Amount of MorphOS copies sold

[itix]

1. Less than half of all MorphOS users are regular forum users.
2. MorphOS doesn't have double the number of users after all.

I hope this makes sense.

Both 1 and 2 are true.

In fact I know certain user on #amigaworld who is using MorphOS only since he sold all his OS4 machines. However he only posts about OS4, posts OS4 videos, promotes OS4 on every chance. He never asks anything about MorphOS nor posts about it.

[takemehomegrandma]

@TMHG

what on earth is with your obsession with OS4?

What do you mean?

Someone bumps up a one year old thread, that was about *MorphOS* user numbers (we *are* allowed to discuss MorphOS user numbers, right, or is that "negativity" in some weird OS4-way?), then HenryCase tries to make a case on how it's very unlikely that MorphOS can have more users than OS4 (mostly based on his personal Amigaworld.net/MorphZone.org experience as it turned out), and I pointed out how it very much *can* be so, based on recent statistics, while repeatedly stating that it in no way could be considered as facts.

And here you come, proclaiming me guilty of the crime of... well, I don't know, but you obviously do...

you and folks like you are a big reason morphOS turns me off. seriously.

Well, Sir, I am very sorry I don't please you, I apologize so very much. *A whole bunch* of people among the OS4 crowd (includins ssolie, the friedens, etc, heck, probably a majority of the OS4 people posting at amigans.net) are guilty of pissing off a lot of people as well. The AROS crowd are close to none-existent, but I'm sure more than one has been in disagreement with Dammy over the years. What you think of people is highly subjective. You obviously gets pissed off by whoever claims that MorphOS *could* have more users, but not by anyone claiming *OS4* could have more users. I'm not the one claiming that user numbers matters the slightest anyway, they are much too low all over anyway, and I don't care, I'm not the one with an obsession here. But it's interesting to note that if someone claiming that there could be measurable signs that MorphOS might actually be the more popular of the two, they have "an OS4 obsession", but when someone claims the opposite, it's just fine and dandy. And I'll tell you what, if you base your choice of Amiga OS upon these kind of things instead of their actual technical merits and stuff like that, then it's really *your* problem.

[HenryCase]

Both 1 and 2 are true.

What I was really saying before is that at least one of those two statements was true, which doesn't exclude the possibility that they're both true.

In fact I know certain user on #amigaworld who is using MorphOS only since he sold all his OS4 machines. However he only posts about OS4, posts OS4 videos, promotes OS4 on every chance. He never asks anything about MorphOS nor posts about it.

I find that interesting, and wonder why someone would do that, I can only guess such behaviour is rare.

[HenryCase]

I pointed out how it very much *can* be so, based on recent statistics, while repeatedly stating that it in no way could be considered as facts.

This is the crux of the problem. Using a phrase Carl Sagan helped popularise; "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence". The general opinion regarding numbers of OS4 and MorphOS users is that they are roughly equal. If you make a claim which greatly contradicts the generally held view, there better be some substance behind your claims as you can expect people to question them. Making bold statements, then saying they're not based on facts, does not cut it.

Hope you understand why I got annoyed at you now. Can we please move on and talk about how to grow our platforms? I would like to see MorphOS get more users, there's really no need to have an aggressive stance against each other here. The true answer about how many MorphOS users there are is 'not enough', or at least not enough for long term growth. Let's work on fixing that.

[takemehomegrandma]

But I wouldnt claim MorphOS has more users than AROS and SO4 in total. It is completely wrong and also irrelevant when number of users is counted in hundreds.

It's also irrelevant because of the sliding definition of "users". I downloaded AmiKit a few weeks ago. I have booted it up a couple of times, and I even provided some bug reports that led to a new release. I still have it on my computer. Am I a user?

I haven't booted up my Pegasos 2 for three years, but I have it here with MorphOS installed. Am I a Pegasos 2 user? And similar - people having AmigaOne XE's collecting dust besides their PC's, not having used it forever, but actively participating in OS4 discussions on Amigaworld.net using Google Chrome on the Windows 7 box, are they OS4 users?

However, paying €111 in order to obtain a key file, *is* actually a sign of commitment far higher than casually installing AmiKit on a Wintel 7 box, or curiously looking up how far Icaros 1.4 has developed since version 1.3, and there are actual numbers to be read here, the only question is how to interpret them (if you should divide by 2 or something else). And I still actually *do* believe that close to 100% of all active OS4 users have downloaded Timberwolf at least once (probably 2-3 times per average users, due to multiple systems and re-installations).

[eliyahu]

What do you mean?

Someone bumps up a one year old thread, that was about *MorphOS* user numbers (we *are* allowed to discuss MorphOS user numbers, right, or is that "negativity" in some weird OS4-way?), then HenryCase tries to make a case on how it's very unlikely that MorphOS can have more users than OS4 (mostly based on his personal Amigaworld.net/MorphZone.org experience as it turned out), and I pointed out how it very much *can* be so, based on recent statistics, while repeatedly stating that it in no way could be considered as facts.

of course you're welcome to discuss the number of people using morphOS, by all means. and if you want to compare against some measure of people using AROS or OS4 or windows or whatever, knock yourself out. i just don't get why you feel it necessary to post insults or snarky comments about OS4 in the process. and you do that constantly. look at morphzone -- you can't help yourself talking about the other camp.

What you think of people is highly subjective.

of course it's subjective. it's my opinion.

You obviously gets pissed off by whoever claims that MorphOS *could* have more users, but not by anyone claiming *OS4* could have more users. I'm not the one claiming that user numbers matters the slightest anyway, they are much too low all over anyway, and I don't care, I'm not the one with an obsession here. But it's interesting to note that if someone claiming that there could be measurable signs that MorphOS might actually be the more popular of the two, they have "an OS4 obsession", but when someone claims the opposite, it's just fine and dandy. And I'll tell you what, if you base your choice of Amiga OS upon these kind of things instead of their actual technical merits and stuff like that, then it's really *your* problem.

dude, i don't care if morphOS users are ten times the number of OS4 users. i couldn't possibly care less. the point of my post was that your arguments about morphOS nearly always involved putting down OS4. you post in OS4 threads that have nothing to do with morphOS just to talk smack. i would wager that you have posted more often in OS4-related threads on this site than morphOS-related threads, at least in the past couple of years.

and i'll tell you what, your behavior is a turn off for people. a big turn off. because this is a hobby, and part of that is being part of a community. and the obsession a few MOS users have with OS4 is something i would never want to be associated with.

-- eliyahu

[Karlos]

In a user base as small and fractured as ours I'd suggest that being able to sell a product at all is quite an achievement.

[runequester]

How many ACA boards did Jens sell?

[takemehomegrandma]

"Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence".

I have understood that you think it is, but just why would this be such an extraordinary claim?

The general opinion regarding numbers of OS4 and MorphOS users

Who decides what is the "general opinion"? Isn't this kind of subjective?

I believe "the general opinion", is that OS4 is *way* more popular than MorphOS, especially among OS4 users themselves. Why? Because "It's the Amiga" of course! It's "teh reel!!1", it's the true successor, etc. It simply *must* be, otherwise it would be... well, terrible!

I also guess that this is the reason to why the "Those numbers...." thread at AW.net got eight pages of discussion, when someone made the observation that the highly hyped and very much anticipated Firefox/HolyGrail/Timberwolf only got a few hundred downloads in total. It didn't quite match "the general opinion" that OS4 has a few thousand users (yes, I do think that some people actually believes that)...

there better be some substance behind your claims as you can expect people to question them. Making bold statements, then saying they're not based on facts, does not cut it.

...says he who makes bold claims based on little substance beyond how much fun he has chatting with his friends at Amigaworld.net... :p

What *I* did in my recent posts, was highlighting a series of arguments...

1. MorphOS has *sold* almost 1,400 licenses (paying €111-€150 is a commitment)
2. The very much anticipated Firefox beta is only downloaded 770 times after a whole (almost) month
3. Current MorphOS hardware is faster (or about as fast) and cheaper by a magnitude compared to OS4 HW.
4. This was also true for the "previous generation" of HW (The Pegasos/AmigaOne)
5. MorphOS was here several years before OS4, hence it has had a much longer time to "gather a flock"
6. MorphOS qualities/specs/merits etc are higher/better than OS4, and has always been

...that together *could* explain a higher number of MorphOS users, I never claimed it to be a fact, just a counter argument towards your "no it can't be true, there are many more discussions on AW.net than on MorphZone.org".

Sit down, relax, take a deep breath and consider the following: The threshold of getting a MorphOS system is extremely low. Depending on your demands and luck, you could very well be up and running after spending €150-€200, with hardware much faster than the Pegasos 2, *including* a full MorphOS registration. The threshold of getting an OS4 system is on the other hand extremely high, up to 10x as high actually. Anyone believing this won't have a practical effect on user numbers over time, is either extremely naive, or outright dumb. While MorphOS has a constant growth of 20 registrations per month/100 registrations per half year, OS4 probably has a constant *decrease* in numbers due to aging AmigaOne XE's dying off while their owners not having the money (or can't justify the ridiculous cost to themselves) to spend on a Sam/X1000.

@eliyahu: Don't like what I'm saying? Too bad, but sometimes life is a bitch, and please don't shoot the messenger. So put your head in the sand and sing the X1000 song, while we extrapolate the trends (both MorphOS's and OS4's) another 6 months. We don't want to discuss the problems, right? Ouch, that "negativity", no let's stay in the happy land, where OS4 has a great future thanks to the X1000 and Sam routes, PPC all the way...!

[takemehomegrandma]

In a user base as small and fractured as ours I'd suggest that being able to sell a product at all is quite an achievement.

Indeed.

[HenryCase]

@takemehomegrandma
You believe MorphOS is doing great. Good for you. You totally missed my point, but keep on doing what you do anyway.

[Iggy]

Normally, if a thread pops up discussing MorphOS, I feel obligated to throw in my two cents.
But this hread is relatively pointless. We know how many key files have been purchased since MorphOS went 2.0.
We don't know how many users have multiple keys.
But at a casual glance, I'd saying the number of MorphOS and OS4 users is comparable.
And passionate, fanatics are about as numerous on both sides. Frankly, I use MorphOS because the entry price is good and the hardware it runs on is still reasonably powerful.
That said, I'd love to be able to afford an X1000 and would have no problem adapting to OS4.

Some of us aren't biased at all. I'm using MorphOS and AROS now, and I don't rule out using OS4 at a later date (particularly if MorphOS changes ISAs).

[takemehomegrandma]

@takemehomegrandma
You believe MorphOS is doing great.

No, I don't think ~700 users is great in any way, nowhere did I say that.

[HenryCase]

No, I don't think ~700 users is great in any way, nowhere did I say that.

This would give around 700 MorphOS users, which is a pretty decent number actually!

Doesn't matter anyway, you're not listening, so let's just save our time and stop talking about this, yeah?

[OlafS3]

I can repeat the typical phrases I read on the different sites: "AmigaOS is the only and true Amiga-Successor because it uses 68k code", "MorphOS is the best, why cooperation? The other camps are not interesting", "Aros is years behind", "68k is only for retros and those are not interesting". Have I forgotten one of the phrases? Now I can add: "MorphOS has more users than all other combined" and "Aros is nonexisting". Do you really think that this attracts more users? When you are confronted with download-numbers of Aros (that are in the hundreds) you say those only test it one time (without any proof of you). On aros-exec is a thread you short say how old are you and what are you doing. Already more then 80 users and certainly not everyone active using Aros. But of course no Aros-User. There is a lot of critic regarding Hyperion and parts of the OS4 users regarding behavior that is correct. But some MorphOS Users behave in a way that could seen as arrogance and that is not nice too. So please stop claiming "XYZ is bigger/better/only true" and look what we can do together. I have contact to some MorphOS developer that are kind people and this does not improve relations to the other camps.

[eliyahu]

So put your head in the sand and sing the X1000 song, while we extrapolate the trends (both MorphOS's and OS4's) another 6 months. We don't want to discuss the problems, right? Ouch, that "negativity", no let's stay in the happy land, where OS4 has a great future thanks to the X1000 and Sam routes, PPC all the way...!

i rest my case.

-- eliyahu