What's the Deal With CommodoreUSA?

[commodorejohn]

On my end, I don't really care what this or that folder is called, what the file system happens to be called or whether the kernel does this or that.
The user interface and experience on the other hand, is what you engage with every moment you use the machine.

I suppose this is a matter of perspective - if you think BSD with an Apple-designed desktop environment is essentially the same as classic Mac OS, I suppose a similar approach for the Amiga would make sense. The way I see it, though, there's already very little variety in operating systems - there doesn't need to be less, and certainly not by ditching the fundamentals of a perfectly decent existing OS.

As far as amiga applications, port or emulate. Not really different from the OS4 people. Or build in some sort of compatibility layer like the Mac people did with their switch to Intel. Who knows?

Porting isn't that simple, though. Software can be ported between NG Amiga projects fairly easily because they're all based on the same API. Porting to/from a completely different OS like Linux requires quite a bit more work for the same result. A compatibility layer would be peachy, but doing one on Linux would mean reimplementing the whole AmigaOS API anyway.

[runequester]

I suppose this is a matter of perspective - if you think BSD with an Apple-designed desktop environment is essentially the same as classic Mac OS, I suppose a similar approach for the Amiga would make sense. The way I see it, though, there's already very little variety in operating systems - there doesn't need to be less, and certainly not by ditching the fundamentals of a perfectly decent existing OS.

I agree that more homogeneity (Im pretty sure I spelled that wrong) isn't desirable. The problem is that nothing is moving anywhere. AROS is the furthest ahead and only supports a tiny portion of aging hardware.

If the key to getting /anything/ happening, is to switch to where there's a path ahead, then I think that's the better option today.

Porting isn't that simple, though. Software can be ported between NG Amiga projects fairly easily because they're all based on the same API. Porting to/from a completely different OS like Linux requires quite a bit more work for the same result. A compatibility layer would be peachy, but doing one on Linux would mean reimplementing the whole AmigaOS API anyway.

It might be a ton of work for little gain, compared to simply having a relatively seamless emulation, I suppose.

[vox]

Ive said before and people got mad, but a linux /base/ for an Amiga os is the only sane option left.

You have access to extremely wide base of hardware, with drivers available, you have access into modern applications etc.
Develop a desktop environment that genuinely feels and functions like a fully featured amiga environment and go from there. Heck, amithlon proved what could have been.

Yeah, it wont satisfy the purists but neither does anything else. So **** 'em.

It doesnt have to change AmigaOS completely. Some easier porting and components are avail. A better support of PPC Linuxes for Peg2, Efika, AmigaOne, SAMS and X1000 is needed. Dual boot is OK.Some Linux virtual machine for DEB Linux PPC would be nice.

[kedawa]

If I had the money to set up a small computer business, I'd buy the same cases and peripherals that CUSA uses and resell them at far lower prices under the brand name Commode.
I'd offer a choice of OS including AROS, PC Linux OS, PC-BSD, Windows, and maybe Haiku.
I can't imagine it would be any less successful than CUSA.

[commodorejohn]

If I had the money to set up a small computer business, I'd buy the same cases and peripherals that CUSA uses and resell them at far lower prices under the brand name Commode.
I'd offer a choice of OS including AROS, PC Linux OS, PC-BSD, Windows, and maybe Haiku.
I can't imagine it would be any less successful than CUSA.

Do you have someone you can hire to verbally abuse any parties that might otherwise be interested in your products?

[runequester]

It seems appropriate to repost something I posted a long time ago, when CUSA showed up first. (based on my old PC )


I am now offering a unique offer: The Amitendo64 for only 400 dollars!


Since there have been much talk and fuss about various competing retro computer brands lately, I thought I'd point out the various ways the amitendo64 is superior.


1: Hardware
No atom processors here. You get a good, old fashioned 2.4 ghz dual core, with 4 gigs of RAM.
We even toss in an optical drive, and a mouse!

2: Software
While the competition expects you to install linux yourself, the amitendo64 has it included already!

3: Run all the awesome games
Our competition only includes emulation of commodore machines. We boldly include Nintendo as well. So even if you grew up outside europe, you can still play games from when you were a kid

4: No dubious license questions
Many people feel concerned that competing retro computer offers may take advantage of licenses that have a complicated history. No worries! The Amitendo64 has NO licenses with anybody so you don't have to feel bad about anything!

5: Support of a trusted player in the commodore market
The amitendo64 comes with a full 20 year warranty. Just drive to the Commodore Amiga Iran office and we'll give you a full refund.

6: Doesn't look too new
Many people feel that the competing offers are too shiny, and don't "feel retro".
To insure against this, the amitendo64 is pretty dusty. We even made sure the fan is kind of grimey, so you'll have an authentic experience!

7: More advanced software.
Our unique brand of operating software (codenamed Kubuntu) is actually workbench 5.01 making it far superior than the unreleased alternatives from competing brands!

8: No pre orders
We will ship the amitendo64 to its eager recipient immediately upon payment.

9: Branding
Since we know branding is very important to people, the case will have "COMMODORE AMIGA IRAN" scrawled with a sharpie. No impersonal stickers here!

For mass orders (more than one), there is a 20 minute delay, as that's long it takes me to run over to best buy to restock.

[desiv]

Heck, amithlon proved what could have been.

Yeah, I've always thought that if I win the lottery (means I have to start playing tho..), I'd be sorely tempted to buy what I needed to and revive Amithlon.
Not because I would expect it to make any money, but just because.. ;-)

Can you imagine a "new" CommodoreUSA (assuming I bought them too; I'm planning on a Powerball huge win for this!!) selling machines in cases that actually looked like Amigas (and I mean LIKE them, not "kind of resembling" them) with a decent motherboard and a fully supported Amithlon OS?

I still think it would lose money, but what a way to lose money!!!!!  ;-)

desiv

[Iggy]

I haven't seen good graphics on the Prop without a CPLD and then it pales in comparison.
 

From one Prop developer board:
"VGA support, build time option for 64 color Parallax compatible mode or extended 256 color mode
working 1024×768 4 color driver, I am adding individual palette entries for each scan line
COMING SOON: 256×192 256 color per pixel gaming mode (expected in 1-2 weeks)
Sprites will be added after initial gaming driver release - 16×16 pixels, 256 color palette"
 
Remember - This is an $8 chip.
 
Then there's this:
http://obex.parallax.com/objects/177/
 
A 1600x1200 VGA tile driver (only uses six out of eight cogs).
 
So, what resolution can you get with Xmos?
 
I left the ARM comparisons out because that an apple and oranges situation unless you want to discuss something like the M4 (which I'm will to discuss as I have one on order).
 
What bug got up your ass?
Two Props could generate VGA, emulate dual SIDs, interface a PS2 keyboard and mouse, generate other I/O and still have the ability to run code.
 
Yeah, I can get an ARM board that will do more then that, but not one based on about $30 worth of components.

[Duce]

We're still talking about C-USA?

Man, they shot their wad years ago.  Picking nits with C-USA is like beating a cripple.

No press is good press with these vultures - though I did enjoy the death threats I got from them when I "spoke out" about them.

Very Scientology-like, for a Computer Industry Powerhouse (running out of a strip mall, sharing a phone number with a furniture company and massage parlor or something), I must say though.

[Digiman]

Ive said before and people got mad, but a linux /base/ for an Amiga os is the only sane option left.

You have access to extremely wide base of hardware, with drivers available, you have access into modern applications etc.
Develop a desktop environment that genuinely feels and functions like a fully featured amiga environment and go from there. Heck, amithlon proved what could have been.

Yeah, it wont satisfy the purists but neither does anything else. So fuk 'em.

I have to disagree here because i7 is the tip of the smelly dog poo that is humans have run out of talent to make truly faster processors and all we're going to get is more cores on a chip. Linux will soon be left behind as benchmarks with Win 8 beta on the latest 8 core AMD CPUs shows.

There is no solution because nobody has the money to throw down the drain that is making a bespoke ground up x86 Amiga OS. The hardware and the OS have to be designed hand in hand and by the same company. This is never going to happen so no point getting angry, that's just how it turned out. The two most pathetic machines out of 6 incompatible architectures won out, and Apple is only here today due to sales of iBollox otherwise they would have folded by 2000

[MiAmigo]

The last thing the next gen of Amiga computers needs is a hand-me-down OS like Linux. It also could do without hand-me-down hardware. All innovative and new, from the motherboard up! THAT'S the only way to go.

As far as OSes go, Linux is quite possibly the first (or the last?) refuge of the lazy and unimaginative.

[haywirepc]

"As far as OSes go, Linux is quite possibly the first (or the last?) refuge of the lazy and unimaginative."

I don't know man, you have like a bunch of different guis/themes and window managers to choose from, you can run amiga,atari-st, c64,dos, most windows, and linux programs pretty seamlessly with some tweaking....

The ability to run software from a bunch of different systems is nice, and integrating those apps to run point and click with launchers is a nice experience, makes I suppose, the os the program was written for irrevelant,
just point, click, enjoy. It runs everything...

Also, it runs on almost all hardware... Thats nice!

Its only an os for the lazy if you install it as is, you can tweak everything to your liking, (look, feel interface, behavior)

Unimaginative? I've seen some incredibly imaginative linux rigs...

Steven

[MiAmigo]

I was just thinking that, actually, the system could have a core OS (or really, none at all), allowing the customer to decide what he/she/it wanted to run. That's one possible solution - quite possibly, the best one of all, even if I do say so myself, and I do!

[CritAnime]

Unimaginative? I've seen some incredibly imaginative linux rigs...

I agree. Linux can be very interesting if you go beyond the base installs. However I wouldn't call COS Vision and Fusion, they are two competing distros that they are "working" on, imaginative.

I was just thinking that, actually, the system could have a core OS (or really, none at all), allowing the customer to decide what he/she/it wanted to run. That's one possible solution - quite possibly, the best one of all, even if I do say so myself, and I do!

Been bog standard PC's you can run pretty much any OS you wish on there for x86/64 architecture. They even admitted that they couldn't give a rats fuzzy backside about what goes on them once they leave the "factory" and into someone's home.

CUSA are just like your local hardware shop. Except your local hardware store has more choice and doesn't have a brand license to rip you off.

Also, just for the hell of it, someone did post on their forums a better build they did for the "amiga" mini resolving heat issues that CUSA would have run into.

https://docs.google.com/open?id=0B5R...lJ0YnJYS1laNTg

It's MHT format so you may need a plugin for your browser.

[ChuckT]

Iggy,

This is great but it goes against my methodology.  How much memory does a cog hold?  I don't want my computer have to act like a Gamecube where the disk is constantly spinning to feed the processor.  I want all the major memory on the chip.  These drivers are great but how much memory are you left over with?

I'm not planning on using the Xmos chip.  I looked into it though.

I'm also not planning on using the ARM Cortex chip for video.  The ARM Cortex is a chip by chip designers who did real CPU work.  There are other video engines for that.

Suppose I want the prop to drive an LCD.  You have to transfer 40K:

http://dangerousprototypes.com/2012/09/06/new-prototype-usb-1-8-tft-backpack/

How much memory is left over?  That is why ARM looks a lot better in my book.

I would rather use a video engine like the Gameduino:

256 Sprites
512 Colors
12-bit frequency synthesizer

I suppose you could put it on a bigger FPGA and do more stuff.

http://excamera.com/sphinx/gameduino/

I don't want the memory of a Vic-20 or a C-64.  I want more memory which is why ARM looks better and I have some help on the internet.  When you hook the Prop up to a Nokia or Iphone LCD, I would love to see that.

Chuck

From one Prop developer board:
"VGA support, build time option for 64 color Parallax compatible mode or extended 256 color mode
working 1024×768 4 color driver, I am adding individual palette entries for each scan line
COMING SOON: 256×192 256 color per pixel gaming mode (expected in 1-2 weeks)
Sprites will be added after initial gaming driver release - 16×16 pixels, 256 color palette"
 
Remember - This is an $8 chip.
 
Then there's this:
http://obex.parallax.com/objects/177/
 
A 1600x1200 VGA tile driver (only uses six out of eight cogs).
 
So, what resolution can you get with Xmos?
 
I left the ARM comparisons out because that an apple and oranges situation unless you want to discuss something like the M4 (which I'm will to discuss as I have one on order).
 
What bug got up your ass?
Two Props could generate VGA, emulate dual SIDs, interface a PS2 keyboard and mouse, generate other I/O and still have the ability to run code.
 
Yeah, I can get an ARM board that will do more then that, but not one based on about $30 worth of components.

[Iggy]

Hi Chuck,
The Prop is very limited when it comes to built in memory.
But I' ve seen it connected to 512K of external memory, SD cards, etc.
 
And it can be connected to more.
 
ARM does look more difficult to work with.
 
The Prop comes in a 40 pin DIP package making it easy to mount.
 
And there are existing code examples, including LCD drivers.
 
Of course, there are other choices as well. There are plenty of MCUs other then ARM. Even Coldfire based products.