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Author Topic: So where did the PPC amiga thing come from?  (Read 15756 times)

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Offline _ThEcRoW

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Re: So where did the PPC amiga thing come from?
« Reply #14 on: April 14, 2011, 02:45:21 PM »
Quote from: utri007;631596
I've two PPC computers, first on cost me about 250? 3 years ago, it has only 160gb hd and ram is limited to 256, second is better it has 384 ram and 500gb hd, price was 120?

Both have usb/lan, first one has d-sub, second have DVI and wlan

OS used is linux, you can buy one from every home electronic store.



What are these computers?
Amiga 1200 desktop. Apollo 030/50 Mhz 8mb ram + ClassicWB + Wb 3.1
Amiga 500 + ACA500Plus + 16gb CF | ECS Power!!!
C64 DTV + Keyboard mod. Waiting for a 1541 disk ve...
Mac Mini G4 1.42Ghz 1gb OSX(tiger)/Morphos 3.7 Registered
C64mini + usb drive with loads of games...
 

Offline jorkany

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Re: So where did the PPC amiga thing come from?
« Reply #15 on: April 14, 2011, 02:54:57 PM »
Quote from: utri007;631596
I've two PPC computers, first on cost me about 250€ 3 years ago, it has only 160gb hd and ram is limited to 256, second is better it has 384 ram and 500gb hd, price was 120€

Both have usb/lan, first one has d-sub, second have DVI and wlan

OS used is linux, you can buy one from every home electronic store.


I have a riding lawnmower I got at the hardware store. I've fitted it with taillights and a top, so now it's a car.
 

Offline ognix

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Re: So where did the PPC amiga thing come from?
« Reply #16 on: April 14, 2011, 04:58:05 PM »
Quote from: dammy;631602
So they are the ones to blame for it. :(


...because Phase 5 done some PPC accelerators for A4000 and A1200, and people started the MorphOS project on them.

But at that time, thinking to go elsewhere (X86?) would raise very strong angst (just imagine! :-O )

BY!
 

Offline zylesea

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Re: So where did the PPC amiga thing come from?
« Reply #17 on: April 14, 2011, 05:44:00 PM »
Back in the days the decision to go ppc was quite good. ppc was pretty much on par with x86 then, if not leading. Also the cpus were smaller and less energy hungry - important for A1200 expansion boards.
That ppc eventually more or less failed in desktop land was rather bad luck.

Offline dammy

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Re: So where did the PPC amiga thing come from?
« Reply #18 on: April 14, 2011, 06:04:45 PM »
Quote from: ognix;631620
...because Phase 5 done some PPC accelerators for A4000 and A1200, and people started the MorphOS project on them.

But at that time, thinking to go elsewhere (X86?) would raise very strong angst (just imagine! :-O )

BY!


1995 is when AROS was started so there was already a start for x86 Amiga-like OS the same time the ill fated PPC was announced by AT/EScom.  Then AI announced the next generation Amiga OS, DE, would be primarily targeting x86 and even had a low end K6-2 Dev machine being sold.
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Offline commodorejohn

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Re: So where did the PPC amiga thing come from?
« Reply #19 on: April 14, 2011, 06:15:09 PM »
I'm going to invent a time machine, go back to 1985, and port the Amiga OS to the PDP-11 or something, just to pre-empt this bickering about which non-68k processor the Amiga was on first and is therefore totally the real New Amiga.
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Offline Karlos

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Re: So where did the PPC amiga thing come from?
« Reply #20 on: April 14, 2011, 08:21:25 PM »
Quote from: bloodline;631571
Hmmm, even then I think we were still very 68060 oriented... No one really took the PPC seriously as an Amiga CPU solution until Phase5 (who built Mac CPU cards) suggested it... And then did it :)

Allow me to elaborate.

Back in the day, we were all hailing the 68060 as the holy grail, but let's not forget that it actually arrived late and with lower performance compared to the Pentium (particularly in floating point terms). It was clear to everybody back then that the 68K was falling behind. When apple introduced the first PowerMacs, people started talking about the possibility of making the same jump (the PA RISC idea pretty much died with Commodore). Amongst those people were Phase5.

The PowerPC was seen as an obvious choice back then as RISC was still seen as the future (which indeed it was, but just not in the way it was envisaged), it shared the same native endian representation as 68K, supported the same basic datatypes (except for long double). The x86 was still looked down upon (IMNSHO deservedly so as wasn't until the Pentium Pro that the architecture became any good) and was seen as too slow by most people in the day to provide any realistic emulation potential. Remember, JIT emulation of 68K didn't have an obvious precedent (I think even Apple's first 68K emulation for PPC was interpretive) and so things like register count mattered. You could statically map the entire 68K usermode registers into PPC and a well written assembler interpreter could fit the most common handlers into cache.

Not long later, Phase5 announced their intentions to produce a PowerPC accelerator for Amiga. Back then, the talk was of 68030 + 603e. The rest is history.
int p; // A
 

Offline Zac67

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Re: So where did the PPC amiga thing come from?
« Reply #21 on: April 14, 2011, 08:44:08 PM »
Motorola offered a compatibility library to assist migration to PPC (essentially emulate 68k) to make the move more 'natural' which probably is why Apple chose that path. RISC was en vogue and most ppl wouldn't have bet for x86 to have a future at all. Endianess definitely was an issue that ruled out x86, too. Additionally Intel architecture was closely associated with ISA, singletasking and DOS and nobody really wanted that.

Those were the days when computers hadn't really arrived in mainstream yet and many medium-sized companies could afford developing CPUs. Then the internet hype began, manufacturing volumes and thus development budgets skyrocketed and most were lost on the way. It's an irony of of history that the architecture that seemed least fit sank all others. Today it's just an abstraction layer to an underlying - RISC architecture.
 

Offline rockape

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Re: So where did the PPC amiga thing come from?
« Reply #22 on: April 14, 2011, 08:45:46 PM »
Hi,

See   http://www.bboah.com/index.php?action=artikel&cat=9&id=1960&artlang=en

"Met@box: AmiJoe 1200"

"This was the promised competitor to the PhaseIV PPC accelerators promising vast performance increases via the use of the PowerPC processor, providing that applications were written for it.

It is not certain whether this card was intended to be compatible with existing PowerUp or WarpUp software, but it's likely it would have been.

Unfortunately, the card was never released although prototypes were built."


I remember seeing an advert in one of the Amiga Magazines around the mid 1990`s for this accelerator.


Regards, Michael

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Offline Borut

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Re: So where did the PPC amiga thing come from?
« Reply #23 on: April 14, 2011, 09:03:54 PM »
Quote from: rockape;631637
Hi,

See   http://www.bboah.com/index.php?action=artikel&cat=9&id=1960&artlang=en

"Met@box: AmiJoe 1200"

"This was the promised competitor to the PhaseIV PPC accelerators promising vast performance increases via the use of the PowerPC processor, providing that applications were written for it.

It is not certain whether this card was intended to be compatible with existing PowerUp or WarpUp software, but it's likely it would have been.

Unfortunately, the card was never released although prototypes were built."


I remember seeing an advert in one of the Amiga Magazines around the mid 1990`s for this accelerator.


Regards, Michael

aka rockape


That was after the demise of Phase5.
 

Offline pwermonger

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Re: So where did the PPC amiga thing come from?
« Reply #24 on: April 14, 2011, 10:16:28 PM »
Quote from: actung_bab;631583
Phase 5 started the first advertsiing of the power ppc design for the amiga 400 and 1200
I think was talk for the 2000 but never happened


I believe there was an addon to one of the 2000 accelerators (060?) that was used by Phase 5 as an early develpment system. If you search around you can find pictures of one setup and running. But yes, a PPC for the 2000 was never sold as a consumer product.
 

Offline Lando

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Re: So where did the PPC amiga thing come from?
« Reply #25 on: April 15, 2011, 12:57:10 AM »
Quote from: pwermonger;631656
I believe there was an addon to one of the 2000 accelerators (060?) that was used by Phase 5 as an early develpment system. If you search around you can find pictures of one setup and running. But yes, a PPC for the 2000 was never sold as a consumer product.


There is a video of the board in an A2000 on youtube.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=foWfXhmi1wY

It was an addon board for the Blizzard 2060.
 

Offline Iggy

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Re: So where did the PPC amiga thing come from?
« Reply #26 on: April 15, 2011, 01:57:49 AM »
Quote from: Cool_amigaN;631582
And you feel proud for this?

;)

I certainly do. By the time that a move to PPC was considered the 68K was a dead issue. X86 was still pretty primitive and thank god the didn't go to PA RISC.

Even now, PPC is capable of producing competitive, competent performance.
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Offline Karlos

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Re: So where did the PPC amiga thing come from?
« Reply #27 on: April 15, 2011, 07:34:11 AM »
Quote from: Iggy;631695
Even now, PPC is capable of producing competitive, competent performance.


Competitive against what? Don't get me wrong, I like the PPC architecture but it's not competitive outside of a few niche (mostly embedded) markets. In the desktop market, there is no PPC processor that isn't totally smoked by an x86 part available less.
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Offline bloodline

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Re: So where did the PPC amiga thing come from?
« Reply #28 on: April 15, 2011, 07:56:41 AM »
Quote from: Karlos;631753
Competitive against what? Don't get me wrong, I like the PPC architecture but it's not competitive outside of a few niche (mostly embedded) markets. In the desktop market, there is no PPC processor that isn't totally smoked by an x86 part available less.
I would compound Karlos' comment, and say that I can't think of a single Market where I would choose a PPC over an ARM or an x86... Unless I was working with IBM who don't have a licence or the latest versions of those architectures ;)

Offline runequesterTopic starter

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Re: So where did the PPC amiga thing come from?
« Reply #29 from previous page: April 15, 2011, 07:59:56 AM »
Im guessing he's referring to the PPC stuff thats already out there.
My wife's laptop runs a G4 and still works perfectly fine for the stuff she uses it for.