This Amiga 4000D has a secret:-D

[redrumloa]

The internals of your 4k seems to be very dusty...

It sure is:-) This A4k isn't my personal one, it's a recent purchase we use for testing.. Yes I do need to tear it down and give it a bath some day soon :lol:

Did you buy those PCI cable extension thingies?

The right angle adapter is a direct off the shelf part.

The pci-flex cable was specially made, but is very close to an off the shelf part.

[adolescent]

Wow, that looks like it would actually fit into an A3000D! :-o   I think if you used 2 of the ribbon type extenders you could run the netcard out the back also.

Now, to wait for more price drops.  :-D

[Ilwrath]

A right-angle PCI adaptor, and a couple thin PCI routing cables.  Farkin' brilliant!  No one did it, because no one even thought of it, I bet.  

Well done.  :-)

[redrumloa]

Wow, that looks like it would actually fit into an A3000D!

Sure it will, why not! Actually I have an A3000D here which I will test to make sure. I'll probably take pictures of that to.

I think if you used 2 of the ribbon type extenders you could run the netcard out the back also.

It can be done, but the end result is actually much less clean and you end up losing a 3rd slot. The biggest limitation is the length of the cable, you really can't go any longer than the current cable.

Now, to wait for more price drops.

Honestly there probably won't one any time soon. I simply wanted to gauge the potential market, in an obviously narrow way, but still it gave me enough feedback. The current stock will need to be exhausted at the current price. (We're not getting rich, trust me).

[Glaucus]

Good job Red! Maybe you should send one of those puppies over and I'll do an in-depth review of the whole conversion! ;-) And if you let me keep it, I'll be sure to make it a glowing review!  :-P

  - Mike

[Bodie_CI5]

@ redrum

arghh... if only I'd seen this thread earlier... :-(

[Brian]

Great that it worked... personaly I never bothered trying out this as I had a tower just waiting to get used but impressive, a tad bit sad that I sold the Prom now that I see that it actually work in a A4000D.

A few comments... the network connector should be at the back (possibly on the same backplate as the voodoo card), the network card should be one of them newer ones that are tiny and sleek because as it is now it looks like the 2nd and 3rd PCI slot is next to impossible to extend and with such a card one more PCI slot would be freed up. Not seen on the picture but most likely there is some isolasion fo the top PCI card so it won't short against the top of the case. I'm concerned about heat though... does it run hot already? and what then when scandoubler and 2 full length Zorro cards get in there aswell?

[nOw2]

It's not just the 4000D, this would allow it to fit the 4000T and leave four Zorro slots available. A bit more research and a few more options on these PCI extender thingys and you could be on to a winner. I'm sure there are many like me who'd like PCI but just aren't going to mess about with new casing and don't want to loose Zorro slots.

I must say I'd be very interested in a kit.. !

[redrumloa]

the network connector should be at the back (possibly on the same backplate as the voodoo card),

Yeah, that would be nice.. I'm trying to find parts to do such a thing..

as it is now it looks like the 2nd and 3rd PCI slot is next to impossible to extend and with such a card one more PCI slot would be freed up

Actually no! I can easily use a third PCI card in this setup. I can move the 8029 over over, and the prometheus down one slot, and use a taller right angle adapter in the back slot. I actually like the outcome of the right angle adapter over the flex cable, and the original idea was to only use right angle adapters. Unfortunately the voodoo 3 is simply too damn long. Even in the very back slot it is about 1/4 inch too long and the case won't close:-(

Not seen on the picture but most likely there is some isolasion fo the top PCI card so it won't short against the top of the case.

Aaah you are VERY observent, aren't you! :-D Good call and yes you are right. The nic card as is, is dangerously close to the case. It doesn't quite touch, but I certainly wouldn't take the chance. So yes, this does require some insulation between the card and case. For testing I simply used a layer of black electrical tape, it worked but is not an elegant solution. I have a better idea, which I am almost certain will be a perfect permenant solution.

I'm concerned about heat though... does it run hot already?

As it sits right now, no. There is enough room between the voodoo and the rest of the cards for it to breathe. I also have the CS-PPC unobrstructed. The Prometheus itself and the 8029 nic don't create much heat themselves.

and what then when scandoubler and 2 full length Zorro cards get in there aswell?

I guess that depends on the boards, though I don't think most old zorro expansions were known as heaters. Heat has always been a concern for desktop cases, but IMO not really for the hlaf of the case with the zorro slots. The big heat concern is the side of the case with the ultra expensive accelerator. Especially the A3000D, there really is no room there for the accelerator to breathe. I really don't think this prommy setup will contribute much if any to the heat on the turbocard side of the case.

[AltRN8]

I had thought of this right after getting my Prometheus but was concerned about spending the money on the PCI right angle bracket. There were active bridging extenders and passive ones and I was not sure which would work.

Glad you got around to experimenting with it. Great job!
Why did you need a special extender cable?

[tjaoz]

Funny hack! ;-)

It is like driving a car at 250km/h when your car has the E-speed tires (up to 70km/h) :-)

Do not complain with your PCI card seller if this card does not work in this case or is not stable. The PCI specification does not allow passive PCI expanders! E.g. the PCI Address&Data trace lengths from the busboard's (Prometheus, in this case) PCI connector to the pins of the PCI chip on the PCI card (the pins of the Avenger chipset in Voodoo 3) are limited to 1.5 inch!

In case of regular Voodoo 3 PCI card, these traces (Address&Data) have about 1 inch each. If you add about 3 inches of a cable expander, you break the PCI specification by the factor of 2.7! In your case these traces have (with the expander) 4 inches instead of 1.5 inch that is allowed.

In case of the PCI CLK signal, you break the PCI spec by the factor of 30! :-) (You have added 3 inches when the PCI spec allows adding 0.1 inch at the most.)

Here is the relevant part of the PCI Specification:

4.4. Expansion Board Specification
(...)

4.4.3 Physical Requirments
4.4.3.1 Trace Lenght Limits

Trace lengths from the top of the expansion board's edge connector to the PCI device are as follows:

i. The maximum trace lengths for all 32-bit interface signals are limited to 1.5 inches for 32-bit and 64-bit expansion boards. This includes all signals groups except those listed as "System Pins," "Interrupt pins," and "JTAG Pins."

ii. The trace length of the additional signals used in 64-bit expansion are limited to 2 inches on all 64-bit expansion boards.

iii. The trace length for the PCI CLK signal is 2.5 inches +/- 0.1 inches for 32-bit and 64-bit expansion boards and must be routed to only one load.

[redrumloa]

@tjaoz

Welcome back Tojaz! It's been a while, I was worried about you. How are things in Krakow?

[Piru]

Good to see that Elbox is worried about competition.

[redrumloa]

I've experiemted with the A3000 and come to a couple of conclusions. It can be implemented cleaner, but you either lose a 3rd zorro slot, or you lose the video slot. The A3000D case is shorter and wider. The extra width makes it possible to simply use 2 right angle adapters, and no flex adpater cable. Interesteing.. More testing, and experimenting going on....

[tjaoz]

@redrumloa

Welcome back Tojaz!

Welcome back Jim!

It's been a while, I was worried about
you.

Sorry for a brake. During the last weeks I hadn't access to the internet.
I was spending my holiday sailing on the yacht. :-)

How are things in Krakow?

Well! Nice weather, many interesting thing is happening here.
I just go to see the final concert of the Jewish Culture Festival "Shalom in Szeroka Street".

Bye for now,

Jacek

[tjaoz]

@Piru,

Sorry for disappoint you, I'm not from Elbox.