Update PIC on Minimig

[whiteb]

It is a nice thought to make a programmer to reprogram the Pic,  but one thing comes to mind...

If the PIC protection bits are active, then the PIC becomes a ROM.  You cannot Reprogram it.

If the Aqube (sp?) minimig conforms to V1.1, then the Serial port SHOULD work.

Please be warned, the PIC listens for about 1 second on serial before booting the main code.

YOU MUST set the TinyBoot serial software to "Upload" the new firmware, it will then look for the pic, apply power to Minimig and the pic should be found and upload will take place.

One thing i suggest, is to just wait 30 seconds before Removing the power to minimig to remove the serial port, probably not needed, but just to make sure the Flash worked and it has rebooted properly.

I have re-flashed my pic on a number of occasions without hassle, on V1.1, mind you this is my one I built myself.
But as I said, this should not matter if they are selling V1.1 conforming boards.

If its Protection bits..., then you gotta buy a new PIC buddy  As said before, protection bits will PREVENT any further updating.

[Oliver]

whiteb wrote:
...If its Protection bits..., then you gotta buy a new PIC buddy  As said before, protection bits will PREVENT any further updating.

Hi,

I'm pretty sure the code protection does not prevent an external erase function. It will prevent an external read function. When re-programming a PIC, an external erase function is performed prior to programming in the new code.

There are a few types of read/write possible:
1. Internal table read - reading program memory from within the PIC firmware
2. Internal table write - writing to program memory from within the PIC firmware
3. External erase - Using and exetrnal programmer to erase the PIC
4. External write - Using an external programmer to write to program memory

These read write processes effectively apply in the same fashion to both the flash program memory, and the EEPROM data memory.

It is my understanding that code protection can be applied separately to internal and external operations, though an external erase will always be available for anything other than a one time programmable version of a chip (PROM).

PROMs tend not to be used much in hobby projects, but can be appealing for large manufacturing runs.

Though I have only used code protection once, some time ago, I'm pretty sure it functions as I have described.

[Oliver]

boing4000 wrote:
Do you think out of your experience that could work?

Yes, I think it could work, though it may not. To my understanding, the issue is that this type of programmer relies on the port to provide Vpp, the programming voltage. Ports on many modern computers tend not to be strictly standards compliant in this regard. You may get lucky. There are also Amiga based programmers of this type available (look at Aminet; I'm pretty sure I've seen some schematics there before).

Another issue is the port signal timing. Modern OS's tend to have the OS arbitrate port access, which can effect signal timing. I'm not sure if this is significant for PIC programming or not. There are some hacks available which allow direct low level port control. I've generally had no problem using these hacks, but some people have had less success.

If the Minimig operates on ~+3V supply, then you could probably use low voltage programming of the PIC with a simple port controlled programmer. This allows programming with a lower Vpp. However, this is not advised when the PIC is to be operated at a voltage above that at which Vpp is used for programming.

If you try to make your own programmer, I suggest you pay attention to voltages being generated, and which pins they are applied to. Check the pin numbers against the pin names in the data sheet for your particular PIC; be careful just blindly copying something you see online. Also, be wary of using substitute zener diodes of different volatges.

There are lots of programmers around, DIY, second hand, Microchip, and third party commercial. Here is one which has had some success with users who had issues with the JDM style: MBHP PIC Burner from the MIDIBox site (I haven't used one of these).

Let us know how you go, as I'm pretty sure quite a few people on this forum have experience with PICs (with Amiga keyboard and mouse adapters, etc).

Cheers,

Oliver

[boing4000]

Yes Oliver, thats the same information I found. Using an external progger the PIC can be totaly earsed and rewritten any time. It dont care about any software settings, thisis  only for internal self programming.

Thanks for advising of this progger, I will be extremly careful because this is currently the only PIC I have!

For ACube (italy) I pointed out that there is no access via tiny bootloader possible. The only output of PIC via serial (terminal) is starting instantly with "Minimig build...." and even while resetting the PIC and let tiny bootloader software listen on RS232 it says "PIC is sending unknown data..." as mentioned in  previous post.

[amigakit]

Any customers who have purchased Minimig from us and have support questions, please get in contact.

[Darrin]

Well, I'm glad I bought my board from Amigakit as I've been in contact with them and they assure me that if the PIC doesn't flash then it's covered by my waranty with then and they'll send me a new PIC!  You can't get better than that.  I'll send them the old one back in return if I can't upadte it.  :-)

Oh, and any new boards they sell will have the PIC already updated apparently.

[straycat]

That's great news, thanks AmigaKit.

[boing4000]

Great job and service Amigakit! I hope that Vesalia in germany (where Im located too) will do something like that. They sold me the Minimig that was build by ACube...

My attempt in reflashing the PIC via that very simple LPT progger failed until now. All wires and connections are correct and I checked it out many times. Also there is a portdiag tool to measure single line state. Everything is working but the PIC can not be detected or read out.
I feel a bit frustrated because nothing is working :madashell:

If only this Xilinx core compiling would work, I could at least try to fix some bugs in blitter.v or something else. Right now minimig feels a bit "closed" or static to me. But it is still working, even after that PIC read attempt!

[Oliver]

boing4000 wrote:
I feel a bit frustrated because nothing is working :madashell:

Hmm, know that feeling. Maybe just leave it for a few days, and wait for Vesalia's response. Probably the worst case would be for you to pay for postage to and from the UK, and take Alex up on his offer to help you out. It shouldn't be too bad, either way.

[boing4000]

Yes you are right, I will first wait for Vesalias response. Perhaps they also can reflash my pic or send another one in exchange. Minimig is operating also with the older version and makes a lot of fun too!

Thanks again for your time and information! It can always be helpful :-)

[BraindeaD]

@Boing:

I just buy a PICKit 2 from Microchip, so next week I hope could write PICs. I'm in Spain, so if Vesalia doesn't flash yours, maybe I could.

Regards

[boing4000]

Wow thats very nice BraindeaD :-) thank you for your offering!
Sending the PIC to Spain should be no problem. I will come back to this if necessary!

[boing4000]

Today Vesalia insure me to swap the PIC with another one contain tiny bootloader, also for all their minimig customers :-)
They are still waiting for a response from ACube but will do this exchange anyway.

[koaftder]

boing4000 wrote:
Today Vesalia insure me to swap the PIC with another one contain tiny bootloader, also for all their minimig customers :-)
They are still waiting for a response from ACube but will do this exchange anyway.

That is good news.

[Oliver]

koaftder wrote:
That is good news.

Yes, a good result. Nice to see they take care of their customers.

[boing4000]

Im also happy about this reaction and service. No matter if this exchange will take some days, minimig is still operating well with this (static) older firmware version.

When I have the new PIC, I will try to place the adf files into a subfolder (\adf) to make more images accessable as in main directory.