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AuthorTopic: Where are the Computer Ferraris and Lamborghinis?  (Read 775 times)

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Offline QBit

Where are the Computer Ferraris and Lamborghinis?
« on: September 12, 2018, 09:21:52 PM »
There is only Apple and the lousy rest! And Amiga became a Hoax!

BUILD AN ULTRA HIGH END 100.000 $ Amiga with AI and ULTRA HIGH END CAPABILITIES!

https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/deep-learning-ai/

Jay Miner and Steve Jobs are dead.. so where is Vision?
« Last Edit: September 12, 2018, 09:23:25 PM by QBit »
 

Offline agami

Re: Where are the Computer Ferraris and Lamborghinis?
« Reply #1 on: September 13, 2018, 07:26:12 AM »
The hardware game has changed substantially. The few desktop/personal supercomputer OEMs (Nvidia, Cray) have been commoditised into SIs of Nvidia Tesla and Intel Xeon Phi products.

Nvidia even offers a guide for Build Your Own https://www.nvidia.com/object/tesla_build_your_own.html
Other premium integrators also have configurators https://silentpc.com/elite-pcs/personal-supercomputer
Cray's XC Series is just intel Xeons with Tesla and/or Xeon Phi cards https://www.cray.com/products/computing/xc-series

Xeon Phi seems to be dead, so Nvidia is pretty much the only game in town until someone else enters the space  ;)
https://www.theregister.co.uk/2017/11/16/intel_kills_xeon_phi_knights_hill/
https://www.nextplatform.com/2018/07/27/end-of-the-line-for-xeon-phi-its-all-xeon-from-here/
---------------AGA Collection---------------
1) Amiga A4000 040 40MHz, Mediator PCI, Voodoo 3 3000, Creative PCI128, Fast Ethernet, Indivision AGA Mk2 CR, DVD/CD-RW, OS 3.9 BB2
2) Amiga A1200 040 25MHz, Indivision AGA Mk2 CR, IDEfix, PCMCIA WiFi, slim slot load DVD/CD-RW, OS 3.9 BB2
3) Amiga CD32 + SX1, OS 3.1
 

Offline Iggy

Re: Where are the Computer Ferraris and Lamborghinis?
« Reply #2 on: September 15, 2018, 01:31:58 AM »
How is a computer with a few gpu boards a "supercomputer"?
Did you take note of the relatively low PCIE bandwidth figures being quoted?

A Power9 system with two or more CPUs and Gen4 PCIE would definitely have the potential to outperform the systems mentioned.

Especially if accelerators using CAPI were added.

And, back to outrageous speculation, PPC NG could be ported to Power9, enhanced with memory protection, SMP, and 64 bit addressing, and actually be competitive.

But that isn't going to happen because we don't have the deep pockets needed to finance such development.

So, we're relegated to posting nonsense about Apple systems being worthy, or how Linux and Windows systems can be converted to "supercomputers" with the addition of a few overpriced Nvidia gpu boards.

Maybe it is time to switch to Linux.
Amiga enthusiasts have no vision anymore.
"Not making any hard and fast rules means that the moderators can use their good judgment in moderation, and we think the results speak for themselves." - Amiga.org, terms of service

"You, got to stem the evil tide, and keep it on the the inside" - Rogers Waters

"God was never on your side" - Lemmy

Amiga! "Our appeal has become more selective"
 

Offline agami

Re: Where are the Computer Ferraris and Lamborghinis?
« Reply #3 on: September 15, 2018, 09:03:51 AM »
A Tesla GPGPU is more than a mere GPU, as you are so keen to dismiss it. Furthermore, it's something that can be purchased.
Whilst I too like the concept of CAPI, apart from a few storage, and network FPGA accelerated cards, there are no massively threaded compute offload cards for CAPI. So if one were building a supercluster, then perhaps a CAPI capable interconnect would provide some edge. The cost per activated core on the Power 9 CPU might break the budget though.

So for something that sits on top of, or beneath a desk, and can perform at or above one trillion floating point operations per second, the most cost effective and practical system will be one with an x86-64 multi-core/multi-threaded CPU + multiple Nvidia Tesla GPGPUs.
---------------AGA Collection---------------
1) Amiga A4000 040 40MHz, Mediator PCI, Voodoo 3 3000, Creative PCI128, Fast Ethernet, Indivision AGA Mk2 CR, DVD/CD-RW, OS 3.9 BB2
2) Amiga A1200 040 25MHz, Indivision AGA Mk2 CR, IDEfix, PCMCIA WiFi, slim slot load DVD/CD-RW, OS 3.9 BB2
3) Amiga CD32 + SX1, OS 3.1
 

Offline QBit

Re: Where are the Computer Ferraris and Lamborghinis?
« Reply #4 on: September 15, 2018, 12:01:00 PM »
When I can have such a Computer for 1000€

I'll buy it!

https://www.itsco.de/workstation-hp-z820-2x-intel-twelve-core-xeon-e5-2697-v2-12x-2-7ghz.html

A personal Supercomputer new for 2.800 $ thats nice.. now AROS SMP on it would be really  nice!
« Last Edit: September 15, 2018, 12:16:41 PM by QBit »
 

Offline Iggy

Re: Where are the Computer Ferraris and Lamborghinis?
« Reply #5 on: September 16, 2018, 01:07:54 AM »
Actually Tesla is and has been based on standard Nvidia GPU technology.
Further, Nvidia was consulted during the design of CAPI and there is nothing preventing Tesla from being implemented via that interconnect, at many times the bandwidth you are quoting.
Nvidia, with its NVLink technology, and IBM with CAPI are creating coherent interconnects with 2.5 to 10 times the bandwidth that Intel hardware can provide.

As to applicability, I'm not sure that either idea has much utility for a desktop user.
But it is much faster than merely plugging Tesla boards into PCI-e slots on an X64 system.

This entire thread, and the idea of desktop "supercomputers" borders on ludicrous as there aren't any real applications for this technology.

But, if and when somebody uncovers these applications, the hardware I've mentioned will be able to run circles around the X64 hardware you've mentioned.

And its on hardware that is much closer to our current platforms than PCs.

That seems to frustrate you, but these are just a statistically provable facts.
« Last Edit: September 16, 2018, 02:41:40 AM by Iggy »
"Not making any hard and fast rules means that the moderators can use their good judgment in moderation, and we think the results speak for themselves." - Amiga.org, terms of service

"You, got to stem the evil tide, and keep it on the the inside" - Rogers Waters

"God was never on your side" - Lemmy

Amiga! "Our appeal has become more selective"
 

Offline agami

Re: Where are the Computer Ferraris and Lamborghinis?
« Reply #6 on: September 18, 2018, 03:09:59 AM »
You seem to misunderstand me, and I've even gone as far to say that I am a fan of CAPI.
I'm not talking about which one is better. I'm talking about what is available today for extremely high performance personal workstations, a.k.a personal supercomputers.

The OP was asking where are the computing equivalents of Ferraris and Lamborghinis, i.e. Supercars. I doubt he was talking about PC cases with extreme styling.
So I took it to mean highly over-engineered personal computers with extreme levels of performance. Alas, highly customised workstation OEMs like Silicon Graphics/Sgi are gone. Even Apple has given up on the extreme gigaflops marketing common during its PowerPC G5 era. In a highly commoditised market, there are no Ferrari and Lamborghini equivalents; Just kits.

The biggest problem with Power9 is IBM. A company that is good at spending money on R&D, but lousy when it comes to executing in the marketplace. Power9 architecture is awesome, but all that awesomeness means nothing since it will never be in a practical desktop computer.
« Last Edit: September 18, 2018, 03:12:15 AM by agami »
---------------AGA Collection---------------
1) Amiga A4000 040 40MHz, Mediator PCI, Voodoo 3 3000, Creative PCI128, Fast Ethernet, Indivision AGA Mk2 CR, DVD/CD-RW, OS 3.9 BB2
2) Amiga A1200 040 25MHz, Indivision AGA Mk2 CR, IDEfix, PCMCIA WiFi, slim slot load DVD/CD-RW, OS 3.9 BB2
3) Amiga CD32 + SX1, OS 3.1