HDToolbox- Cheetah SCSI HDD- Install Problem

[thewalrus]

Can anybody help me?
I am trying to install a Seagate SCSI Cheetah HDD to my A4000 which has a existing IBM SCSI HDD fitted, Cyberstorm PCC board and OS3.9.(1&2 updates installed)
My problem is this.
The Cheetah drive shows up after scanning for it using the Cyberstorm SCSI software. Using the Cyberstorm or HDD toolbox I save the changes after partitioning etc and then reboot the system in which one should see the partitions show up on the workbench so I can then format them but they don't!
If I go back in to HD Toobox or the Cyberstorm Toolbox the drive has disapeared with only the IBM drive showing.
SO the HDD Tool boxes are not reading the drive on re boot!
I have tried everything like low level formating the drive
making sure it is bootable etc etc
I also tried installing using ther old 3.1 toolbox by changing the tooltype to cybppc device but it will not read the drive at all. The drives have active terminators at each end. The IBM SCSI drive works fine on the same bus.
Can anybody help?
Thanks in advance
The walrus

[PPC]

Hi,

The solution to your problem is very simple, you have to update the RDB (Rigid Disk Block) from Hd toolbox, dunno which knob you have to press from my head but i think it was update rdb or something, anyway your amiga should say that something has changed then, reboot and your partions of the new drive should appear nicely.

Grz,

PPC :-D

[thewalrus]

Thanks for the response but unfortunately it makes on difference.  I define or update or load RGB or new Geometry and save changes but still when rebooting no partitions. The drive is lost to both CYPPC tool box and HDD toolbox (under CYPPC device).  As mentioned I've also tried re partitioning and low level formating to no avail. It reads drive type etc fine and when I save the changes I can hear the drive respond to the save change. The problenm seems to be on reboot

[Piru]

low level formating

Whatever you do, don't do this. Luckily the drive most likely ignored your request...

[Framiga]

Which ID have you set for the existing HD and the new one?

I suggest ID0 for the OLD HD and ID1 for the NEW one.

Goto the CSPPC Early BootMenu in the SCSI section (hit ESC during the boot) and check the values for the 2 HDs. (both set to LUN 1)

Leave all to AUTO (bus-mount) Synchron ON

Try also to set the Reset delay (in the ID7-Controller) to 2 seconds.

Good luck :-)

EDIT- ah and try from a shell

version cybppc.device FULL

and post here the version

assuming you have the SCSI chain set as:

ActTerminator >>>> CSPPC >>>> HD-ID0 >>>> HD-ID1 >>>>> ActTerminator

[Thomas]

In addition to what Framiga said, you should do the following:

Let the CyberSCSI software scan the bus, so that the Seagate HDD appears. Then run HDToolbox and click on the IBM HDD. If it tells you that there have been drives added or removed, click on Save.

Bye,
Thomas

[Tahoe]

Piru wrote:

low level formating

Whatever you do, don't do this. Luckily the drive most likely ignored your request...

No no no, low level format is perfectly acceptable on a SCSI drive!
It is one big misconception you could "kill" a drive using lowlevel format. In the early days some IDE drives did not like it. (on Amiga systems only!!)

Here is a snippet for the scsifaq:

Each platter in a disk drive is organized as tracks and sectors. Each sector contains header and trailer information as well as error detection (CRC) data in addition to the actual user data field.

When a disk is manufactured the platters are blank (no sector layout). Before shipping, a special command (usually not documented) is issued to the drive to cause it to lay down the sector headers, blank data fields and good CRC. Also many data patterns may be written to each sector to check for media errors. Any sectors with errors are put into the "manufacturer's defect list" and the drive remembers not to use those sectors in the future. Later, after the drive is shipped, a user may decide to "Low Level Format" the drive if he is having problems, or wants to start with a "clean slate". This is done using the SCSI FORMAT command via a special utility usually supplied by the host adapter manufacturer (usually in the on-board BIOS).

Some side effects of doing a LLF:

The logical block size and any other saved parameters that are set using MODE SELECT will remain the same as they were last set (i.e. they will NOT return to default values). This can be over-ridden with command option bits.
The data fields of the sectors will be set to the manufacturer's default value (usually 00 but not always).
Any bad sectors that were mapped out using RE-ASSIGN BLOCK commands will be available for use again. (i.e. the "grown defect list" is cleared). This can be over-ridden with command option bits.
If a power failure occurs while a LLF is in progress, the drive may be left in an unusable state, requiring return to the manufacturer for repair. It is safest to do this on a system with a UPS.
Usually it is a good idea to LLF a drive when it is installed and then verify (read each sector using a special utility) it. From then on you shouldn't need to LLF it again. A good verify utility will offer the option of re-assigning any bad blocks that are found. These will then be placed in the drive's "grown defect list". The only way to recover blocks that are mistakenly added to the grown defect list is to issue FORMAT UNIT to the drive.
LLF is NOT to be confused with running the MSDOS/Windows utilities called FDISK or FORMAT. FDISK causes a "partition table" to be created which logically divides up a disk for use by multiple filesystems and/or Operating Systems. FORMAT causes a FAT16 filesystem to be initialized in an existing partition. FORMAT is equivalent to the UNIX command mkfs (Make filesystem). FORMAT also reads the entire partition and marks any bad sectors found as unusable in the File Allocation Table. This does NOT cause the drive to add them to the drive's "grown defect list", but does prevent DOS/Windows from using them.

[Tahoe]

What happens if you only connect the Cheetah? I can confirm I have a cheetah drive working with my Cyberstorm.
Check if the IBM drive doesn't have "Last drive" option set.

Also try settings your first partition smaller to something like 4GB (not the full drive)

[thewalrus]

FIXED!!! Many Thanks!! The problem was a setting in the CSPPC Early Boot Menu in the SCSI section which I had not checked. (I had just bought the Cyberstorm and drive and didn't know the early boot menu set SCSI parameters) The version of the software is 44.67 Maybe you could tell me if there is a later version. Anyway many thanks to you all from New Zealand I really appreiate your help!
The Walrus

[Piru]

@Tahoe

No no no, low level format is perfectly acceptable on a SCSI drive!

No it's not. Not anymore. In fact, no modern SCSI device allow you to low level format anyway.

It is one big misconception you could "kill" a drive using lowlevel format. In the early days some IDE drives did not like it. (on Amiga systems only!!)

If you lose power (or manually power off/reboot) while the low level format is in progress you can nuke the drive, permanently. Obviously this is no concern for modern drives that ignore the low level format command altogether.

Here is a snippet for the scsifaq:

...blabla...

You did notice that it's from september 1998? That is over 7 years old, outdated information.

See PC Guide: Low-Level Formatting

[Tahoe]

@Piru:

Oops, you're right, and I misread your previous post.
Some people say it's destructive to use LLF on a (modern) SCSI drive. It's not. It will not blow up your drive, damage it or whatever. It will just ignore the command.
As far as older (most likely to be used in Amiga's) drives go, LLF is perfectly do-able if done right.