800Mhz A1G3XE the best choice than the 800Mhz A1G4XE?

[SlimJim]

Helgis75

> [...] and someone mentioned that the G4 seems harder to  
> deliver than the G3....Tougher shipment for the G4 than the
> G3...
 
I wrote something to that effect, but you must really learn
 not to take every little comment and make it into a fact.
You do that a lot you know.
 
 To take this case as an example, I am no employee of
Eyetech, nor do I have any inside info as to what kind of
agreements they have with chip producers. Most comments
in here is like that. I hoped that was clear in my post (I
apologize if it was not) but yet you take it as some sort of
usable fact on which to base your opinion.
 Not very serious now, when seeing the thread in context,
but if repeated in some other place as FACT, it becomes
misinformation. Such behaviour is called "jumping to
conclusions" and is one of the major ways to start a nasty
rumour. I want no part of it.
 
 Please consider this, when reading comments. Most of
what is written is just assumptions/fears/hopes/dreams,
without any factual backing at all. Learn to be a little more
discriminating.
.
SlimJim

[Agafaster]

"delivery difficulyies"
the G3 models are IIRC IBM chips, whereas the G4 are all Motorola. As we all know, Mot have a deal with Apple where Mr Jobs soaks up a huge proportion of PPC output. as far as I know, IBM has no such deal. doesnt matter anyway, now. motorola have apparently delivered Eyetech's G4s

[HyperionMP]

I can't subscribe to this point of view.

I think it is far more likely that the architectural improvements of the 750FX simply do not show up in the results of the SPEC 95 benchmarks.

If you take a look at the G4+ architecture, you'll find that Motorola has made a lot of improvements compared to the original G4 design.

[ksk]

@HyperionMP

From IBM.com...

for 900 Mhz 750FX SpecInt95 39.9 and SpecFp95 21.8 ...and after I brutally scale it to 733Mhz, it's 31 and 17.

for 700 Mhz 750CXe SpecInt95 is 27.2peak (matches motorollas value for 733Mhz chip) and 25.5base, fp is 14.3peak and 13.9base. If I scale the  CXe to 733, its "only" 28.5peak and ...

Anyway... values do not match. FX should have better spec values than what Motorolla admits, etc etc. I bet IBM knows their own chips better than Motorolla.

IMO, it's clear that Motorolla PR man has just cut&pasted those 700Mhz 750CXe values to both 733 CXe and to 733FX ... damn, there is not even a CPU clock multiplier for a 733Mhz CXe...

But anyway, let's forget about that PR material.

IMHO:  the speed advantage of G4 at the same clock is not significant, especially if Altivec is not utilized. (I'm still going to go for the G4...)

OFF TOPIC:
@HyperionMP

Have anyone managed to run any SMP apps on LinuxPPC on (any) ArtisiaS machine(s)?


((btw.  none of this is meant as a offending post, just my points and a fair question))

[Helgis75]

I was a bit confused to what to go for, and this also affected Datakompaniet a little while, but i was fast enough to tell them that i keep sticking to the best choice actually - the A1G4XE, no matters how fast it will be...so, i should be safe about that...

[ksk]

Helgis75, if you want to start playing with the LinuxPPC before AOS4 ships, go for it. Do not worry wether it's G3 or G4.

No matter how it ends up, you can most likely upgrade the CPU easily, if you later deside so.

If the G4 model is not available when AOS4 ships I get the other chip, if it's available.

[Helgis75]

ksk wrote:
Helgis75, if you want to start playing with the LinuxPPC before AOS4 ships, go for it. Do not worry wether it's G3 or G4.

No matter how it ends up, you can most likely upgrade the CPU easily, if you later deside so.

If the G4 model is not available when AOS4 ships I get the other chip, if it's available.

Good advice, my dear friend:-) I let the order be unchanged now (A1G4XE it is), as long as it will arrive...If not, in time for OS4 to be delivered, then it should be the G3-XE instead...

But clearly, the G4 must be the best one, right? Many reasons for that, isn't it?

[Ami603]

Still prefer My ordered G4XE for sure!
Here i have some stuff already waiting:
ATI Radeon 8500 DDR TV
LG CDRW 48x 12x 52x
both 7200 ATA133 80&40 Hardisks
oops! seems to have missed a nice Keyboard/mice and
Tower!I must go for it now!
Since XE had audio headers, live! can be later.

waiting the most important thing...
:hammer::hammer::hammer::hammer::hammer::hammer::hammer:
Motherboard & RAM!!!!

[Ami603]

Maybe I`ll reach 50 posts (two checkered cubes)
before i get the motherboard...
:ranting::cry::ranting::flame::madashell::destroy:

[Helgis75]

You are actually right! Still waiting for my A1G4XE mobo...I caused a little confusion at Datakompaniet when reading about the update to the A1G3XE, but i was luckily fast enough to send mail back and demand to keep sticking to the A1G4XE order! :-)

These are what i have:

Black Chieftech Dragon MIDI-Tower w/360W PSU + 4 Cooler-fans
1GB SDRAM DIMMs (2 parts 512MB 133Mhz Buf.Reg.ECC-type)
Black internal 1.44MB HD-Floppy
Black internal Samsung 16x/48x DVD-ROM EIDE/ATAPI
Black internal Plextor 40x/12x/40x CDRW EIDE/ATAPI
Crucial ATI Radeon 8500LE 128MB DDR AGP card
SoundBlaster Live Digital 5.1 PCI-soundcard
Logitech Cordless Desktop Comfort/Optical MouseMan

Remaing parts are:

120GB x 2 Western Digital harddrives
19" Hyundai DynaFlat SVGA Silver/Black monitor
Inspire 6700 6.1 Digital Surround-speakers..

That's all..:-)

[ksk]

@Helgis75
>But clearly, the G4 must be the best one, right? Many reasons for that, isn't it?

The comparisson is not simple.

G4 has the Altivec, 750FX has larger cache, G4 has extra instruction unit, 750FX has shorter instruction pipeline, G4 can have L3 cache, 750FX consumes only 5.7W of power at 1Ghz, etc...

 With the Altivec optimized code G4 can do unbelieveable things in scientific applications and it does have faster FPU... and it has better SMP support than the G3.

IMO: G4 is slightly better.  If G4 is fully used it's a lot better...


I think some Hyperion guy once said that Warp3D might benefit from Altivec ... that could yield better 3D performance...

[Helgis75]

ksk wrote:
@Helgis75
>But clearly, the G4 must be the best one, right? Many reasons for that, isn't it?

The comparisson is not simple.

G4 has the Altivec, 750FX has larger cache, G4 has extra instruction unit, 750FX has shorter instruction pipeline, G4 can have L3 cache, 750FX consumes only 5.7W of power at 1Ghz, etc...

 With the Altivec optimized code G4 can do unbelieveable things in scientific applications and it does have faster FPU... and it has better SMP support than the G3.

IMO: G4 is slightly better.  If G4 is fully used it's a lot better...


I think some Hyperion guy once said that Warp3D might benefit from Altivec ... that could yield better 3D performance...

Clearly impressive stuffs! Damn it! What the hell! I keep sticking with my A1G4XE order then! Here we go!!! :-)  :-D  :-D  :-D  :-D  8-)  8-)  :-o  :oops:  :roll:  :hammer:  :crazy:  :destroy:  :destroy:  :flame:  :flame:  :destroy:

[Ami603]

HOW!!?!? Your Radeon 8500 has 128Mb DDR?
Mine only had 64Mb.But is an ATI itself,not a Powered by
Ati GFX card,what differences and how about performance at all?

[JurassicCamper]

Ami603 wrote:
Still prefer My ordered G4XE for sure!
Here i have some stuff already waiting:
ATI Radeon 8500 DDR TV
LG CDRW 48x 12x 52x
both 7200 ATA133 80&40 Hardisks
oops! seems to have missed a nice Keyboard/mice and
Tower!I must go for it now!
Since XE had audio headers, live! can be later.

waiting the most important thing...
:hammer::hammer::hammer::hammer::hammer::hammer::hammer:
Motherboard & RAM!!!!

I've gone for the XE G4 like most. Ordered mine 2 months ago so this new option was not available.
The way i see it there is a price difference of £50 for a reason. You pay for what you get.

Bought a Radeon 8500 but I've got an AGP Voodoo 3 3000 to use until the Warp3D radeon drivers are ready.

7200RPM 40gig Maxtor HD
ATA 100/133 80 Wire "glow in the dark round cables"
Floppy - Glow in the dark round cable.
1 GIG of RAM
2 Blue LED case fans
2 Blue Cold cathode tubes
LG 48x15x48 CDRW
Liteon DVD-ROM
Soundblaster live 5.1
Wireless PS Keyboard & Mouse
V770K Blue / Silver Case with transparent side panel. Front USB / Audio connectors.
Boing ball power button.

[Helgis75]

Ami603 wrote:
HOW!!?!? Your Radeon 8500 has 128Mb DDR?
Mine only had 64Mb.But is an ATI itself,not a Powered by
Ati GFX card,what differences and how about performance at all?

Glad you asked, buddy:-) Made by ATI yes, but delivered by Crucial. 128MB yes, at 250Mhz clock speed with 128-bit DDR-memory...Not that bad at all..That's why it called 8500LE....:-)

[Ami603]

The worst difference about both your and my system are that
i can Have OS4 Sooner than you,in fact,i ALREADY have it!
:-D:-D