Elbox have spoken

[Bobsonsirjonny]

seer wrote:
....About ANN, any "troll" can post there, on A.org this is a little more difficult as at least here only one can use a certain nick (Well most of the time.. Sometimes Bobson isn't Bobson  :-P )..
 

I dont get what you mean? :-)

 I'm always here dude - I never post on Ann :-)

[Paul_Gadd]

If they did not make amiga hardware would you still be defending them?

Elbox has been exposed, which they CAN NOT be trusted,

Their actions in the real world are unacceptable but hell they do amiga hardware so lets all turn a blind eye or even help them code more trojans.

The Elbox saga has made the Inquirer. Not sure if this is good news. At least people will now that the amiga is still alive, and kicking.

Elbox now have lost all credibility.

They say they only removed the code because that "protection measure" (!) became public knowledge. So obviously the new versions will have another, different but similar, piece of code in them, which will maybe format your hard disk, or email your files to Elbox, or whatever...

Who knows? Will every piece of software released by Elbox need to be disassembled by the community to see if it is safe? I suspect so. Oh, sorry, disassembling it is illegal, they claim. So we can't even do that. We are going to have to believe them after they have admitted lying about the existence of the code, and making false allegations about copyright infringement.

I mean, how do Elbox even know that it was a pirated copy that was disassembled? Where is the proof? The only proof we have is the proof that Elbox have put this evil code in their software, and then lied about it.

Amigan Software has joined the boycott against Elbox. We will not be purchasing, supporting or endorsing any of their hardware or software.

[Piru]

@Zadoc
 
> How is anyone to know if this driver hasn't been
> cracked/hacked or even used legally and corrupted
> by a bad FFS error?
 
Reality check!?
 
The existance of the routine was verified by several unbiased 3rd parties.

[Paul_Gadd]

We will not be purchasing, supporting or endorsing any of their hardware or software.

I hope many other people follow that route instead of all this Elbox hero worshiping,

Should the amiga community believe anything Elbox says?? NO and the amiga community must NOT support Elbox in any way shape or form to make a point, but Elbox will be forgiven and hero worshiped by the die hards.

[seer]

@platon42

Sigh. You rather believe Elbox with their "facts", which again obviously are *wrong* again.

Like I said, neither party suplied any proof that what they said was true, that means that neither the original poster nor Elbox gave any proof.  YOU came with some thought out facts, something the original poster didn't (IMO) and Elbox still hasn't done (proof that their code doesn't render the HD unusable).

instead of repeatedly posting their statements as dogmatic truth?

I didn't. I just tried to explain how they see it as it seemed that their statement or parts of it were ignored just as many (parts of) statements made bij EG Amiga or Thendic are ignorred as it suits anybody who is against them (or for them).

How did you do this? With a disk monitor? Or with
HDToolbox?

Don't really remember, only that it was a beta or something but it wasn't called a disk monitor but a HD editor. Been about 6 years ago since I played  with the RDB.

 I also used a program a friend of mine developed but he never gave it to anybody except his friends (Was called LeDisk, but I doubt it still exists in any form, it was a real good thing to (ab)use. Allas he died 3 years ago, his family threw out most of his disk soon after he was cremated. At the time I didn't find it important to keep those disks myself. All other friends sold their miggy stuff eons ago) I must admit that I could be mistaken about only destroying the drivetype info tho. It's been far to long to remember.

>Is it possible there are some diffrences on a ZIP RDB ? (Willing to risk your real IDE HD )

No, there is NO difference.

Ok, thanx for the info. (Never used a zip on an Amiga)

>Would be better if you had a higher post count

Now, excuse me, that's stupid. You really think that if this account was faked, the "real" Chris Hodges wouldn't immediately cry out and tell Wayne that there's a fake account of him?

It's not that. AFAIK, I never spoken with you before, so I don't know you. If you had more posts (and if I read them offcourse) I could make a judgement on wheter I would just take your word for it or not. People like Coder, Redrumloa Kronos have a somewhat high post count and everybody here knows them and in a way how they think about certain thinks.

>Offcourse I could still say; you didn't use the driver and some hacking, just some self editing of the RDB but I'll let this pass by

I really cannot help you then. I'll give it up. Believe whatever is easier for you to believe.

It wasn't meant as an offensive. Like I said, you are the only one who posted (again, AFAIK) reliable info on a (IMHO) reliable website, unlike the postings on ANN (Don't read Moonbunny) where anybody can claim to be you or post stuff like "believe me, I know" without any facts or arguments.

But to conclude. If you say the RDB is thrashed after the Elbox code is triggered then I'll take your word for it. Enough typed about this I think.

On a different but not OT note; are you giving Elbox the rights back to distribute your software now they claim the offensive code is taken out ?

[seer]

@Bobson

I dont get what you mean?  :-)

Sometimes you are at Axemans (Not sure I got the name rigth) place and you post with his account or vice versa by mistake :-). Always good for a laugh ;-)

[Bobsonsirjonny]

Ah, I see! :-) no risk of that happening now though - were 350 miles apart.... But I'll be due south this weekend to see MONSTERS OF ROCK IN CARDIFF - Alice Cooper live :-D :-D :-D :pint: :pint:

The Axeman and me are both going - its Axemans birthday as well, he's gonna be hitting 25  (Old man :-P )

Its gonna be a huge laugh. I've managed to get three days off, so I go down on the saturday - see Alice on the monday, come back up on the Tuesday, spend Wednesday with Tamar, then back in work on the Thursday :-)

Its a shame that there is not a ROCK smiley :-D

[redrumloa]

Its a shame that there is not a ROCK smiley

[platon42]

@seer

> Like I said, neither party suplied any proof that what they said was
> true, that means that neither the original poster nor Elbox gave any proof.

Well, Qwe released a tool to decode the driver and see for yourself.

>> Now, excuse me, that's stupid. You really think that if this account was faked, the "real" Chris Hodges wouldn't immediately cry out and tell Wayne that there's a fake account of him?
>
>It's not that. AFAIK, I never spoken with you before, so I don't know you. If you had more posts (and if I read them offcourse) I could make a judgement on wheter I would just take your word for it or not.

Normally, I don't take much part in these news forums -- most of it is a lot of time wasted.

> People like Coder, Redrumloa Kronos have a somewhat high post count and everybody here knows them and in a way how they think about certain thinks.

Sure. I do post to amiga-news.de or ann.lu a bit more often than on amiga.org.

>> I really cannot help you then. I'll give it up. Believe whatever is easier for you to believe.
>
> It wasn't meant as an offensive.

Neither from me. I didn't feel offended, rather just... well, like talking
to a wall that's always in doubt. I feel a bit exhausted, you see. Like all
this discussion leading nowhere (because we both have our opions and won't
let us persuade or deceive ourselfs -- which is actually a GoodThing(TM) ).

> But to conclude. If you say the RDB is thrashed after the Elbox code is triggered then I'll take your word for it. Enough typed about this I think.

I hope so. Going on much too long now

> On a different but not OT note; are you giving Elbox the rights back to
> distribute your software now they claim the offensive code is taken out ?

usb.device version with the offending code removed will remain working, but
no, distibution rights will not be regained by denying having done
something wrong and illegal and not apologizing, or offending me and
calling me a cracker or pirate. You see, I do not trust Elbox anymore and
co-operation has to be based on trust first.

[AmiGR]

A WHAT!? An UNIMPORTANT BIT OF THE RDB!?
Ok... If you say so... Now try to recover the rdb
after the RDSK Sect 0 has been overwritten...
Guess what, if you try to do that with HDToolBox,
it will not see the drive, you'll have to reread it's
specs, save it, and GUESS WHAT, it will rewrite
the rest of the RDB, including the partition data.
Only experienced programmers and registered
owners of RDBSalv will be able to recover it
"easily".

[AmiGR]

IT'S PIRATED!? OH SHOCK HORROR!
HE'S ONE OF IT'S COPYRIGHT HOLDERS YOU SHEEP!
HE made this driver possible by making his USB stack. The driver uses HIS API.

[quenthal]

It seems that I accidentally made new thread instead of replying here - my apologies.. here it goes again:

So for all you windoze users and Elbox-bashers, what are your suggestions for upgrade, if Elbox is to be boycotted? WinXP?

Not all of us are running Windoze-boxes here, and getting Classic Amigas up to date, some form of PCI is required.

Prometheus?
- Not too many drivers, no DMA.
- DMA is not supported even in AmigaOS4.0, if Matay doesn't provide new roms for it.

G-Rex?
-No future support in OS4.0
-Not many new drivers since Pegasos started to gain space.

Elbox Mediator?
-No, they are the bad guys.
-It is the best and most commonly used PCI-solution. hw-wise
-It WILL be supported in AmigaOS4.0, as stated by Hyperion. OS4.0 pci.library and PCI-peripheral-drivers will be coded by Hyperion & that 3rd party drivergroup who are responsible for those.

Draw your own conclusions. Should I and others just stop using them, hope that this boycott will do it's job, and lose the complete support from Elbox?

I'll personally buy AmigaOne and/or Pegasos, but i would still like to upgrade my A4k/PPC/060 to the max

I can see no excuses what Elbox did, but they made sort of apology by removing that evil piece of code. Not nearly enough. And now they are under heavy surveillance, and probably won't try it again. What penalty would you think would be enough? Just hope that no-one buys Amiga stuff from them anymore, and get rid of this cancer of amiga? Sometimes I can't understand these continuous bashings, when majority of those who are loudly making their points out over and over again are not even (current/potential) users of Elbox' products.

-q

[Paul_Gadd]

[Zadoc]

IT'S PIRATED!? OH SHOCK HORROR!
HE'S ONE OF IT'S COPYRIGHT HOLDERS YOU SHEEP!

Wow...you don't read english very well do you?  I never discredited him from holding copyright...go back and read my posts again I am am tired of repeating my argument.

For some reason I almost feel like I've stumbled on to Ann.lu...