Thendic holding Amiga licence and patents?

[System]

@Jedi

A little correction to what you said: MorphOS and AmigaOS 4 don't emulate the custom chips. They use them if they are present (so when running on a A1200, A4000 or A3000 with a PPC card).

[System]

@ JoeAFUA

Just by curiousity, i'd really want to know what is an "Amiga" for you?

To me the name "Amiga" is an exclusive brand/company name, similar to IBM, Atari, Sony or Philips.

A next generation Amiga computer I would see as a fully licensed computer running an official port of AmigaOS. The custom chips are IMO not necessary, but compatibility with them would be a great addition.

Let me explain my point of view with an example:  In 1994 my Amiga was equiped with a cool 4MB Retina BLT Z3 graphic board (1900×1426 8bit 70 Hz or 1024×768 24bit) and 16-bit Toccata soundcard (48KHz).

So the Amiga market was already moving towards 3rd party developed hardware solutions back then. Fellow Amiga users who only owned standard unexpanded Amigas drooled all over my machine, so I believe more people would have expanded their Amigas with 3rd party hardware solutions, if they could afford this at the time.

[System]

@jedi

Yes but as I said, if the chips are not present software that need them (AGA games or any software that use one of the AGA chips) simply don't run on a Pegasos or an AmigaOne. (Of course except if you use UAE).

[System]

Hello,

"Also, it will not emulate the whole 68k OS. Much of the ORIGINAL AMIGA OS is re-written in PPC native code. That is what makes this The Official One."

FYI the MorphOS' A-Box also implement complete fully PPC Native rewrite from scratch of the AmigaOS APIs.

Regards

[System]

@ jedi

I am happy for you, that you are happy with MorphOS and your Pegasos.

What I have seen so far for myself is simply far too unstable for my liking, although the interface is quite nice when it doesn't crash. I hope that Genesi will suprize me at the Aachen show.

As with regard to my personal preference to the AmigaOS4 project currently, this based on the sum of all the things I know so far. The public feature list and interviews done with the AmigaOS4 team gives me alot more insight into their project. Also they have tried to personally answer every single one of my questions.

With regard to my AmigaOne preference, this is based on several facts. Most importantly the hardware is AmigaOS4 licensed already, secondly it offers me a G4 solution already, and finally it offers me an additional 66 Mhz PCI slot in comparison to a Pegasos (Although the Pegasos IS excellent hardware, I agree!).

IMO everyone should just buy whatever makes them happy, and respect the choice of others.  :-D

[System]

I wish you the same with AmigaOS4 and AmigaOne

Thanks, maybe one day if there would exist a fully AmigaOS4 licensed version of the Pegaos, I will buy this as well for comparison articles.

I would like say the same for AmigaOS4 on AmigaOne. That would say that AmigaOS4 is already available.

What I have stated before, is that most important to me is that they offer me a good quality product. If this takes more time, then so be it.

As from my AmigaOS fan perspective, I want a real AmigaOS4 port with all those mentioned features and components. With regard to the MorphOS/ABox solution , my personal perspective is that I already own Amithlon. Amithlon in combination with new 68k versions of AmigaOS4 components does sound good to me as well. Although it is unsure we would actually see this happening some day, while those components *are* reportably already running very stable with Amithlon. Still I strongly prefer an official, modern and native AmigaOS port for modern hardware.

For your information, MorphOS is more and more stable day after day, and crashes very less.

I am looking forward to testing this myself at the upcoming Aachen show then.  :-)

but who for AmigaOS4 on AmigaOne (except the Hyperion team and a boot Firmware).

Hyperion have demonstrated that the AmigaOS kernel, ExecSG, is operating with full functionality on AmigaOne hardware already. Also many AmigaOS4 components have already been demonstrated at various Amiga shows.

Are you sure that AmigaOne offers you a G4 solution already ?...

Yes, you can get more info on this offer here. The boards will be delivered before christmas if people order them now.

[System]

Hello,

"MorphOS, and this is the point I want to stress the most, is not AmigaOS compatible, because it missed the MOST IMPORTANT part of being AmigaOS compatible, and that is compatible with AmigaOS PowerPC applications.

Sure the old 68k stuff has some importance, but after PowerPC is standard on all newly bought Amigas...or pegasos boards if you must include them....then the 68k stuff will be old news very fast.

Don't get me wrong, you can't skip the step of being 68k code compatible and call yourself an Amiga, but then you must also be Amiga OS PowerPC compatible too!"

For your information, MorphOS is fully compatible with AmigaOS PowerPC applications using PowerUP or WarpUP.
So you can of course run your AmigaOS 68k software but of course also your AmigaOS WarpUP PowerPC software and PowerUP PowerPC software.

And in case you'll ask, you can also run your favorites Warp3D games.

Regards

[System]

@ JoeAFUA

vFor your information, MorphOS is fully compatible with AmigaOS PowerPC applications using PowerUP or WarpUP.

Being PowerUp or WarpOS compatible is not the same as being PPC AmigaOS compatible. It is very unlikely that MorphOS would run native AmigaOS4 applications anytime soon.

[System]

@Mike:

As there are no native AmigaOS 4 applications for now yes indeed it's hard to be compatible with them. In fact the "AmigaOS 4" we see in the screenshots isn't compatible with these applications too (which is in fact an AmigaOS 3.x with some components planned for AmigaOS 4)

[System]

Hello,

"Who cares? It will still take a long time until OS4 will run on the AmigaOne (and therefore for OS4-only apps). Just because integrating the 68k-emu and all the different components takes much time and reveals many new problems. Just look at the progress the MorphOS-team made - they as well needed very much time for these steps."

Yes indeed and I would add: Look at the development time of other OSes like Linux, Windows, MacOS, MacOS X, OpenBeOS...etc
You can see that even when the OS is ready (I mean everything is running together and almost complete, which is even not the case of AmigaOS 4 today), the betatesting period is at least of 6 months and even 1 year.

 The public betatesting period of the Jaguar update of OS X (I just talk about complete builds betatesting) have taken one year, and it's just an update for OS X 10.1 which is nothing compared to a complete port that need kernel rewrite and some other parts rewrite like OS 4. The same can be said for every OSes on the market.

So according to what we see in the computing industry as soon as the first complete build will be ready for betatests, Joe Users will still have to wait at least 6 months or 1 year because of the needed betatesting period.

Regards

[System]

Hello,

"You perport to know the very details of when OS4 will be available"

You don't need to know exactly what is going on at Hyperion to see that OS 4 can't be available for March 2003.
It's just a matter of rationality and a bit of software development experience or observations.

As i've already said in a previous post, but you must have not read it, all the other OSes on the planet had a full builds betatesting period of at least 6 months and most of the time it's 1 year.
Full build betatesting means betatesting of completely built OS (also known as final betatests) so this happen AFTER betatesting of each elements by themselves.

As i've already said, OS X 10.2 (codenamed Jaguar) which is only an update for OS X 10.1 (Puma) had an external (so made by external people, and so after the internal betatests) final betatesting period of 1 year (again final betatesting == complete build betatesting). And it's just an update for OS X 10.1, which is nothing in term of work compared to OS 4.
As OS 4 is also an OS and so also a software it'll also need external final betatests.
Don't tell me this has already started, as at the WOA SE no complete build were ready yet and even if there is one now, that would mean we have to wait 6 months or 1 year before the consumer release if we consider they start the external final betatesting know.
And you don't need to be very good in maths to see that today+6months (at least) does not equal to March 2003

As you can see, here I just used real facts from the industry and from the official status of OS 4 at the WOA SE show. I've not used any kind of things that are not real facts.
So here it's not a prediction of the future, it's just using verified facts to make you realize that there is some things in the life that are simply not reasonnably possible. Or maybe OS 4 Team is so good that they can even be better than any other developpers team in the past?
I don't think so

Regards

[System]

@BBRV

WHAT? a contract is under NDA?!?!? My theacher of civil law will burn me alive like a witch if I ever *think* such a thing!!!  :-o  :-o

a contract is always a PUBLIC DEED, and therefore can be requested/viewed/published by anyone interested in the matter of the contract!

Clauses of NDA for contracts are outlawed by EU laws. Simply they doesn't exists. The reason is: the commons have the right to prevent actions - sanctionned by such contracts - that may cause harm to them or to the public.

 So, Ben Hermans can publish it here without any worries about penalties. Usually trials take a very looong time here in europe...   :-D  :-D

dear BBRV, change marketing tactics, please. If you ever want to sell your pegasos to me, then ship amigaOS on it. Stop.

[System]

A NDA is a *contract* like any other. Use good sense, please.  

I just wanted to say that it's forbidden by EU laws to put in a contract any clause that forbid one or both parts to make that contract public. And penalties for violation of such that clauses don't apply, of course.  If i ask a copy of that contract to B.H., he can give me it without worrying about Genesi's "retaliations".
(And it's perfectly lawful to publish that contract on the web.)

About case law...EU is not based on common law like your country. Is based on civil law. A case law doesn't rule for future cases, it'is a case judged by the civil law rules.

About urls, i always suppose that google is your friend in any post I make.

Hint: search for Treaty of Rome, Treaty of Amsterdam, and any EU country's civil code.

Wiccan? what are those? a kind of rascals?  :-D  :-D  :-D

Per gli italiani: la clausola di NDA su contratti e' una *clausola vessatoria*. Tali clausole sono *nulle* per legge. Cfr. codice civile.