stylee/

[lsmart]

Arguably CUSA has created a nice case for their C64 look alike. It`s hard to find a comparable box these days.

You can' t blame a company for selling Intel chips in their hardware and Linux is a good choice if you want to add branding on an otherwise free OS. So it all rational choices here.

Let' s not forget that in the world of business today, you don' t have to earn the right to use a name. You just have to pay for it and defend it. There is no real development done by CUSA, but apparently they hired some designers for the cases and don' t be mistaken:
"Skinning" a Linux distro to the extend they where doing requires dedication and a lot of work.

[vox]

Arguably CUSA has created a nice case for their C64 look alike. It`s hard to find a comparable box these days.

You can' t blame a company for selling Intel chips in their hardware and Linux is a good choice if you want to add branding on an otherwise free OS. So it all rational choices here.

"Skinning" a Linux distro to the extend they where doing requires dedication and a lot of work.

a) Yes, they have made ONE case. Nothing more than that.
b) We can blame them for selling them as most expensive (-highest profit margin) with no real commercial software or added value of any kind
c) There is nothing really new in COS that is not part of the MINT, in fact MINT is way more advanced and compatibile now. So its outdated, incompatibile Linux for general Linux use and great fakerism of developing anything

Please provide any arguments that tell the opossite.

[MiAmigo]

Arguably CUSA has created a nice case for their C64 look alike. It`s hard to find a comparable box these days.

You can' t blame a company for selling Intel chips in their hardware and Linux is a good choice if you want to add branding on an otherwise free OS. So it all rational choices here.

Let' s not forget that in the world of business today, you don' t have to earn the right to use a name. You just have to pay for it and defend it. There is no real development done by CUSA, but apparently they hired some designers for the cases and don' t be mistaken:
"Skinning" a Linux distro to the extend they where doing requires dedication and a lot of work.

True, I like the cases, what original C64 user wouldn't? But, truthfully, there are a lot of C64 cases out there, I have a few myself.

And, I don't need to pay XXXX amount of dollars to have somebody else shove PC guts into one, I can do that myself, too. If a person were unsure just how to do this, Maximum PC already told how: (http://www.scribd.com/doc/101965893/Maximum-PC-Magazine-August-2012)

I can and do blame them for using Intel processors. :python:

I'm sure preparing the Linux distro was difficult - as a matter of fact, it was so hard, they seems to have half-a$$ed it, and screwed it all up!

In effect, this thing is something of a monstrosity.

[vox]

True, I like the cases, what original C64 user wouldn't? But, truthfully, there are a lot of C64 cases out there, I have a few myself.
I can and do blame them for using Intel processors. :python:

I'm sure preparing the Linux distro was difficult - as a matter of fact, it was so hard, they seems to have half-a$$ed it, and screwed it all up!

In effect, this thing is something of a monstrosity.

OK if they intended to do it for dummies they should surely charge less, go with Win7 starter and Linux with AmigaForever and AROS (as promised here)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AzsmiuEYUQY

as well as AMD ATI solution would be way greater performant than ATOM and integrated nVIDIA. Same goes for i7.

Again, see AresOne prices and learn
http://www.vesalia.de/e_aresone.htm

There is even less CUSA offers for much more.
Beside engravement.

[commodorejohn]

Arguably CUSA has created a nice case for their C64 look alike. It`s hard to find a comparable box these days.

Yes, the one case. It is indeed quite pretty. However, it's not exactly enough to earn absolution for everything else they've ever done, pretty or no. And anyway everything they've done since has been prefab cases badly emblazoned with rented trademarks.

You can' t blame a company for selling Intel chips in their hardware and Linux is a good choice if you want to add branding on an otherwise free OS. So it all rational choices here.

Rational or no, it still means that they offer exactly nothing not offered by every other PC manufacturer in existence, not to mention having exactly zilch in common with either the C64 or the Amiga.

Let' s not forget that in the world of business today, you don' t have to earn the right to use a name. You just have to pay for it and defend it.

This is correct. However, the mere fact that something is legal does not make it automatically admirable or ethical, and charging massive markup on commodity hardware and free software in an attempt to exploit nostalgia is not something that can be called either admirable or ethical on its own merits.

There is no real development done by CUSA, but apparently they hired some designers for the cases and don' t be mistaken:
"Skinning" a Linux distro to the extend they where doing requires dedication and a lot of work.

No it doesn't.

[haywirepc]

"Skinning" a Linux distro to the extend they where doing requires dedication and a lot of work.

I've been a linux user since 1996...

I disagree. If you really look at what they've done, they've given you some wallpapers, compiz panoramic graphics, made a system sound theme and a few other things.

They have also installed a bunch of things for you from the ubuntu repos.
But thats about it. Thats not development, thats simply customizing it a bit.

Development requires actual work.

Steven