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Author Topic: **Need Setup HELP** with Classic Amiga 2000 HARD DISK (Bridgeboard)  (Read 198754 times)

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Offline Raffaele

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Re: **Need Setup HELP** with Classic Amiga 2000 HARD DISK (Bridgeboard)
« Reply #404 on: February 12, 2017, 12:11:59 PM »
Why don't you try making a new floppy disk installing FREEDOS on it? It is fully MS-DOS compatible but it sports real multitasking (not cooperative like MS-DOS), better text based command shell, supports 32bit design, and lots of advanced features including reading disks with advanced geometry.

[EDIT]

Question: I wonder inspecting Tools like Snoopdos from Amiga side what say about Bridgeboard card?

Also I will try moving files from an Amiga formatted disk in Amiga side to a PC formatted disk on PC floppy reader and vice-versa in order to check if they copy and move smooth from an environment to another (68000<->8088) or they arrive in someway corrupted in size and contents...
It could be a good test to check if Bridgeboard is fully functioning in trasferring data...
This is important to check indirectly if Jdisk a.k.a. JanusDisk command parameters starting from Amiga side pass directly to PCSide...
I know it is really empirical but it worths a try...
« Last Edit: February 12, 2017, 12:47:50 PM by Raffaele »
Que viva el Amiga!
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Offline Raffaele

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Re: **Need Setup HELP** with Classic Amiga 2000 HARD DISK (Bridgeboard)
« Reply #405 on: February 12, 2017, 12:56:39 PM »
Quote from: wbrejnia;822000
[DIAGNOSTIC IDEA]

The only Ideal I have is one of the PC Norton Tools I tried shows the DOS OS system details and I believe interrupts.

If I put in the Western Digital Controller (which I know works on the AmigaPC) and see if the Tool picks it up.

Then I put in the ISA/IDE adapter and see if it is picked up.

No hard-drive needed for this comparison.

As I said previously if I was in your shoes I had had inserted MFM controller on a modern PC with ISA bus cards  and had had run any Linux partitioning software like GPartED capable to detect multiple kinds of partition types and to check if they exceed their sectors bounduaries...
Que viva el Amiga!
Long Life the Amiga!
Vive l\'Amiga!
Viva Amiga!
 

Offline wbrejniaTopic starter

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Re: **Need Setup HELP** with Classic Amiga 2000 HARD DISK (Bridgeboard)
« Reply #406 on: February 12, 2017, 07:04:03 PM »
Quote from: Raffaele;822001
Why don't you try making a new floppy disk installing FREEDOS on it? It is fully MS-DOS compatible but it sports real multitasking (not cooperative like MS-DOS), better text based command shell, supports 32bit design, and lots of advanced features including reading disks with advanced geometry.

[EDIT]

Question: I wonder inspecting Tools like Snoopdos from Amiga side what say about Bridgeboard card?

Also I will try moving files from an Amiga formatted disk in Amiga side to a PC formatted disk on PC floppy reader and vice-versa in order to check if they copy and move smooth from an environment to another (68000<->8088) or they arrive in someway corrupted in size and contents...
It could be a good test to check if Bridgeboard is fully functioning in trasferring data...
This is important to check indirectly if Jdisk a.k.a. JanusDisk command parameters starting from Amiga side pass directly to PCSide...
I know it is really empirical but it worths a try...
Are you saying YOU will try and do a Awrite/Aread?

Or I should?
I tried  before and it didn't work from PC Floppy to Amiga Floppy.  Or Amiga Floppy to PC Floppy. (I will try again)
SHOULD THAT WORK?
 

Offline wbrejniaTopic starter

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Re: **Need Setup HELP** with Classic Amiga 2000 HARD DISK (Bridgeboard)
« Reply #407 on: February 12, 2017, 07:07:51 PM »
Quote from: Raffaele;822003
As I said previously if I was in your shoes I had had inserted MFM controller on a modern PC with ISA bus cards  and had had run any Linux partitioning software like GPartED capable to detect multiple kinds of partition types and to check if they exceed their sectors bounduaries...
I did try putting in the WD MFM controller into my 486 with ISA slots. (Earlier)
It hangs the machine.
Even the ISA/IDE adpater hung it, till I changed the jumper.
I have to play with BIOS options.
But it's the conflict with two Hard Drive Controllers.
That PC doesn't have a Floppy Controller on Motherboard, so very limited.

I just need to do my RLL Drive copy the hard way.  Using Floppies.
Then LL format the Octacon RLL drive with COntroller BIOS.
If I get the drive to work, I'll have DOS on HD, Amiga OS on HD.
Things will get easier than living in Flopppy world.
 

Offline wbrejniaTopic starter

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Re: **Need Setup HELP** with Classic Amiga 2000 HARD DISK (Bridgeboard)
« Reply #408 on: February 12, 2017, 08:04:04 PM »
SPLITTING THIS EFFORT in to [3 Projects+]

This is getting too complicated for this single thread.

Splitting this into 3 Projects (with 2 new threads)

1) This [PROJECT 1] The RLL Drive recovery
** Efforts will continue in this Thread *

2) [PROJECT 2] The Lo-tech ISA/IDE Adapter in AMIGA 2000
http://www.amiga.org/forums/showthread.php?p=822026#post822026
** I contacted "Lo-tech" vendor for support **

3) [PROJECT 3] The Lo-tech ISA/IDE Adapter in 486 PC
** coming soon **
** I contacted "Lo-tech" vendor for support **

4) [PROJECT 4] Possibly try the WD-MFM Controller/RLL Drive on the 486
*** Future *


« Last Edit: February 12, 2017, 08:06:38 PM by wbrejnia »
 

Offline wbrejniaTopic starter

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Re: **Need Setup HELP** with Classic Amiga 2000 HARD DISK (Bridgeboard)
« Reply #409 on: February 12, 2017, 08:38:21 PM »
[SETUP SANITY TESTING]  PLAY-PC and two DRIVES ((** TEST IDE drive not working with ISA/IDE Adapter,  IDE Drive not working in XP PC) same cable.

I need to set some working baselines since too many unknown bits and pieces.

- So I put back the (TEST) IDE Drive back into the PLAY XP PC.
- I booted from floppy
- Drive is recognized just like before.

- Then I put in the TRUE IDE Drive from the 486 on the same IDE-CABLE
- Booted from same floppy
- DRIVE IS NOT recognized by (Motherboard BIO or by FDISK )

So there is something special/different about drives. Possibly the (TEST) IDE Drive.

I need to get this working before expecting the ISA/IDE adapter to work.

 

Offline wbrejniaTopic starter

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Re: **Need Setup HELP** with Classic Amiga 2000 HARD DISK (Bridgeboard)
« Reply #410 on: February 12, 2017, 09:09:20 PM »
[SANITY TEST 2]  TEST IDE Drive NOW WORKING in 486

I setup the 486 with just the (original HDD/FD) Controller.

I cabled the 3.5" and 5.25" Floppy to the controller

1 Hooked up the TEST-IDE-Hard drive.

It took some fumbling with BIO (AutoRecognize HD) but I got it working.

Setups are picky.

Now I will try putting in the ISA/IDE controller into the 486 after getting a 2nd-TEST-HARD DRIVE Setup.
 

Offline wbrejniaTopic starter

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Re: **Need Setup HELP** with Classic Amiga 2000 HARD DISK (Bridgeboard)
« Reply #411 on: February 12, 2017, 09:57:28 PM »
:) :)  GOT Lo-Tech ISA/IDE Adapter WORKING (NO 486 Hang) and Recognized in 486 PC :) :)

It was tricky, but I basically tested all Drives separtely on the 486 HD Contrlloer

Making sure the cables were all correct (orientation and working)

But biggest advance was going into BIOS and (removing the Drives that were not there) and SAVING to BIOS

Then the 486 Booted, and you can see the LO-Tech Adapter IDE Bios Pick up.  

486 Boots from Floppy.

I didn't hook up any drives to Lo-Tech Adapter, since taking this one step at a time.




I learned that I have to take this in very small piece part steps.
Things are sensitive and dependant.
 

Offline wbrejniaTopic starter

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Re: **Need Setup HELP** with Classic Amiga 2000 HARD DISK (Bridgeboard)
« Reply #412 on: February 12, 2017, 10:09:10 PM »
[ ANOTHER CLUE:   on TEST IDE/DRIVE   Format ]

While I have the TEST IDE/HD hooked up to the 486 Controller, I ran NOTON DOS on it.

Right away it picked up a problem.



Don't exactly know what this mean, but I'm assuming my Formatting of the Drive using an more Modern XP computer created a DRIVE not support back in Legacy/Stone Age Days.

I need to parition and Format this drive the OLD way using OLD DOS etc.

Then I can possibly expect it to work on OLD DOS, OLD BIOS, and OLDER 8088 Bridgbeboard PC.
 

Offline wbrejniaTopic starter

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Re: **Need Setup HELP** with Classic Amiga 2000 HARD DISK (Bridgeboard)
« Reply #413 on: February 12, 2017, 10:49:18 PM »
NO matter what IDE-HARD disk I put on the ISA/IDE adapter, the ISA/IDE BIOS won't pick it up.

Hoping that Flash Card-Adapter when it arrives will get picked up (I ordered a local Large to Small IDE cable) should arrive very soon.

I think if I get over this hurdle, the ISA/IDE adapter will work in the AMIGA Bridgboard PC.
« Last Edit: February 12, 2017, 10:51:27 PM by wbrejnia »
 

Offline darkage

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Re: **Need Setup HELP** with Classic Amiga 2000 HARD DISK (Bridgeboard)
« Reply #414 on: February 12, 2017, 11:52:25 PM »
What do you have hooked up to the lo-tech card ?

If its hdd, please note -

Hard Disk Device is Not Detected

Only hard disks supporting ATA-2 command set can be used.

https://www.lo-tech.co.uk/wiki/Lo-tech_ISA_CompactFlash_Adapter_FAQ

Older IDE hard drives have more chance of working then later model IDEs
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parallel_ATA#EIDE_and_ATA-2

If not already I would test with a CF card attached.


It might be more productive if you can provide less posts that are rich in straight to the point information.   I find it hard to follow this mega thread with what you have done and not, etc.   You could probably create a book from the thread :P

Also I would make an account at the following forum, http://www.vcfed.org/forum/forumdisplay.php?3-Technical-Support

they might be able to help with PC/XT side of things ?
 

Offline Raffaele

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Re: **Need Setup HELP** with Classic Amiga 2000 HARD DISK (Bridgeboard)
« Reply #415 on: February 13, 2017, 01:02:28 PM »
Quote from: wbrejnia;822021
Are you saying YOU will try and do a Awrite/Aread?

Or I should?
I tried  before and it didn't work from PC Floppy to Amiga Floppy.  Or Amiga Floppy to PC Floppy. (I will try again)
SHOULD THAT WORK?


Yes. it should transfer files flawlessly!

Try some gif images, simple text documents and maybe an AmigaDOS command like DIR or EDIT, verifying if it works again when copied back into Amiga side.

Text Document Files obviously must be with CR+LF (CarriageReturn + LineFeed) to be read by Text readrs on PC Side.

I do not remember name of DOS command to use to complish this task... But yes! it should be ARead and AWrite commands.
Que viva el Amiga!
Long Life the Amiga!
Vive l\'Amiga!
Viva Amiga!
 

Offline Raffaele

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Re: **Need Setup HELP** with Classic Amiga 2000 HARD DISK (Bridgeboard)
« Reply #416 on: February 13, 2017, 01:04:18 PM »
Quote from: wbrejnia;822036
[ ANOTHER CLUE:   on TEST IDE/DRIVE   Format ]

While I have the TEST IDE/HD hooked up to the 486 Controller, I ran NOTON DOS on it.

Right away it picked up a problem.



Don't exactly know what this mean, but I'm assuming my Formatting of the Drive using an more Modern XP computer created a DRIVE not support back in Legacy/Stone Age Days.

I need to parition and Format this drive the OLD way using OLD DOS etc.

Then I can possibly expect it to work on OLD DOS, OLD BIOS, and OLDER 8088 Bridgbeboard PC.


Yes it is a just a simple formatting issue originated by modern parameters settings.
Que viva el Amiga!
Long Life the Amiga!
Vive l\'Amiga!
Viva Amiga!
 

Offline wbrejniaTopic starter

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Re: **Need Setup HELP** with Classic Amiga 2000 HARD DISK (Bridgeboard)
« Reply #417 on: February 13, 2017, 02:45:47 PM »
Quote from: darkage;822039
What do you have hooked up to the lo-tech card ?

If its hdd, please note -

Hard Disk Device is Not Detected

Only hard disks supporting ATA-2 command set can be used.

https://www.lo-tech.co.uk/wiki/Lo-tech_ISA_CompactFlash_Adapter_FAQ

Older IDE hard drives have more chance of working then later model IDEs
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parallel_ATA#EIDE_and_ATA-2

If not already I would test with a CF card attached.


It might be more productive if you can provide less posts that are rich in straight to the point information.   I find it hard to follow this mega thread with what you have done and not, etc.   You could probably create a book from the thread :P

Also I would make an account at the following forum, http://www.vcfed.org/forum/forumdisplay.php?3-Technical-Support

they might be able to help with PC/XT side of things ?

Yes, I am going to start making my Future posts more simple
.

The details were good at the beginning when things were going well.
Some of the history of information is quite useful to me.
But my posts have certainly spiralled out of hand.

I did check the Ebay Listing where I bought the Adapter.http://www.ebay.ca/itm/Assembled-Tested-Working-Lo-tech-ISA-CompactFlash-Adapter-IDE-for-8-Bit-PCs-/282312406702?hash=item41bb2176ae:g:9HYAAOSwL7VWoBxq

It does say clearly it specifically made for Flash Cards.
 

Offline wbrejniaTopic starter

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Re: **Need Setup HELP** with Classic Amiga 2000 HARD DISK (Bridgeboard)
« Reply #418 on: February 13, 2017, 03:04:45 PM »
Quick update.

I spent a lot of time hoping to not have to do the Chunk Dump of the RLL drive manually, by trying a ton of software.

Basically nothings works on this 8088.

Testdisk was my last hope. But it wanted a 386 CPU, and didn't work.
http://www.cgsecurity.org/wiki/TestDisk_Step_By_Step

So got myself setup with Norton Disk Edit and bunch of floppies.
It allows me to dump 1000 Sectors at a time (512 bytes per sector), which fit nicely into a 760K formatted 3.5" disk (writing to my External drive off the Bridbgeboard PC).

At the beginning (first 7 sectors) where the Hard Drive is corrupt, I learned when a Sector read failure occurs i(DiskEdit Tool) fills the missing locations with "00" which is perfect. (Everything is spaced properly in the image file)

It's working well, since the "Write-Image-to-Disk File" Tracks the last Sector I dump and next file dump starts off at next sector (1000 Sectors at a time).

Painfully slow, but working.  I've done 10 dumps, 60 more to go.
Even slower since after ever few dumps, my old floppies die, so I picked out some of the best I have.

Once done, I'll concatenate all the Mini Image dumps into One or two Image files (2 images: for both PC & Amiga Partitions), or (1 image: for the whole ALOK disk).

With these images on a Modern PC, I'll have many tools to try and extract the files.  I can try many time without risk to original copy.

Either way, since I can't get the WD-RLL Controller to work in my 486 (which limits my tools to the 8088), I'll do the Low Level Format of the RLL drive, and see what happens (Hoping a reallocation of good/bad sectors restores the drive. I will be a few sectors short).

If I manage to re-format the drive clean, then I'll have choices.

1) Build up a new setup (DOS and Amiga)
2) Do above but try to dump the Backed up Images back.
3) Somethings else

Stay tuned.  I am running mini dumps, every time I pass by the computer.
« Last Edit: February 13, 2017, 03:07:29 PM by wbrejnia »
 

Offline wbrejniaTopic starter

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Re: **Need Setup HELP** with Classic Amiga 2000 HARD DISK (Bridgeboard)
« Reply #419 from previous page: February 13, 2017, 06:11:13 PM »
LUCKY BREAK ( 2nd IDE Drive in 486 PC Picked up by ISA/IDE Adapter)  ** Low-Tech Adapter Working with an Hard Drive. **



I got tired waiting for these Mini Image Dumps, so I thought I'd try the 2nd IDE Drive in that OLD 486.  It's only 250MB so thought maybe older IDE-2.

I hooked it up to IDE/ISA Adapter and it picked it up.

Now I got to try in the AMIGA Bridgeboard PC.

If it works, so will FLASH CARD  (( And I can do a Full Image Dump!! ))

If it doesn't, then  :( Again.