News of Free 060 Like Apollo Core License

[kolla]

Jari decided to do the SoftFPU, which set him apart from most of us; instead of just talking/posting on forums, he decided to DO something/code.

And alb42? Did he not code?

I don't contribute code to closed source projects in general, and certainly not to a project that has the intention of hijacking this platform hardware wise.

[Niding]

Ofcourse he code.

But towards the core?

I would have to re-read the thread a while back, but wasnt it FPU that he asked for, which is what Jari has contributed to.
It did finally arrive, but wether or not its to the precision he needed, he would have to answer.

Im fuzzy on the timeline, but I belive Jari entered the scene after alb42 expressed misgivings about how he was treated. I might be wrong. Im sure someone will take the time to check
And ofcourse; the SoftFPU+HardFPU combo is currently for the betatesters/Apollo Team only, so alb42 wouldnt have been able to fully utilize his programs potential.

As for hijacking the platform. Really? Are we now hoping that NO new efforts are going to have any measure of success, so we can complain about the lack of development for decades to come...? With the exceptions of those that already have their 060 cards with good masks for overclocking...? So we can spend 100s (1000s?) of dollars on mediator boards plus addons to get a somewhat modern usability.

As I said to Britelite; if you dont want to utilize all the added features of the Apollo/Vampire, ignore them, and code for 1260 in mind. Ofcourse Britelites counter to that was uncertainty of compability, and thats a fair argument, which can be taken care of.

[kolla]

I am keeping mines thank you very much, who knows, maybe there will be alternative cores in the future, maybe even the Apollo Core "shapens up" over time. Not like I don't have loads of other cards around that I am also not selling just because.

[kolla]

As for hijacking the platform. Really?

Eh, yes, really, the goal was/is to make Apollo Core the de-facto CPU for Amiga.

Are we now hoping that NO new efforts are going to have any measure of success, so we can complain about the lack of development for decades to come...?

Nope, we are hoping for something that is more compatible (on so many levels, not just hardware and software, but also socially) and more developer friendly.

[OlafS3]

Eh, yes, really, the goal was/is to make Apollo Core the de-facto CPU for Amiga.



Nope, we are hoping for something that is more compatible (on so many levels, not just hardware and software, but also socially) and more developer friendly.

You are a Lord now I guess

You are using "we" obviously if meaning I

There are different groups in the community obviously but the biggest group seems to be happy with vampire/apollo. Finally customers decide even if you dislike that

[Niding]

De-factor standard? You saying that like its the only option. Ofcourse if you said that in Saudi Arabia regarding a decreet from the Saudi family, Im sure that the implication of discrimination your are putting forward would be valid.
But given that people are free to choose based on what the hardware/software delivers, the quality of Vampire/Apollo will decide wether or not it becomes what "most amigans" use.
By using hijacking, you are giving the platform a negative attribute that doesnt hold water.

Ofcourse, anyone that puts immense amounts of hours into a product hopes it succeed, which means alot of "amigans". But noone is being flogged publicly for not purchasing said platform.

Socially? Compared to what?
On the amigahardware scene its hard to find more accessable developers than the Apollo Team. I do love TF/PlasmaB thread/youtubes ofcourse, so Im not putting down any other developers efforts.
Does Gunnar have unlimited patience with people? No, and I dont always agree with his social interactions. But I havent put in the crazy amount of efforts into the Apollo Core, so its extremely easy for me to sit on my high horse and judge him when he looses his temper.
If I were in his shoes I would probably have lost it much quicker.

Ofcourse, if the current version of the core isnt accomodating what you need from it; fine, I can see that. But since its currently a moving target/work in progress; passing final judgement like some do based on the current specs is unfair.

[kolla]

You are using "we" obviously if meaning I

I was responding to the patronizing "we" that Niding was using, obviously.

[Niding]

I was responding to the patronizing "we" that Niding was using, obviously.

??

[kolla]

??

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/We#The_patronizing_.22we.22

[Acill]

All I know is I was excited about the release of it, I helped Magista get a parts order so he could complete V2 500+ orders faster and bought my own to test. It got less compatible not more compatible and when I had problems with it I was brutally attacked on the forums and on the facebook page. They admins in the facebook page even kicked me out after I made a post asking for help in reflashing it. Once I did get it working again I got rid of it. I love helping out, but dont need drama like that and wish them all the best luck.

Anything negative is shut down and they hide the complete truth. That is my issue with this team and the project. The hardware is amazing, but those running the show are not so amazing. They take things way to personal.

[psxphill]

Jari decided to do the SoftFPU, which set him apart from most of us; instead of just talking/posting on forums, he decided to DO something/code.
This spurred the team to help him, effectively Jari convinced them to change their roadmap cause he put REAL effort into enhancing the Apollo/Vampire expirience.

I wouldn't code SoftFPU because I think it's a backward step, no offence for the work put into it but you shouldn't need any software patches/shims/etc if the CPU is as compatible as they claim.

If gunnar opened the 68080 source to let other people work on the HardFPU then that would be a different matter. He would fine other people willing to help out. He has put himself in an untenable position because he can't deliver what is needed, but he wants to keep ultimate control over it.

Bad management with a promising product but they don't know what to do with it, seems a perfect fit for Amiga. The curse strikes again.

[soviet]

What i read on the apollo core is that the hard fpu don't fit on the vampire FPGA RTG + AGA + CPU seem to have filled up.

The full FPU will be only for the new vampire 4.

From my point of view i have the vampire 2+ i if could choose between SAGA or the hard FPU i could prefer to have the AGA support.

[Chucky]

maybe if they remove the cpu stuff that is "crap"  you know.. AMMX, 64bit,. hyperthreadin bnlahblahneverbeingusedanway..

Shortly:  first you make the stuff you want it to be compatible with. and THEN you add the "goodies"

[Niding]

@psxphill

V2 has limited space for FPU. It might be able to fit a full HardFPU, or it might not. Which is why Soft and HardFPU combo is intresting to provide owners of this version of Vampire this functionality.

V4 can supposedly fit the full HardFPU.

So how can Jaris work be a waste of time, when it gives the team a tool to compensate for the limited FPGA space.

@Acill

Who treated you badly on the facebook page? Some of the "Vampire loyalists" or the team itself? If you read my comment on Vampire forum and IRC, I have misgivings with both sides of the aisle with regards to bent/broken social antennas.
If its "loyalists", then you shouldnt really attribute the drama they drum up to the Team itself. Imho.

@Chucky

You already know they have a "roadmap", and only change that if someone (like Jari) joins in with their own efforts to contribute directly to the development. If you want them to divert from the "crap" maybe you should divert their attention by contributing something worthwhile, dragging their attention from their original roadmap?

[OlafS3]

All I know is I was excited about the release of it, I helped Magista get a parts order so he could complete V2 500+ orders faster and bought my own to test. It got less compatible not more compatible and when I had problems with it I was brutally attacked on the forums and on the facebook page. They admins in the facebook page even kicked me out after I made a post asking for help in reflashing it. Once I did get it working again I got rid of it. I love helping out, but dont need drama like that and wish them all the best luck.

Anything negative is shut down and they hide the complete truth. That is my issue with this team and the project. The hardware is amazing, but those running the show are not so amazing. They take things way to personal.

It is propably a question of character partly but I assume if you invest 10 years in your dream to do something modern to benefit everyone and then you are constantly critisized and urged to make things different by people that never contributed anything you can become thin skinned propably.

[Chucky]

@psxphill

V2 has limited space for FPU. It might be able to fit a full HardFPU, or it might not. Which is why Soft and HardFPU combo is intresting to provide owners of this version of Vampire this functionality.

isn't it very VERY ironic that you need to add software to get functionality. from the team that say that the 68040/68060 is crap as you need 68040/68060 library to add functionality....

You already know they have a "roadmap", and only change that if someone (like Jari) joins in with their own efforts to contribute directly to the development. If you want them to divert from the "crap" maybe you should divert their attention by contributing something worthwhile, dragging their attention from their original roadmap?

Contribute.. well  people asked for FPU.. I read it in forums.  result was threatening of ban etc as NOONE NEEDED THAT!.
so with that attitude.. you know that they are not interested of input.

same here.. I have issues with lack of mmu etc.  gets reported as OFF TOPIC... meaning:  NOT INTERESTED!


so. I contribute with a cheapass (bad) 060 cpucard for bigbox..  (currentlty working on Rev2.. will not be as cheapasscrap)
and I AM interested of input.. AND help..  doing amigastuff is not a one-man show..  maybe one man does it. but there is always a lot of input to take.