Amiga.org Welcomes Genesi as an advertising sponsor

[MasterOfReality]

Before I start, can I please stress that I'm not trying to troll...?

I feel rather sorry that Genesi are sponsoring this site.

My reasons...

This is AMIGA.org - whay the hell aren't Amiga sponsoring it?

Like it or not, Genesi are, to a certain extent, parasitising someone else's market. It may be understandable - the vaious amigas have done nothing these last few years - but I don't like it, especially given that I know that the Amiga Inc people really do have their hearts in the right places  (but their feet in their mouths), and are (belatedly) heading in the right directiion.

MorphOS fanatics have taken down this site twice in the past. Whilst it's nice to see BBRV distancing themselves from this, it still (perhaps unfairly) leaves a bad taste in the mouth.

Make of this what you will. I'm not really taking sides here...

[HMetal]

[Please, note that my only reason for replying to this topic is not to troll, it is to clear up misconceptions. None of what I say is an untruth, it is merely to inform and since my clarification of this is getting deleted all of the time, and since you asked, I have no recourse but to answer.]

This is AMIGA.org - whay the hell aren't Amiga sponsoring it?

We were, remember?  We hosted amiga.org on a dedicated server that we pay for and that server was used for nothing else but amiga.org.

So, while we didn't donate explicit monies, we did put resources behind amiga.org. No one can refute this.

P.S. I do find it interesting that when I ask Wayne to, for the community,  clear up the misconceptions regarding Amiga Inc's former role in amiga.org, the topics get deleted..  I wonder if this one will get deleted now, as well?  ;-)  Then again, if clarification of our involvement keeps being removed, I could always make an announcement on our own website.. but I would prefer not to do that - for obvious reasons.  This is something that Wayne has a duty to clarify or at least let us clarify.

[Kronos]

@MasterOfReality
Just because someone hacked A.org, and because you don't like
MorphOS doesn't mean the site was hacked by MorphOS-fans.

Sites all over the net get hacked on a daily basis and mostly
it is done by some sick weirdos who have nothing to do with the
contents of the site other than liking to proove that it can be done.

@HMetal
For what I remember the server needed serious updating by Wayne
before he could use it.

So basiclly you were just giving some bandwith, which is cheap
in these days. This did stop Wayne from acceprting money by
advertisers and therefore may have been a not so good deal for him.

Also wasn't it said that AInc wouldn't take ANY influence in A.org
because of this ? Most of these threads were fueled by exactly
2 users who typiclly demanded Wayne to tunrn this site into a
the_name_worshiping one. Don't rememeber your post on this, but
if they were in one of those threads or if you were tooting
into the same horn, deleting them was 100% right.

[System]

@hmetal.  

I believe I did reply to this,

here

I felt it was very clear.  I do know that when I MOVED the thread to talk about, something about the system screwed up and it's not reachable if you look in your account, but is reachable in the direct forums.  I think that and that alone is why someone locked the thread.

Here is the original text from the other thread:
---------------------------
You are absolutely right, and I need to clear that up, yet again it seems. Please read this very slowly and take a bit to understand it. There is nothing between the lines.

In no way did Amiga Inc themselves put any direct pressure on me in one direction or another. As a matter of fact, I could not even get Amiga Inc, more appropriately Bill McEwen to even respond to direct e-mails after the Luca Diana incident. They completely ignored me and this site. (I sincerely feel that they are listening to the wrong people, but that's just my opinion, and it's a wholly different story).

In reality, on my part -- as well as a few of my staff -- due to the fact that we were using AI's server, there was a lot of perceived pressure, helped by the attitudes of people like Luca Diana and Mike Bouma. Said pressure made us feel as though since we were hosted on AI's server, we could not provide the fair and even coverage that I had tried to do for the last 8 years. Psychologically speaking, I even probably lashed out at Amiga Inc because of the frustration caused by the hosting situation and the perceived pressure.

No one, not even the six advertisers "pressured" me into leaving Amiga Inc's servers. This was a simple business decision that *I* made, in the best interest of the future of Amiga.org to get into a situation where I once again feel it's possible for me (and my staff) to do our "jobs", without pressure one way or another -- which is how it should have been all along.

For the record, I do not hate Amiga Inc, though I do have personal problems with most of their management. I also feel that Amiga Inc is failing miserably at doing the only thing they should be concentrating on, which is to support this community.

Support the community first, the computer should come a close second. Without the community, there is no need for the computer. This is a fact they don't seem to give a rat's ass about, and yes, that does irritate the holy spit out of me.

Anyone who knows me, knows that to me, this community is the ONLY thing about the Amiga that I care about any more, and it didn't have to be that way. If AI had supported the community, I would have been happy as hell. Facts are facts however, and Amiga Inc -- in my eyes -- is simply not concerned whether we are here or not when the new machines come out.

After all, Amiga Inc themselves have nothing to lose if the desktop platform fails, Hyperion and Eyetech do.

[HMetal]

For what I remember the server needed serious updating by Wayne before he could use it.

Uhm.. no.  Check with Wayne, my friend.  It was me who installed the extra support software he needed.  He may have had to "tweak" some settings and install the site software (XOOPS) himself, but I installed the support software, set up the MTA and even tweaked some support scripts for him to merge user email addresses into the virtual user table for the MTA.

As for "tooting" horns, I am offended that you even view me in that way -- that it is possible that I might "toot" a particular horn.   As anyone who knows me can confirm, that is not who I am and you can even ask Wayne himself about that.  When I reply, it is to correct a mistruth or spin -- nothing more, nothing less.

[HMetal]

Thanks for being a stand-up guy there Wayne.  I missed that in the other thread.

One thing I have to note regarding your comments:  Amiga does care about the Amiga community in whole (as opposed to the "kommunity" that some people refer to as the followers of Amiga Inc).  Don't mistake unexplained silence for contempt, ignorance or a lack of interest.  If Amiga wasn't interested, then Amiga wouldn't have put forth the effort to sponsor and create the partnerships that are producing the forthcoming products.

I know you (Wayne) are jaded by Amiga for your own personal reasons (which you and I discussed and I won't put those in the public eye), but that has nothing to do with the products nor Amiga's involvement in them, or otherwise.

[L8-X]

@Paul_Gadd

LOL, just watched some of the vids off the webpage that piracy one too. God it seems like yesterday!

Violet married Gaz Topp and they have 2 sprogs now.

Gaz used to use an amiga I remember, read an interview with him in a mag somewhere.

[SidMan]

@Wayne

Fair points. The advertising is fine with me. It's the bit about the "community" I disagree with.

>> Support the community first, the computer should come a close second.
>> Without the community, there is no need for the computer.

So which computer do you see right for the community? Can there be more than one?

IMHO - Whether we like it or not this community is split. Just look at the evidence in the forums and news, it is like watching two local football teams do battle on the pitch.

You can no longer say this is a community, not even a community with differing views.
 
I've been away from "Amiga News" websites recently - I have found more of a sense of community in the A1-Dev and Amiga-Dev mailing lists - why? Because we are all wanting the same thing there, all wanting something more to base and expand this "split" of the "community" on. Sure there are disagreements (that is healthy), but not all out war like we have here..

I'm sure the other "community split" has something similar and feels the same way.

Lets not pretend we are one big community.  (although I'm not to proud for people to prove me wrong)

[bbrv]

Dear Friends, the "Kommunity" reference has more to do with a mentality to blindly follow a direction without question.  Within a true "Community" of people *of course* there are differences.  There *can* be different hardware, there can be different operating systems, and there should be different opinions about many things.  Let us not forget we are human, computers are not.  If we can share our differences intelligently with mutual respect for the dignity of others all these threads will improve in their usefulness.

We think there is far to much unnecessary "flaming" on all the sites.  We have been a part of it.  We responded at the level of the opposition.  We have never been intimidated by any of it and we simply will not allow falsehoods and malicious personal attacks to remain unanswered.  What will stand in truth and fact in the future will be the action and the results developed by all involved.  If your looking for "measure" we are ready for judgment. We can discuss any thing, because we genuinely seek to be the best we can at all we do.  Tell us what you think, explain why and most of all put it in a thoughtful context.  In other words, if we know who you are and what your experience and background is, it will be easier for us to appreciate your ideas.  We are extremely grateful for the email exchanges we have with many of you (though sometimes we cannot answer as fast as we would like!).

If your looking for a fight and you are bent on insults and personal attacks, just take it somewhere else.  We do not have time for this any more.

The "thread wars" are over.  We need to work.  Our future is on the road ahead.  We can see where we are going and know how to get there.

Sincerely,

Raquel and Bill
Genesi  :-)

[SidMan]

@R&B

>> The "thread wars" are over. We need to work.
>> Our future is on the road ahead. We can see
>> where we are going and know how to get there.

Exactly - this is why I think Hyperion and others took a back seat from the public eye at the beginning of 2002. Just as Ralph and many others in the MorphOS camp also did. They all need to build a future. But they are not building a future together...

What I am saying is that people are so against the other groups machines and direction that you can no longer call this a "community". The only common interest we serve is in our history - The Amiga as it was and the ideals behind it.

In the current climate the two sides cannot agree so a split is occuring in our "community".

This is not a flame, just my view point. I don't often post. (Maybe I should keep it that way).
.

[downix]

In the current climate the two sides cannot agree so a split is occuring in our "community".

But from where is the split occuring?  I have seen bbrv here post several times, here and elsewhere, a desire to work with Eyetech and Hyperion to get some kind of re-joining of efforts in the future.  But that got greeted with silence and some of the AInc-groupies claiming that Genesi needs AOS4 to continue when that is not the case.  I see a man that cares about the community, and doesn't wish it self-destruct.  If that means offering an olive branch, then he offers the olive branch.

[Alkemyst]

@Downix employed by Genesi
 

But from where is the split occuring? I have seen bbrv here post several times, here and elsewhere, a desire to work with Eyetech and Hyperion to get some kind of re-joining of efforts in the future. But that got greeted with silence and some of the AInc-groupies claiming that Genesi needs AOS4 to continue when that is not the case. I see a man that cares about the community, and doesn't wish it self-destruct. If that means offering an olive branch, then he offers the olive branch.

You really are funny.

1) BB knows full well the right way to go about working together, eveni know how better to go about it & im not even a CEO.

You dont ask on pubic forums first where there is confict going on.

2)he knows full well the legal bounds of Aos4.
Or dont he understand what having to go to Amiga.inc to get a licence for Aos4 means.

3) then after all that he puts down the other products from the every same ppl you say he is offering an olive branch.

[bbrv]

@Alkemyst 

Alkemyst, we tried to work out a suitable agreement for both parties many, many times -- all directly and all privately.  In fact, we are still trying...;-)

Please point me to where we have criticized OS4?

As for the Teron/A1, we predicted the problems there months ago.  It seems the "news" is just getting out...

Best regards,

Raquel and Bill  :-)

[Alkemyst]

Poster: bbrv Date: 2003/3/9 17:58:37

@Alkemyst employed by Genesi NOT

Ok my mistake.

Alkemyst, we tried to work out a suitable agreement for both parties many, many times -- all directly and all privately. In fact, we are still trying...

Please point me to where we have criticized OS4?

As for the Teron/A1, we predicted the problems there months ago. It seems the "news" is just getting out...

Best regards,

Raquel and Bill

Have you gone to Amiga.Inc to get a licence ?

If not then you have done nothing.


What should it matter to you about the Teron/A1.

From the ppl who have had a boards for quite some time now your making a big deal out of every little.

[downix]

Have you gone to Amiga.Inc to get a licence ?

If I recall, they did that a long time ago, before Hyperion was even in the picture.  The terms were not agreeable, from what I have heard on the various forums.  But, I am hearing this 3rd hand.

[Alkemyst]

Poster: downix Date: 2003/3/9 18:14:42


Quote:


Have you gone to Amiga.Inc to get a licence ?




If I recall, they did that a long time ago, before Hyperion was even in the picture. The terms were not agreeable, from what I have heard on the various forums. But, I am hearing this 3rd hand.

Your way off the mark.

That was about useing MOS as AmigaOS PPC before Aos4.
There are more than one type of license Downix for more than one thing.