Jens Shoenfeld's anwer to the Apollo petition

[runequester]

Actually, the '030 is a shrinked '020 with a (slightly simplified) MMU plus a tiny data cache. Not much of a source for incompatibilities unless you forcefully create one.

Gotcha. When I got my first 030/25 card, forget the manufacturer, I saw some very slight issues, so I figured there were some loss of compatibility

[paul1981]

I have an ACA card and the total number of games i have found incompatible on my 1200 2b are zero.
 
And i wouldn't touch an apollo card with a bargepole (I have a blizzard though)

What, not even the 100MHz Apollo1260 card which Cosmos has running perfectly stable?
http://www.leblogdecosmos.blogspot.co.uk/2011/09/68060100.html

I can think of a few games that aren't ACA compatible.... AB3D2TKG, Quake, Payback, Gloom Deluxe, Genetic Species, Doom, Breathless, TFX, Freespace and many more....

Sorry, did I say compatibe? I meant usable.

At the end of the day some Amiga owners demand real power, and that's where 040/060 Apollo and Blizzard's come into play. More so the Apollo because I believe that there are a lot more of those cards around (for better or for worse). Apollo's are also faster than Blizzard's. People can only work with what they have available to them.

[darkage]

@Amidudue + rewlako.. Ok I think this bickering has to stop.

We all know theres lots of variables at play here,  motherboard revisions, different harddrive/cf setups, different expansions PCMCIA, Clockport addons, scsi kits, different kickstarts, different OS versions & patches etc...  

Of course theres gunna be hicups here and there with so many variables.   Everything relies on tight timings etc.  

Bottom line if ACA doesnt work as good as you think it should, just sell it get an Apollo or Blizzard.   Just try a few accelerator cards and see what works best for you.

Dont think we can come to any conclusion to arguments unless strict quality testing was conducted in an controlled environment, so might as was have a BBQ get some ppl over with their A1200's and test away (:

[magnetic]

And i wouldn't touch an apollo card with a bargepole (I have a blizzard though)

Why do you say this? Have you ever even owned an Apollo board or are you just formulating an opinion from reading forums?

[Cosmos Amiga]

What, not even the 100MHz Apollo1260 card which Cosmos has running perfectly stable?
http://www.leblogdecosmos.blogspot.co.uk/2011/09/68060100.html

I can think of a few games that aren't ACA compatible.... AB3D2TKG, Quake, Payback, Gloom Deluxe, Genetic Species, Doom, Breathless, TFX, Freespace and many more....

Sorry, did I say compatibe? I meant usable.

At the end of the day some Amiga owners demand real power, and that's where 040/060 Apollo and Blizzard's come into play. More so the Apollo because I believe that there are a lot more of those cards around (for better or for worse). Apollo's are also faster than Blizzard's. People can only work with what they have available to them.

My Apollo is still running perfect at 105 Mhz now.

The only Apollo who is a bit unstable is the A630@50 (and I think I found the reason why).

[Methuselas]

[darkage]

The only Apollo who is a bit unstable is the A630@50 (and I think I found the reason why).

Whats your reason?  Just interested to hear.

[Snoozy]

What, not even the 100MHz Apollo1260 card which Cosmos has running perfectly stable?
http://www.leblogdecosmos.blogspot.co.uk/2011/09/68060100.html

I can think of a few games that aren't ACA compatible.... AB3D2TKG, Quake, Payback, Gloom Deluxe, Genetic Species, Doom, Breathless, TFX, Freespace and many more....

Sorry, did I say compatibe? I meant usable.

At the end of the day some Amiga owners demand real power, and that's where 040/060 Apollo and Blizzard's come into play. More so the Apollo because I believe that there are a lot more of those cards around (for better or for worse). Apollo's are also faster than Blizzard's. People can only work with what they have available to them.

The games you have mentioned there are irrelevant to aca cards - they were never designed to run those games and all of such games are better played on a proper retro pc where they were primarily developed. What's the point of scraping by on an (overheating) apollo card which is about to give up its magic smoke.

Also Apollo cards are usually the cheapest of all -£ for hz - (and lose more % value  more than any other card)

Purchasing (or defending) apollo cards is pretty much a lost cause and my support is to ACA and Jens

[rewlako]

I've give you an explanation about some "older" games that refuses to work with the ACA accelerator. They just don't start or freezing while playing the game. This doesn't occur with my Blizzard or Apollo accelerators. Don't need further explanation.

But how do you know this is related to the SDRAM and not some other incompability?

So, I DO know what I'm talking about, and you're obviously NOT, since you don't even own an ACA. Don't make me laugh! You just come and barg in here, screaming and yelling. about stuff you don't even have experience with.

Look, I never claimed to have experience with the ACA.  If you read my posts again, all I'm wanted you to do was to back up your claims.  Maybe not in that exact tone, but the essence is the same.

Now, move along and go somewhere else trolling!

Calm down, I'm not trolling.  Breathe in, breathe out and read all my posts again.  I never attacked you, I never made any false claims, I never accused you of anything but talking out of your own incompetence.

I have not really seen any evidence that you know what you're talking about, except for arguments like "there's this game that doesn't work", and "some others have had problems".

As I said in my previous post, we're not getting anywhere with this, I'm done here.

[rewlako]

We all know theres lots of variables at play here,  motherboard revisions, different harddrive/cf setups, different expansions PCMCIA, Clockport addons, scsi kits, different kickstarts, different OS versions & patches etc...  

Of course it is.  Amiga is an unstable platform.

Of course theres gunna be hicups here and there with so many variables.   Everything relies on tight timings etc.

Obviously.  But, when people throw out accusations like "Oh, that's because of the SDRAM" and at the same time don't know why SDRAM was used, I feel like racking him a bit for it to see if there's some ground to his claims or not.

Dont think we can come to any conclusion to arguments unless strict quality testing was conducted in an controlled environment, so might as was have a BBQ get some ppl over with their A1200's and test away (:

All I asked for was a few real-life examples, which he never provided.  Don't worry, I got the confirmation I wanted and will leave this thread dead now.

[Damion]

Snoozy's ACA is great for playing Superfrog, but the hard fact is that for running some of the big AGA demos on an A1200, I can say from experience that nothing is better than a properly tweaked Apollo 1260.

Blizzard: Best "all-rounder", best software (BlizKick), but neutered chipset access disappoints
Apollo: Best for demos, more work to setup

Now if Jens makes a better '060 card one of these days, I'd buy it in a heartbeat. :-)

[Snoozy]

Snoozy's ACA is great for playing Superfrog, but the hard fact is that for running some of the big AGA demos on an A1200, I can say from experience that nothing is better than a properly tweaked Apollo 1260.
 
Blizzard: Best "all-rounder", best software (BlizKick), but neutered chipset access disappoints
Apollo: Best for demos, more work to setup
 
Now if Jens makes a better '060 card one of these days, I'd buy it in a heartbeat. :-)

Lets be clear about this: the ACA cards will run almost all normal 500 and 1200 software without a problem. There will not be intermittent crashes (apollo) or small fans squashed in to cool down the cheap components (apollo). I have no interest in some random demo's and gloom.
 
As Individual Computers have implied the best outcome for apollo's is to remove the 680x0 chip and put the rest of it in the bin :roflmao:

[magnetic]

Now if Jens makes a better '060 card one of these days, I'd buy it in a heartbeat. :-)

We all wish that, unfortunately never going to happen..

As Individual Computers have implied the best outcome for apollo's is to remove the 680x0 chip and put the rest of it in the bin  

And I ask again have you ever run an Apollo board? To say to throw it in the bin is absolute rubbish (pun intended)

[Snoozy]

We all wish that, unfortunately never going to happen..
 
 
 
And I ask again have you ever run an Apollo board? To say to throw it in the bin is absolute rubbish (pun intended)

Ok i have never driven a hyundai/kia or skoda - but i know i don't want one. So no i have never had an apollo and i know i don't want one to upset my 1200.
 
And No you would take the 680x0 chip off first and then put it in the bin

[utri007]

Apollo boards are ok, I've had one years 10? It very stable without any other expanions and very very fast.

Compared to BLizzard it seems so much faster with WB, because it nonstandard chipram access, that I started to think that there is something wrong with my blizzard.

I works with zorro extenders but not that well as a blizzard.

It is also really picky with motherboard revisions, with timing fixes all problems are gone.

[AmiDude]

As I said in my previous post, we're not getting anywhere with this, I'm done here.

Great! Bye bye! :quickdraw: