Apple building a sub-$600 iMac.

[Dan]

dslcc wrote:
 Wasn't it back during the clone days that Be stopped developing for macs?

When the clones ended so did PPC BeOS. Because of lack of documentation.
(Jobs is evil!!!! :destroy:  :ranting: )
Should be easier now with openfirmware yes!
If I could run MOS/AOS on it I would buy it too.

[dslcc]

There was a BeOS release 5 for PowerPC, I actually own it.. At the time when I loaded it, it didn't have all the add-on functionality that the intel version had (like no real player).

I have the 5.0 Pro CD that has the intel and PPC versions on it. Found out after I bought it that it also was designed to work on my PowerCenter clone. I ran it for awhile and it was ok. Ran SheepShaver emulation on it and it worked very well. Not very many 'new' apps for it though so I finally set it aside. It was fun though.

[Dan]

Poster: dammy  Posted: 2004/12/30 19:03:25
If what I've read in another article is correct, it should be $498.

Dammy

Now how to get it to run AROS with powerup, warpup, MOS-emu, OS4-emu and MOA(MacOnAros)? :-P

The rumor of a new lowend Performa is pretty persistent I wouldn´t give it too much credit. Remmember Apple marketspots is "artistic" and "high income but not intrested in technology"(the people who don´t switch ligthbulbs in their cars themselfs).

[dslcc]

(the people who don´t switch ligthbulbs in their cars themselfs)

I changed a lightbulb in my kitchen just this morning. But I have an above average IQ - I've been an Amiga user since 1987.  :-D

[B00tDisk]

Poster: Dan  Posted: 2004/12/30 17:38:06

Pippin II  
http://www.macgeek.org/museum/pippin/

Ah, the Pippin.  Proof positive that at least once, Commodore beat out Apple in terms of unit sales (Pippin v. CD32  :lol: )

[Waccoon]

...with a pricetag under $600 USD.

Finally.  Regardless of what you think about Apple quality, there's little debate that their machines have always been too expensive.  Being able to choose any display you want is a plus, too.  I hate the LCD screens that come with the iMac, and will never own such a display.

Anyone know where I can buy a used, MacOS X capable system for $200 or less?  Specs aren't important as I'd use it strictly for compatibility testing.

Still be cheaper and faster to build a pc besides apples quality control sucks.

I agree, but I recently serviced someone's Dell with a cheezy fold-open case, and I could say the same about almost any pre-built machine.

Pippin

Wow.  I always thought that machine had been canceled.

Funny how the floppy drive is an option.  Even after the 32x, 4MB expansion and "Bulky Drive" for the N64, and Dreamcast ZIP drive, console developers still haven't learned that add-ons don't sell.  My local store has a single PS2 hard drive in stock and has been collecting dust for months.  I hope people insterested in game development are taking notes.  :-)

[System]

I think it's very funny to see people on other sites (in regards to the same article) arguing that this new "$500 Mac" won't make any difference because "you can still build a faster, more well-stocked PC for much, much cheaper".

That argument sounds very eerily similar to the standard beef against the AmigaOne and Pegasos.  Why would anyone, other than an Amiga diehard ever consider spending $600+ for a non-standard PPC motherboard with an unproven software base, when you can home-build a very respectably-powered, full PC (sans monitor) for the same money?

The only legitimate response to that is the same one that companies such as Eyetech and bPlan/Genesi were hoping for.  That response being that there are a growing number of people -- ranging from geeks to computer illiterate parents -- who have become dissatisfied with Windows and it's inherent problems.

If Apple do release such a little beast, I think it'll be a great thing for several reasons;

1) Marketed correctly, people upset with constant Windows problems and updates will gladly disregard the small price differential to get "a machine that works without all the crap".

2) A $500 Mac would be an incredibly competitive machine for anyone wanting a new machine but but doesn't have $1000+ to put into it. (Most "Gateway/Dell/commercial" machines run $1000+ by the time you add in any extras).

3) A $500 Mac would be an EXCELLENT jumping point for those who've always been interested in the Mac platform but never had the money to justify jumping off the Windows bandwagon.

4) As someone said (perhaps elsewhere) a $500 Mac "would be the perfect commercial platform for companies, government offices, etcetera" because they wouldn't have to have a full staff of high-paid Windows supporting geeks to rebuild machines when the end-user did something stupid (like removing himself, admin, and everyone else from the system permissions).  Macs, and in particular, OS X has been proven to be far easier to support.

5) Last but not least, the competition -- if Apple could sustain it against retaliatory offers for PC's put out by the Wintel Juggernaut -- would begin (albeit slowly) to make Microsoft rethink about actually FIXING problems in their damned products and being competitive.  

Right now, Microsoft isn't competing with Apple.  They have pretty much been able to ignore Apple altogether since Apple only has a laughable share of the desktop.  I think, or at least I hope that the new Mac could change all that.

I hate to sound so negative, but please understand the difference is that I'm not trying to slam anyone here.  I understand the financial realities of Eyetech/bPlan small-batching their boards versus Apple who can order them in the millions.  I don't however think that either the AmigaOne or the Pegasos would ever, under any circumstances have the same shot of competing on the desktop because outside of name recognition for the Amiga (which has been all but forgotten in the public eye), it would be an unproven system with no software support for a higher price than the new "mini-mac".  

For our favorite obsession, unless Hyperion and the MorphOS guys can get their OS on the "mini-mac", I'm afraid that it sounds like this new baby is ringing the death bell for the new Amiga.

[HopperJF]

Of course I'd have to see the specs, but if they're talking about a G4 with some way of adding a lot of memory, I might be sold.

It is  1.25GHz G4 with 256Mb supplied (upgradable).

[redrumloa]

I agree with you mostly Wayne. The only thing I can disagree is that the Mac market isn't viable. There are Millions of Mac users, it's a viable market. It certainly is tiny when compared to the Wintendo Juggernaut, but software vendors can turn a profit in it unlike the Amiga/MOS mrket.

BTW to change the subject. Does OS-X allow you to get under the hood and access the *nix core? Or are you still stuck with the GUI?

[System]

@red,

I don't *think* I said that "the mac market isn't viable".  They very much are in my opinion.  It's just that -- like someone else said -- they've positioned themselves as the "better than Windows but very elitist" alternative by pricing.  The Mercedes of desktop machines as it were.  While that guarantees them a position in the world, it doesn't make them competitive with the world of sheep who can't seem to see past

1) price
2) Gigahertz

The new "mini-mac" (I Like that term) will go a long way towards establishing a whole lot of people who -- once they experience OSX versus Windows -- will finally understand why the cost difference is worth it.  Neither Amiga solution can offer such a revelation to end-users at this point because they lack any real software support, even in the OS level, for future growth.

In regards to the "under the hood" questions, I dunno, but I'm sure it has to be accessible to some extent, even if it involves shareware to get there.

Wayne

[dslcc]

BTW to change the subject. Does OS-X allow you to get under the hood and access the *nix core? Or are you still stuck with the GUI?

\

Absolutely. OSX has a CLI That gets you into the 'Darwin' BSD core. It has most common BSD command line programs. It is even possible to install and run BSD programs. I've got OpenOffice.org and The Gimp installed right now.

http://www.apple.com/macosx/features/unix/

There's tons of stuff that can be done from the command line.  :-D

[System]

Absolutely. OSX has a CLI That gets you into the 'Darwin' BSD core.

Sounds like we've been "out-Amiga'd".

[dslcc]

Sounds like we've been "out-Amiga'd"

OS X is a very tempting OS. But it still isn't what I'd call "Amiga-like"...well except for the Dock that AOS/MorphOS seems to want to emulate. And perhaps the stability - I've never had to reboot because of a crashed app. And the GUI...very fluid motion and chrisp clear fonts. And the 'huge' software base - there have been over 10,000 programs written for OSX since its release.

I bought this Mac sortof as a 'bookmark' while waiting for AOS4/MorphOS to be completed. I think it has hooked me.  :-?

[redrumloa]

@Wayne

Gotcha, i misread.

[minator]

Download fink and you can get a lot of the standard *nix tools.

--

As for Macs being expensive, well it depends what you are comparing it with, the PC market has a very wide range of prices including machines which cost vastly *more* than macs.  If you compare to similar products from similar PC makers there isn't much if any price difference, in fact Macs may work out costing less.

I've been playing with my parents cheap PC and I can say I'm very glad I'm not using a PC.  It's specifications are supposedly higher but my G4 but it does not require 10 minutes to boot, run slower than a P266, take 30 seconds to draw a window or crash if you try printing while using the internet.

This is a Celeron 2.6GHz which should not be anywhere near that bad but the manufacturer made their machine cheap by only including 128MB RAM, XP is evidently not happy with this, not all the malware which has managed to install itself despite my dad having a virus killer, Adaware, Spybot etc.

OS X is pretty hungry as well but 256 MB should be fine if you're not doing a lot at once.

It's simple really, you get what you pay for.

[neofree]

Ewww!! CRAPINTOSH!!!

Seriously.. Mac is FARTHER from Amiga then PC!  Mac has always been the simple PC that's "easy".  (More like retarded in my opinion.)      There isn't a single reason why anyone should buy these things.

A PC is more Amiga then Mac! At least it has knowledgable geeks!  Why can't Mac just die???