Thinking to change to the dark side (blue)

[redrumloa]

@pablotinch

Hi!
If you can afford it and you can find one available for delivery, why the heck not? Put all the squabbling and internal politics of the Amiga community aside and the Pegasos + MorphOS is one impressive system for an old Amiga user. IMO don't look at it as making some incredible plunge or breaking an unwritten oath(:-P), they are all just products that are either available, not available, or semi available.

Let me just make one suggestion though. [color=CC0000]DON'T PREORDER[/color] a Pegasos. If you can find a dealer with one in stock, then that's a green light go ahead. But from my own comfort level I wouldn't recomend paying up front right now if they are not in stock.

[odin]

redrumloa wrote:

Let me just make one suggestion though. [color=CC0000]DON'T PREORDER[/color] a Pegasos. If you can find a dealer with one in stock, then that's a green light go ahead. But from my own comfort level I wouldn't recomend paying up front right now if they are not in stock.

That goes for everything in Amigaland really. If people haven't learned not to preorder anything (well, not prepaying that is) by now, they must not be too intelligent (I learnt my lesson with the FusionPPC debacle :-x).

[Warface]

odin wrote:

That goes for everything in Amigaland really. If people haven't learned not to preorder anything (well, not prepaying that is) by now, they must be not too intelligent (I learnt my lesson with the FusionPPC debacle :-x).

I completely agree. My lesson came from the Phase5 G4 cards :-) Luckily there are numerous dealers with Pegasos II stock.

[Kronos]

@red

"PreOrdering" was never a problem, prepaying is  :-D

There is surely no problem to pre-order at most of Genesi's distributors, as long as they don't ask any upfront money.

PrePaying is something I never did, and never will do.

[ksk]

(I hope I'm not trying to pretend I'm unbiased. )


@KennyR

>A lot of people seem to believe that getting MorphOS or supporting the people behind it attack AmigaOS.

Look at what Buck is doing. Don't you think he is a threat to AOS?
IMO: It is important that AOS is protected from being locked to a single HW manufacturer YET again.

Now, how would you prove that none of the $$$ given to Genesi is not used against AOS by Buck?

> They should realise that AmigaOS was last released in 1993 by Commodore.
> You can't attack it because it's dead.

Pretty ridiculous thinking.

>The current AmigaOS 4 is simply a PDA content company mistitled Amiga Inc and Hyperion's vision of AmigaOS.
>It is no more or no less bPlan's vision of it, or Bernd Meyer's vision of it, or AROS's vision of it.

Also you know that AOS4 is the evolution of AOS. Partly based on the same code. Same 68k binaries even.
Current MOS is a clone of AOS3.x for PPC + "extensions".

In the ideal world we would have a community parlament deciding of AOS development ...
closest to that is AROS. But too bad, aros is still half decade behind those others...
(depends on the manpower put to the development, ofcourse)

Interesting difference between AOS and MOS is that MOS is for advancing Pegasos sales, made by the HW company.
AOS is developed separately from the HW company, aimed to run on multiple HW platforms.




@Warface

>MorphOS started with a huge emotional handicap, most of the community hated it.

IMO, almost everybody loved MOS in the beginning. It was the AOS kind of OS / enchancement kit for AOS, while AInc was inventing the wheel again... raping the name perhaps.

When AOS development was restarted things changed. AOS was back.

>AmigaONE sales are generated by the Amiga name.

Right. And people's wish to support AOS development. (the licence of AOS4 is paid with every earlybird board)

> Pegasos sales are generated by either ppl being fed up with the other alternative, or (magic!) they try MorphOS out and fall in love.

Pegasos is for instant sex, kind of.

>There are features in MorphOS which will not be available till OS4.2, 4.3 and a few years,

I do not seem to remember or know those. Would you care to list them?


>... in other areas OS4 is years behind.

I would like to see that list...


But yes. Try it out is the key.
(advising anybody to wait is dangerous business, every Amiga company + Genesi looks like they are going titts up overnight, some do, some do not)

[redrumloa]

(I hope I'm not trying to pretend I'm unbiased. )

Ha! You sure don't look unbiased :lol:

Look at what Buck is doing. Don't you think he is a threat to AOS?

No more than the very credible damage McEwen did to Genesi' sales. "We will shut you down", "morphOS is based on illegal source code" is what created the major rift we have today and is also the reason for Buck's over-the-top legal reaction. It certainly caused a major loss of sales for Pegasos boards.

AOS is developed separately from the HW company, aimed to run on multiple HW platforms.

This is the exact same thing as the Pegasos. AOS runs on exactly the same number of hardware platforms as MOS, 2. Whether either OS will make the leap to a third hardware platform is highly debatable and probably unlikely.

Just playing devils advocate:-)

[Paul_Gadd]

Amiga Inc, eyetech and of course the incompetents of Hyperion no offense.

What did you really expect? there is no professional companies left in this market. finding a half decent Amiga company is very challenging and time consuming.

Don’t take this in the wrong way , I just want to be happy

Your worst mistake was purchasing the earlybird Teron board, the best thing to do now is waste no more money on promised products from two bit Amiga companies because they can not and never will be trusted.

Pick whats best for you and judge from your own eyes instead of peoples biased opinions on product X, you could get Amithlon for the true Amiga experience on good/cheap hardware.

So the world may know.

[Cymric]

pablotinch wrote:
Thinking to change to the dark side (blue)

There are no 'dark sides'. There are only computers. Computers are a interesting mix of plastics, semi-conductors and bits of flimsy metal which get the job done you want done. If your main motivation in using your computer is to belong to a certain 'camp', you're using the computer for the entirely wrong reason. Take a few deep breaths and let go of this rather kinky and adolescent fetish: your identity is not derived from your computer.

5)   Anyone can try to convince me to change to the Pegasus platform?
  Don’t take this in the wrong way , I just want to be happy.

Doesn't sound like you're happy, and I'm fairly sure that you're looking for arguments which make you feel less guilty about thinking to 'join the Dark Side'. So instead of burdening your mind with this silly nonsense, go out and locate a Pegasos dealer. Play with the Pegasos and see if it meets your demands. If not, you can relax in the satisfaction you have resisted Temptation and wait for OS4. If it does, go ahead and buy it. Even if you're still wracked by doubt as to whether you made the right purchase (since you cannot compare to OS4 right now) do you expect OS4 to be so much better as to make a difference? Keep in mind that if it's 'better' you're after, you're better off with your PC.

My $0,02.

(I have never, do not, and most likely will not own, nor have I ever sat behind, used, or seen an AmigaOne, Pegasos, or Pegaos-II. PCs are fine by me.)

[itix]

Now, how would you prove that none of the $$$ given to Genesi is not used against AOS by Buck?

Bill Buck is bigger threat for MorphOS than AmigaOS (judging by recent mistakes).

[Warface]

ksk wrote:

I do not seem to remember or know those. Would you care to list them?

Mainly I think about the 24 bit internal system from ground up, and their 3D system, of which ATM only the Warp3D wrapper is publicly available.

[Rassilon]

I was really unsure whether to post in this thread, but then I thought why not.  :-)

I think its fair to say that people from both camps (sides sounds so much more combative!) will advise you to go for their respective solution. Both will also say :

'yes there are differences between the two, they are both roughly the same.... but my team is better!!!'

Both solutions have had there ups and downs, and I think having coming this far business wise there isn't too much to choose between them.

As a few have said make up your own mind, try out each solution and make your choice. No amount of pursading by either camp can prove better than first hand experience.

(For reference I have an A1)

Rassilon

[ksk]

hmmm, I preach some more ...

@redrumloa
>>AOS is developed separately from the HW company, aimed to run on multiple HW platforms.

>This is the exact same thing as the Pegasos.

No it is not.

AOS4 is developed by Hyperion. It will be sold by Hyperion.
The initial HW was "arranged" by Eyetech & AInc.
The official strategy is to run AOS on multiple third party HW platforms. (a1 is the first one, then BPPC&CSPPC, Elbox and even Matay (and some even more minor candidate) seem to be waiting for the OS release as well as the KMOS financier)

MOS is developed by bplan.
Pegasos was developed by bplan.
The official strategy is to run as many OS on top of pegasos as possible and perhaps produce games with MOS powered launcher for Mac.
Modern MOS has not been released for BPPC/CSPPC because it would affect pegasos sales.
Already phase5 protected themself against other potential HW manufactures with PowerUP.

As far as I see. It's not the same thing.

>AOS runs on exactly the same number of hardware platforms as MOS, 2.

Let's look at the released versions.
AOS4.x runs on 0 platforms.
MOS1.x runs on 1 platform since y2002. No change after release.

>Whether either OS will make the leap to a third hardware platform is highly debatable and probably unlikely.

Wich one is more unlikely. Red pill or blue Bill is not needed to see that. :lol: (IMHO ofcourse)  

[KennyR]

ksk wrote:
>A lot of people seem to believe that getting MorphOS or supporting the people behind it attack AmigaOS.

Look at what Buck is doing. Don't you think he is a threat to AOS?
IMO: It is important that AOS is protected from being locked to a single HW manufacturer YET again.

No, I think being able to run OS3.x emulated on a PC for a fraction of the price with 99.9% compatibility with Amiga software (far more than MOS or OS4 manages) is the biggest threat to any business venture with the name AmigaOS, not Bill Buck. I think you've totally blown up this guy's significance, and indeed AInc's significance, and the bickering and legal spats between the two of them.

What Buck is doing is called competition, and this magical thing is best for the consumer in ALL cases. If OS4 cannot deal with competition then maybe it's better it died at birth.

>The current AmigaOS 4 is simply a PDA content company mistitled Amiga Inc and Hyperion's vision of AmigaOS.
>It is no more or no less bPlan's vision of it, or Bernd Meyer's vision of it, or AROS's vision of it.
Also you know that AOS4 is the evolution of AOS. Partly based on the same code. Same 68k binaries even.
Current MOS is a clone of AOS3.x for PPC + "extensions".

Yeah yeah, heard it all before. Then from the same people I hear that MOS is based on stolen source code. I wish people would make up their minds.

Truth is probably that the 68k asm was entirely useless to Hyperion. The autodocs would have been much more useful in making a PPC AmigaOS clone - and that's what it is, not a port. MOS is more compatible with OS3.x, so doesn't really make my thinking ridiculous. Yours, on the other hand...

OS4 is no evolution. It's the same as MOS - a PPC clone of OS3.x with 'extentions'. Funnily enough though, MOS's extentions make it more backward compatible. Whaddya know, eh? Must be that stolen source code.

[itix]

Modern MOS has not been released for BPPC/CSPPC because it would affect pegasos sales.

Think this way: releasing MorphOS for BPPC/CSPPC could ruin classic OS4 sales :-D

(Edit - 2nd quote removed)

[cecilia]

pablotinch:
as has been said what is most important is getting your hands on whatever is out there and playing with it.

It was only after I actually saw MOS in person that I was impressed with it. and while it's not perfect, it feels as much like an amiga as WinUAE does.

i'm dying to see OS4. here is ImageFX on OS4.

Who do I have to kill to get my hands on that??? :roflmao:

and people like tokai have been making some very cool programs that work on MOS.

and don't forget AROS, of course.
Amiga is not hardware, or a company under some guy called "bill" (why is everyone called "bill"). Amiga is US. People who don't want to settle for just Windows. Because it's just Not good enough.

there's no such thing as "the dark side". unless you mean gates!  :lol:

[Jose]

@Cymric
I partially disagree and partially agree...
I partially disagree because I don't think there is anything wrong in giving some weight to the "camps". Camps might not be the users but the companies involved, and you do only good if you also consider each companies actions in your choice. Not saying anyone is better or worse though, I think BOTH have their things... One thing to consider is that AInc. is not related to the OS anymore though, so the companies to consider would be Genesi on the blue side and Hyperion, Eyetech, Mai and KMOS (also maybe Elbox too...) on the red camp.


 "I didnt want to get a computer thats as old as the A1 is now"


@Acill
 "...I didnt want to get a computer thats as old as the A1 is now..."
Oh yeah, the specs of the A1 are so much worse :lol:
The A1 has USB1.1 and doesn't have firewire, Pegasus has USB2.0 and Firewire onboard. On the plus side the A1 has more PCI slots and a 2x AGP slot not 1x (if you want to play demanding games, if they ever exist in the future).


@pablotinch
I'd say, hang on a bit more.. It's not like waiting in the darkness anymore because the AOS4 demos are improving show to show and the last ones are, from what has been reviewed, good.
You'll then be able to compare both products too, wich is also a factor to consider.

[EDIT]
Well, if you're a rich guy, you could get both :-D