Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Author Topic: AO Interview - Dave Haynie  (Read 21245 times)

Description:

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline uncharted

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Join Date: Mar 2002
  • Posts: 1520
    • Show only replies by uncharted
Re: AO Interview - Dave Haynie
« Reply #74 from previous page: October 02, 2003, 11:21:37 AM »
@T_Bone

Quote
And you respond to it regularly, wasn't that the point?


Not really, I don't post here often enough to.

I think I've asked Kenny why he feels the need to troll a couple of times, only because he never used to be like that. Never got a response though.  I think my last comment was something about Kronos and Kenny getting thier knickers in a twist about the A1 booting OS 4 or something along those lines.

I'm amazed how personally some people have taken it, and how one guy's opinions (and attemps at his reputation) were ripped to shreads, just because they differ.

It will probably die down now, as it seems Wayne et al have managed to turn this into a fine marketing opportunity.

I'm so bored with this.  I'm only really here to talk ideas, not politics.
 

Offline Warface

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Join Date: Nov 2002
  • Posts: 970
    • Show only replies by Warface
    • http://www.spacehawks.hu
Re: AO Interview - Dave Haynie
« Reply #75 on: October 02, 2003, 11:25:34 AM »
Quote
In my honest opinion, if 5,000 A1's are sold, it will be a miricle. That's 5 thousend not 5 Million.


Seeing the increasing rate with which the old hardware dies on local mailing lists, those who decide to remain have 4 choices: buy a classic again, or an AmigaONE or a Pegasos . Chances are that those purchasing AmigaONEs and Pegasoses may reach more and more as time passes by. This is however, just an opinion.
 

Offline bloodline

  • Master Sock Abuser
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Join Date: Mar 2002
  • Posts: 12113
    • Show only replies by bloodline
    • http://www.troubled-mind.com
Re: AO Interview - Dave Haynie
« Reply #76 on: October 02, 2003, 11:37:13 AM »
I certainly believe Dave's comments about being "out of touch" are backed up by his comments relating to AROS.

I agree with his comments relating to AROS, had they been made when I first joined AROS. But now, I've not seen more commitment from a bunch of people than the AROS project. And the project is more excting now than any other in the Amiga community (For me only). I agree that I might be the only person in the world who finds runninng an AmigaOS clone on a 2.6Ghz CPU exciting... :-D

Offline echweesnet

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Join Date: Jul 2003
  • Posts: 7
    • Show only replies by echweesnet
Re: AO Interview - Dave Haynie
« Reply #77 on: October 02, 2003, 12:20:41 PM »
It always puts tears in my eyes reading of what machines were in developement  :boohoo:
I really hate Commodore for some decisions they took  :madashell:
Well its all history anyway, and as Dave Haynie said, the chances for a revolutionary design as A1000 was, is near 0 these days...
 

Offline darkcoder

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Join Date: Sep 2002
  • Posts: 164
    • Show only replies by darkcoder
Re: AO Interview - Dave Haynie
« Reply #78 on: October 02, 2003, 12:28:08 PM »
Either I missed something, or Dave moved some event 10 years in the future:

---------------CUT-----------------------------------
That's about the time (2000-2001 I guess) Ed Hepler left the AAA group and went
on to start the Hombre project.
------------------------------------------------------

maybe it's 1990-1991 ?

-----------------CUT-----------------------------------
sometime after the A3000, around the Spring of 2001. That's when Ali grabbed
the ropes, and one-by-one, group by group, starting making the company his.
-----------------------------------------------------------

maybe Spring 1991 ?

-----------------CUT---------------------------------
than revive the "A1000+", which was Joe Augenbraun's project to build an $800
AA-based, 25MHz entry-level machine for April 2002 release, he gets Greg Berlin
to build a scaled-down A3000. This is dubbed the A1000jr -----------------------------------------------------------------

April 1992 ?

Anyway, this was a really great interview, as it always happens when Dave speaks!
But also the questions were good!
 :-)
The Dark Coder / Trinity
 

Offline lempkee

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Join Date: Apr 2002
  • Posts: 2860
    • Show only replies by lempkee
    • http://www.amigaguru.com
Re: AO Interview - Dave Haynie
« Reply #79 on: October 02, 2003, 12:29:24 PM »
uncharted:i couldnt agree more , but still people will always try and force something on you, and you might love it in the end , thats the good thing, though all the nagging in the wrong places does piss u more off that it actually should have and that is a bad thing.

i am still very open minded with pegasos vs amigaone , but i stayed with amiga through tick and thin and i wont bend just for pegasos just like that.

Aros is nothing for me, its like air .. i dont want a x86 plattform and i couldnt care less.

i will probably get an peg2 + an amigaone lite and try em out for a longer period and then say which is best FOR MY USAGE , i was pretty uncomfortable with pegasos in the start and i am still so but that is beause of the way it was introduced and still beeing marketed, but since last version of mos, i can't really say its ugly and un useable but it still has issues which i wont live with for now.

hence, i stick to my only computer which is my amiga 1200 , and i do have an XE (a1) but i dont use it much , my gf uses it for inet and browsing/mail .

cheers

pps:competetion is always good and this we will be able to see not too far from now, prices , campaigns etc and hopefully a bigger market + actual software will be produced.
Whats up with all the hate!
 

Offline redrumloa

  • Original Omega User
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Join Date: Feb 2002
  • Posts: 10126
    • Show only replies by redrumloa
Re: AO Interview - Dave Haynie
« Reply #80 on: October 02, 2003, 12:49:21 PM »
Quote
It will probably die down now, as it seems Wayne et al have managed to turn this into a fine marketing opportunity.


That comment is aweful sharp, was it really necessary? Just like all other members, Wayne is allowed to speak his mind.
Someone has to state the obvious and that someone is me!
 

Offline bloodline

  • Master Sock Abuser
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Join Date: Mar 2002
  • Posts: 12113
    • Show only replies by bloodline
    • http://www.troubled-mind.com
Re: AO Interview - Dave Haynie
« Reply #81 on: October 02, 2003, 01:21:09 PM »
Quote
Aros is nothing for me, its like air .. i dont want a x86 plattform and i couldnt care less.


I certainly hope air is not nothing for you. I don't wantyou to die.

But Remember AROS != x86. AROS is just an OS that can run on the x86, as it can the PPC and the 68k...

Offline Seehund

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Join Date: Feb 2002
  • Posts: 1230
    • Show only replies by Seehund
    • http://AmigaPOP.8bit.co.uk/
Re: AO Interview - Dave Haynie
« Reply #82 on: October 02, 2003, 01:23:01 PM »
That was a great interview! Thanks Dave, Kees/amiga.org and those who submitted questions!

Yes, it does seem like Dave is - self-admittedly - a bit out of the loop regarding current Amiga events. Since when is that a crime? :)

As for the "wannabe" comment, I think the ensuing discussion to a great deal arises from people's personal preferences, and that stinking old factionism. Personally, I don't see "wannabe" to necessarily have negative connotations. MorphOS is a wannabe AmigaOS. But hey, I thought that was a good thing, I guess that's primarily why most of us are interested in it (in whatever way, positive or negative) - otherwise we wouldn't be discussing it so regularly and fervently.

He also said that the excitement (in our little "market") over the Terons is AmigaOS4, "pretty much start and finish." Dave also sees the obvious that there won't be any new Amigas (unless someone's got "$250 million" laying around... ;)). A pragmatic view of hardware being a commodity, already out there and continuously being sold and developed by those who already have that capability, it's ready to be used. So if you're trying to sell an OS and don't have $250M or any weight to throw around in hardware development, then make it run on the hardware that people want.

In that perspective he didn't really diss the Pegasos hardware per se, it's just that AmigaOS won't be allowed to be sold for it. AmigaOS has been turned into a sales-pitch for Terons; a compulsory for-old-times'-sake charity fundraising action for Eyetech. He wants AmigaOS, so he has to buy an "AmigaOne".

I don't quite get the "Pegasos splits the market" bit. More hardware options is a prerequisite for market growth. "I’m pretty much not going to spend $1000 or so just to taste out this new OS", as Dave said, and to see market growth that statement can be applied to any OS, including AmigaOS. The split, for AmigaOS's part as that seems to be a common interest of mine and Dave's, comes from the artificial divide created by AInc's licensing idiocy imposed on 3rd party hardware. In contrast, both parts of the MorphOS/Pegasos package are controlled, developed and sold by one company. I could see MorphOS sold for other hardware, like Macs or Terons, if Genesi can keep the Peg competitive in the geek PPC niche - they'd still be selling Pegs at the same time as they'd get MorphOS users (and thus possible future Peg customers) elsewhere.

I'd like to run the "official" AmigaOS. I know and like the current AmigaOS, and an updated version will no doubt rock on more modern hardware. I'm however not as "faithful" as Dave seems to be, I'm not prepared to pretend there's a reason to buy my hardware more expensively on a restricted "Amiga market" just to continue to run AmigaOS.

Given that AmigaOS4 and MorphOS/ABox seem to offer current AmigaOS users roughly the same things (I'm sure someone will now post a detailed list of reasons why one r0x0rz and the other sux0rz...), the main marketing point of AmigaOS4 indeed seems to be the Name. It's "official". Takemehomegrandma wrote a good summary IMO in the forums on just how the Name has been devaluated, especially over the last 3-4 years. To level the playing field, AInc needs to realize that their product, what they should be selling (maybe that's a strange concept...), is AmigaOS, not other people's hardware or trademark licenses for such. AmigaOS4 is but one alternative among others for current and future users interested in AmigaOS. Make people choose your alternative by making it more attractive, not with comradery and lenience to irrelevant former partners, futile hopes for short term license income, restrictions and lockouts. A couple of thousand stalwart fanatics is nothing to fight over.

Stop me, I'm rambling! ;)

Anyway, nice interview, if nothing else from a historical anecdote perspective.
[color=0000FF]Maybe it\\\'s still possible to [/color]save AmigaOS [color=0000FF][/size][/color]  :rtfm:......
 

Offline Wilse

Re: AO Interview - Dave Haynie
« Reply #83 on: October 02, 2003, 01:53:08 PM »
That is probably the best interview I've read on this site.

As for his views on OS4/MOS/AROS - it's the guy's *opinion*, which he openly admits is a little out of touch. even still, I don't think he was too wide of the mark.

@Kenny:

I can't comment on OS3.9 but I can say that my Pegasos crashes more often than my OS3.5 A1200.
"*Application is meditating*" is something I see more and more. Graphics corruption happens a lot too, although I guess that could be down to my Radeon 8500. My A1 had problems with it too.
I still love the system though but it ain't perfect by a long shot.

Offline Kronos

  • Resident blue troll
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Join Date: Feb 2002
  • Posts: 4017
    • Show only replies by Kronos
    • http://www.SteamDraw.de
Re: AO Interview - Dave Haynie
« Reply #84 on: October 02, 2003, 01:56:00 PM »
@Mikey_C

5000000 A1200s ??? :lol:  :lol:

220000 sold under C= and 190000 produced at ESCOM (lots of them never sold).

The A500 was sold about 4500000 times, but most of them only after the prices
dropped to console-level.

And what has sold them were the chips and the C=-badge,not some obscure
college-rock-references inprinted on the PCBs  :-P

Or do you think BE would have sold more units if they had been designed by Dave ?

Both Gerald and Dave did/do use pre-existant chips (Gerald, 3rd-party ones,
Dave had them inhouse). Both build great HW with them,but also none of
that HW was ever 100% perfect (or why do you think we get all the "my xxxx
doesn't work with my revision_y Azz00 ?).
1. Make an announcment.
2. Wait a while.
3. Check if it can actually be done.
4. Wait for someone else to do it.
5. Start working on it while giving out hillarious progress-reports.
6. Deny that you have ever announced it
7. Blame someone else
 

Offline bhoggett

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Join Date: Mar 2002
  • Posts: 1431
    • Show only replies by bhoggett
    • http://www.midnightmu.com
Re: AO Interview - Dave Haynie
« Reply #85 on: October 02, 2003, 01:59:20 PM »
(Not aimed at Seehund as it applies to most of this thread)

I can't help but wonder whether it's Dave Haynie who is out of touch with the Amiga scene, or the Amiga scene which is out of touch with the Real World (tm).
Bill Hoggett
 

Offline zacman

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Join Date: Mar 2002
  • Posts: 553
    • Show only replies by zacman
Re: AO Interview - Dave Haynie
« Reply #86 on: October 02, 2003, 02:18:09 PM »
>I also went on to say that I *believed* Dave Haynie
>was also involved in the AGA chipset, and that I
>*believed* something like 5 million A1200's were
>sold worldwide. (I think that's about right)

Ok here are some more realistic numbers. These
were posted by Dr. Peter Kittel and only cover the
total sales of Commodore Germany until
31/12/1993:

Amiga CD32      25.000
Amiga CDTV      25.800
Amiga 500    1.081.000
Amiga 500+      79.500
Amiga 600      193.000
Amiga 1000      27.500
Amiga 1200      95.500
Amiga 2000     124.500
Amiga 3000       8.300
Amiga 4000/030   7.500
Amiga 4000/040   3.800

The sold machines in the first half of 1994 by
Commodore Germany have been:

Amiga CD32   25.000
Amiga CDTV  1.800
Amiga 500         21.000
Amiga 500+           9.500
Amiga 600         43.000
Amiga 1200         52.000
Amiga 2000           2.500
Amiga 3000               700
Amiga 4000/030       4.000
Amiga 4000/040         800

Interesting to see that even in 1994(!) the numbers
of sold A500/600 have been higher than all sold
other machines (A1200-4000) together.

I guess in other countries the A1200 must have been
sold very well then (if 5 million was true) ;-)
 

Offline Skyraker

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Join Date: Mar 2002
  • Posts: 686
    • Show only replies by Skyraker
    • http://www.wolves.co.uk
Re: AO Interview - Dave Haynie
« Reply #87 on: October 02, 2003, 02:19:05 PM »
Incredible.... we're given a lengthy in depth interview, covering a multitude of topics and this thread is almost entirely preocupied with the fact that Dave Haynie isn't particuarly interested in Morphos.

Very sad indeed.
---------------------------------------------------------------------
I have the body of an 18 year old ......... I keep it in the fridge.
---------------------------------------------------------------------
 

Offline Mikey_C

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Join Date: Feb 2002
  • Posts: 322
    • Show only replies by Mikey_C
Re: AO Interview - Dave Haynie
« Reply #88 on: October 02, 2003, 02:26:18 PM »
I concede to your superior facts. If they are accurate.

However the point I was still making to tarbos is that The Stuff Dave Haynie was involved in, sold more units than what Gerald Carda has been involved with so far.

tarbos was trying to make out that Dave Haynie is a failure. I was defending Dave. I appreciate that not all MOS users are as short sighted as he is.

That is all I will say on the matter, I was being misquoted by JoannaK into saying that AmigaOne`s will sell around 5 million. This is not the case and I have never maintained that it is.

Mikey C
YNWA!
 

Offline uncharted

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Join Date: Mar 2002
  • Posts: 1520
    • Show only replies by uncharted
Re: AO Interview - Dave Haynie
« Reply #89 on: October 02, 2003, 02:28:01 PM »
@Red
Quote
That comment is aweful sharp, was it really necessary? Just like all other members, Wayne is allowed to speak his mind.


I'd say I was just being blunt.  There was need need to throw down the gauntlet to Dave online.  This situation has been turned around from a potential disaster to a unique opportunity to pursuade the community to buy Genesi.

Perhaps if Amiga Inc. had that kind of PR cunning, they wouldn't be where they are now.