**Need Setup HELP** with Classic Amiga 2000 HARD DISK (Bridgeboard)

[wbrejnia]

BACK TO JANUS Puzzle (and a Amiga Hard Drive PARTITION on ISA/IDE-CF or RRL-HD [PC 8086] )

The Gotek is figure out, and LED toys can wait.

--> I need to work on the Whole Amiga Booting off the PC Bridgeboard Disk, and why Jlink, Aread, Awrite was not working.
--> And MOST IMPORTANTLY why I could NOT Format and Mount the Amiga Partition off the RLL Drive.

AND I FOUND A CLUE, which I stumbled up during  GOOGLE SEARCH.

There were TWO versions of JANUS.  I found a section in a SCSI Hard Drive Installation Guide.

*** THE Step for JANUS version 1 and Janus V2 are VERY DIFFERENT **

I think I've been mixing up the two versions.  I didn't even know there were two.

So looking thru all my Bridgeboard disk, I confirmed that I was using both somehow, somewhere.  Possibly mixed, and using Steps from V2 on V1 Software.

Doesn't explain all the issues, but gives me motivation to focus on working within a version.

Here is PROOF  (Two Floppies I've been using), and the Hard Drive manual stating different steps.



At least I feel a bit less crazy, knowing there may be a reason for my Past Struggles.

Next steps are to TRY BOTH and SEE DIFFERENCES.

[wbrejnia]

What I'm going to do (Janus V2)....

---> I did run the Janus V2 Install before using the "Auto-Install" BLACK-ICON shown in above Photo (Right side)
---------> But I Partially/Improperly? ran it since I didn't know the ANSWERS to the various PROMPTED Steps
----------------> This time I going to run the Manual Method (Described in the Hard Drive Install Guide)
----------------> This time to create a DOS partition on a "Fake-Amiga-Hard-Drive DF2:Floppy", just like I did for the HARD-FILE last time (That worked for me Before)

Then if that works (I will flip things around, and create an Amiga Partition on the PC Hard drive)

[wbrejnia]

QUESTION: ( Is there a way to find out what Version SW Is (ON AMIGA)?

When I run DJMOUNT, or have JANUS.Libraray in Expansion Folder (HOw do I figure out what version it is).

Just running the command provides no clues.

-> At least in MS DOS when I mismatch DOS and Jdisk.sys, it complains (Wrong DOS version).

[wbrejnia]

The Gotek (Hxc) is Sweet!!

After reading that HD Install Manual I learned a lot (Including a missing step for the Jlink DOS disk setup [Not in the Bridgeboard Manual]

Also found out there is a Janus Install Program on the Install DISK.

Here is how easy it is was to Download the (DMS) INSTALL DISK off of Amiga.Resouce.cx web site and POP into the Amiga.   (1 minute)

Not sure how easy it is with WinUae, but this beats Amiga Explorer Hands down.



The LCD display will be Very Hand once the USB stick is loaded up.



Cool Eh?

[Pat the Cat]

Sounds like you are getting there slowly.

I seem to recall a small flurry of complaints re Janus updates when they happened. A lot of existing BB users were very upset when the "latest version" broke their existing setup and they had to revert to the older version, copy all their data, and reinstall.

Nice work on the Gotek. Seems a bit hit and miss setting the thing up, but persistence gets you a working floppy emulator eventually...

[Dandy]

QUESTION: Is there a way to find out what Version SW Is(ON AMIGA)?

When I run DJMOUNT, or have JANUS.Libraray in Expansion Folder (HOw do I figure out what version it is).

Just running the command provides no clues.
...

AmigaOS Manual: AmigaDOS Command Reference: Version

[wbrejnia]

Thanks Dandy.

I actually was thinking about you last night when reading the details of the Hard Drive Manual( Bridgeboard section)..

I think your comment earlier was correct.
You might be 100% correct in your statement that "you can't Autoboot PC Bridgeboard side".

I am still testing, but I think I stumbled on a Modern Technology solution with the ISA/IDE Adapter (MS DOS boot).  
It would have not been possible in 1990 (no Lotech Adapter).

So the Miracle solution I stumbled upon is thanks to Pat for suggesting to me getting a Lotech ISA/IDE Adapter.

I think my DOS Boots off the SD card only works because the Lotech Adapter doesn't work on power up.  
It tricks the Amiga to think no Hard drive at power up, so leaves Autoboot enabled.  
Then a 8086 reset (thru Icon, or CTRL-ALT-Delete), activates the Lotech-HardDrive, then reboots PC via AutoBoot[enabled].. ( with emtpy Aboot.cnfg file).

If the lotech adapter initialized on power up my 8086, I would have to rebooted PC with a Floppy.

What this means is I'll never be able to boot 8086-BB-PC off the Western Digital/RLL Drive (because it picks up on power up)
---> I was thinking a trick solution (Have a mechanical power ON/OFF-switch to RLL drive.  So during power up, no RLL drive.  Then turn on RLL drive after power up to enable Autoboot)

Not a problem, SD card is way better.

I will find out soon with more testing.  
If JANUS doesn't pick up the hard drive Amiga Parition on Power up (Lotech), so I'll never be able to create a working Amiga Partition off the 8086 Hard drive.  I can't CTRL-ALT-DELETE to re-initialize JANUS.library load (but there may be trick, a script to run DJmount later, but I think Janus.library load is key...We'll see)

IS THERE ARE WAY to LOAD "Expansion folder" (Janus.library driver) after Workbench starts up?  I think dynamic is not possible.

I think my choice will be One or the other, never both (Amiga & PC Hard drives together, on ONE-HARD-DRIVE).  

Unless I find a another trick. [like the power switch I mentioned above]
Which bring me to an IDEA.  I am installing the Aurdiuno controller for the Gotek Display.
With a Relay I could automatically delay the power up of RLL drive, or SD card adapter.  (FUture project)

Yes, a Hard drive in Zorro II slot and Hard drive in ISA slot would work to solve both. (Maybe).
--> But I don't have an Amiga Hard drive.
--> TOO BAD THERE IS NO LO-Tech-[ZorroII/IDE] Adapter. (That would be Awesome).  I guess the Vampire-II is that, plus more.

[wbrejnia]

I need a decent FileManager for Amiga

I don't expect modern MS windows Quality, but for me to do my testing and build some Custom Workbench disks (From bits an peices of other disks)
Some kind of  need a GUI FileManager for Amiga.

-> Something to look at 2/3 Floppies side by side and be able to copy (multiple files) from one to another.
-> Create directories (nice to have)
-> Delete files
-> Maybe see file sizes ( Really nice to have)
-> Doesn't have to be mouse drive, could be even cursor driven.

This will help a lot.

QUICK UPDATE:

--> I tried that GVP HD Sofware disk (Bridgeboard install tool).  
------>** Nothing New **
------> It doesn't do much except copy of the basic Janus/and PCwindow Files (From the standard PCinstall disk)
-------> There was only one extra step at the end that offer to create a HardFile on the HardDrive.

--> I tried the Version Command (but in WB 1.2 it just shows Workbench/Kickstart Versions
--> I assume the Version name FILE syntax is for Amiga OS (may try WinUae with AmigaOS to peek Versions at my ADF copy of floppies [bit a transfer work]

--> Finally got back to my Fish Tank (TO DO) List
-------> Things were getting bad with all the Amiga Distractions
-------> Did some long overdue maintenance the Main Kitchen Tank.  All clean and tidy now.

[wbrejnia]

** [1 BIG breakthrough ] , [ 2 Important Discoveries ] , and a  [ Confirmation of Suspicion ] **

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
JANUS:

Some really good progress with Running the Newest Bridgeboard Janus Install disk.

- Basically I found a root cause to many of my problems of the past.
- It's clearly seen in past screen shots, but nobody noticed, and my lack of knowing/seeing a properly working  system was the problem.
----> The Janus Handler wasn't matched with the Janus Library
---------> I know JANUS.library is one file, but where is the Handler File

Now that Both are matched (Jlink works), but (DJMOUNT doesn't ** YET**)



While  jumping around to compare various Janus BB disk, I discovered that  there is more than one PC-Window program.   The newest version works the  worst for me.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
AUTO BOOT (DOS PC - Rll Drive vs ISA/IDE):
--> I put back the WD-RLL drive into Amiga.  
--> I put in the Last Working Workbench Disk. The one that worked with Lo-Tech SD card AUTO BOOT  (Ctrl-Alt-Del).
--------->  RLL (Boot ready) Hard Drive won't boot for C:  
------- >>>>> THIS CONFIRMS "Dandy's" Statement.  PC Drive cannot AutoBoot Boot DOS from (Normal) Hard Disk
------- >>>>> THIS CONFIRMS The LoTech ISA BIOS (Init) Delay is a Failure that Make PC AutoBoot after CTRL-ALT-DEL and EMPTY(Aboot.ctrl) file (Good Abnormal)

What this means:

---> I can never install the WD-Controller/RLL drive if I want to boot BB-PC without a 5.25" floppy. (Don't need it with ISA/IDE anymore)
====>  I either sell it, or do A Post (HD Power up) after systems are stable (if that works..No Idea yet)

---> If I don't get the [Amiga-DJMOUNT] <-> [ BB-PC] <-> [ ISA/IDE-SD ] working,  I won't have a Bootable Amiga from HARD DISK (Even from Kickstart 1.3/AmigaOS3.1)
--------> My ULTIMATE GOAL won't be achieved to build a FLOPPY less [Amiga/BB-PC] (Except for Gotek Solution, but very limited on Storage SPACE)

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Next Step:

With all libraries good.  Time to do (One-More-Time) all the Steps of the Bridgeboard Installation Guide for an AmigaOS Boot off PC-Hard-Disk (Fdisk,Adisk,Format)
.....

[Pat the Cat]

L directory for Amiga handler files and file systems. Of boot disk.

It  looks from the "matched library and handler" screen shot that you tried  to Jlink the C drive but the Janus setting didn't match the hard disk  partition contents.

Perhaps they can be incompatible between  different versions of Janus... Not sure how compatible they are between  different versions of DOS either.

[wbrejnia]

L directory for Amiga handler files and file systems. Of boot disk.

Thanks, I will look.

It  looks from the "matched library and handler" screen shot that you tried  to Jlink the C drive but the Janus setting didn't match the hard disk  partition contents.

I am pretty sure you are correct.  That is the first thing that came to my mind.
There could be a good reason.   After giving up on THIS RLL drive (as a Amiga Boot Drive).  

I created for experimenting:

[Primary-Partition #1, DOS-Active ( C: ) ]
[Primary-Partition #2, DOS-Extended,DOS-Logical ( D: ]
[Primary-Partition #3, Amiga, Not-Active]

The bridge board manual says only Create [#1] [#3] above as [#1][#2]

That could be the issues as Janus (Janus.Library & DJmount) look for the Amiga Partition is some set way.

So I need to re-partition the RLL HD with (fdisk,adisk) Fresh, and Try Again.

Perhaps they can be incompatible between  different versions of Janus... Not sure how compatible they are between  different versions of DOS either.

Yup, that's the whole headache, mix matching the various versions.

Too bad my original BB-2088 3.25" Floppy is DEAD, and I don't have the 5.25" BB-DOS Floppy that came with my Bridge board.

I was hoping the "VERSION" command would help, but it doesn't for WB1.2

[darkage]

I need a decent FileManager for Amiga

I don't expect modern MS windows Quality, but for me to do my testing and build some Custom Workbench disks (From bits an peices of other disks)
Some kind of  need a GUI FileManager for Amiga.

Directory Opus (aka Dopus)   Alternatives would be Disk Master or File Master.

Edit - a modern version is available on PC.  https://www.gpsoft.com.au/   I recently purchased a copy from the Humble Bundle for 10 bucks or something like that.   https://www.humblebundle.com

[wbrejnia]

:cool::cool: Slick Darkage :cool: Really Slick  :cool::cool:

Exactly what I need to continue my Sherlock Homes work.

Watson, will be impressed with this next Post!

Thanks

[wbrejnia]

***********************************
** MAY BE Biggest Breakthrough So Far!! **
***********************************

I was going to RE-PARTITION and FORMAT the RLL Hard Drive in the Amiga BB PC Side.

--> To do only two partitions, hoping DJMOUNT would pick up the 2nd Amiga Partition.

But S!#T , I spent so much time on the 486 copying stuff into it Partion D: (right in the Middle, just below the AMIGA Partition....So no way to preserve).

So I was going for first attempt, SUBSTITUTE the Lo-TECH-SD Combo.
But I was SURE that wouldn't Inititiatize on COLD START (since I tested a few times).   So pointless.

But I installed the Lo-Tech Adapter, and thought WTF, let's give a Boot and see what happens.  

TA-DAH!!!

I did not expect this. (REMEMBER, the Left Side shows Lo-Tech Booting ** BUT (NEVER EVER) from COLD BOOT, it took a 2nd CTRL-ALT-DEL boot to Trigger Lotech **)



What is shows is more than you initially think.
I'm still trying to digest this info what I may do next.

--> First to make this happen I have to change the jumper on Lo-Tech Adress to D800h.  
-------> The Default of C800 is the same as the Western Digital Controller.
-------> So both Controller would Conflict. (This was my grief originally on the 486).  I LEARNED.

What happened is by having the Western Digtial Controller and the Lo-Tech Adapter in the ISA Slots, the BB-PC did an Initialization of the Lo-Tech Adapter.

--> But the best part is that I didn't have to CTRL-ALT-DELETE to trigger the Init, like before.
--> THE INIT HAPPENED ON COLD BOOT!!

This could be a possible Game Changer, since if we have an Init on COLD BOOT.  Then JANUS might pick up one of the Physical DISKS.

And if it does, then if I get DJMOUNT Working, then I'll have a DOUBLE BOOTING AMIGA (NO FLOPPIES NEEDED)

--> It still didn't boot C: drive, but it Can't since C: is on the 2nd Physical Disk.
---> This was a still a boot off a 5.25" Floppy
--> DOS assigns C: to the First Physical Disk.

----> There could be few ways to achieve my goal.
----------> Jumper the RLL to DISK 2, If Possible via W-Digital C-Board
----------> Some other way.  I'm still trying to digest this.


HERE ARE THE FDISK AND A DISKS OUTPUTS



With this setup I got a Ton of Space.  Way to much for the PC MS DOS side.

--> I never thought I could keep the RLL Drive.
-------> Now I can.  Kind of nice to keep it in the Amiga RETRO Time Capsule

BUT THIS MAKES "Solving the DJMOUNT" and "Format of the PC Partition from the AMIGA" a MUST!

----> "FLOPPY DISK FREE" AMIGA/PC/AMIGA (Gotek, and Hard Drive(s) )

ONWARD.  Carefully!

-> But think about this.  If this Proves there is an INIT on the ISA BUS
-> It means there must be an attempt to boot the RLL Drive
---------> I see it happening with the LED blinking during Cold Start.
---> Why doesn't that RLL C: Drive BOOT?  
---------> Maybe it's the FORMAT?  MBR?  BOOTBLOCK?
---------------> TIME TO CALL 1-800-RANISH!! (before I re-partition)
---------------> And compare the FIRST Potention C: Drive Partitions
-----------------------> Lotech-SDcard (which Boots)
-----------------------> WD-RLL (which does not Boot)

Love Ranish!

[wbrejnia]

WHY DO I Spend So much Time Doing these Posts with DETAILED IMAGES?

Let me explain....

It's my way of thinking things through.  Digesting the info, and putting together the bits an pieces.

I would have never have gotten this far without creating my diagrams.
When I spend the time to organize the SLIDES ...It sticks in my head.
Better than on Scrap pieces of paper cluttering my desk.

I teach my kids that best way to study is to write something at least once.  Better than reading or thinking.  (I read that somewhere in a Article...never wrote it down. .....  Now I did. ).

Yeah, when I finish this Journey, I'll summarize the FULL WORKING SETUP.
Nice and compact.

But I need this.

And I think it helps give clear Information to all of you on the Forum to bump-assist me along they way.

THANK you ALL !

BTW.  

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
--> I got an thought after writing above Post.  
--------> Since the Lo-tech can handle TWO drives.
--------> I can just ribbon cable on the IDE-COMPACT FLASH ADAPTER
--------> Just make it a SLAVE
---------------> Why not.  I paid for it.  Sitting on desk collecting Dust.

A 8086 XT PC
----->  Running MS DOS 6.2
-----> 16 GB  + 512Mb + 33Mb  of Disk Space
-------------> Across 3 Physical drives  (SD card) + (CF) + (RLL Hard Disk)  
----------------------> , 8x Partitions
------------------------------->  and possibly a 1x BOOTING Amiga Partition.  (I hope!)
---> And access to A GOTEK!
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

(Retro Meets the Future-Present......Cool) :cool:

[darkage]

WHY DO I Spend So much Time Doing these Posts with DETAILED IMAGES?

Im still waiting for that book of yours