AmigaOS 4.1 Questions from a complete noob....

[slygon]

OK,

Some of you have followed and answered a few of my questions that I have added to other threads.... but I wanted to start my own for a few questions as I learn.....

For those that don't know.. I just bought a new AmigaOne X5000.  I am having a ton of fun, finally learning how to use AmigaOS... I never owned ANY Amiga in the past... I have played with emulators, but otherwise I was a Commodore 64 guy that missed the Amiga and went right to PC and Mac.....  Now that you have the 2 second background... here are my first two questions:

I just did a test fresh install of the OS... everything seems to be running fine, I didn't run into any real issues... BUT:

1.  When you format a partition it asks if you want a trashcan... is this useful for anything?  It doesn't seem to work the same as a Windows/Mac trash can... so I really don't know.....

2.  Is a swap partition necessary/recommended?  I have plenty of memory in this machine... probably more than AmigaOS can even use.... but if one is still recommended, I will set one up... if it is, how large should I make it?

That is it for now!  Trust me... more questions will be coming.... Thanks in advance!

-Slygon

[Matt_H]

Wow, a brand new user! Welcome!

Trashcan is really not necessary. It's just an optional directory where you can put things before deleting them (with the Empty Trashcan menu option). I've never used it. Unlike Mac/Windows, when you delete something on AmigaOS, it's deleted - it doesn't go to the Trashcan as an intermediate point unless you put it there directly.

(SFS and possibly PFS - other optional Amiga filesystems - do have a more Mac/Windows-like recycling option if that's something you're interested in)

My OS4 install does have a swap partition, but as far as I can tell it's never been used by the system. I think it's safe to go without, but if you do want one I'd suggest one either equivalent to or double the amount of physical RAM in the machine.

EDIT: I should also add, if you did select the option to create a Trashcan and decide that you don't want it you can actually delete the Trashcan, although I think it has to be done from a Shell or a file manager like Directory Opus. Likewise, if you didn't select the option for a Trashcan and do want one, you can create one without having to reformat. Just create a directory called Trashcan, and either change the icon type to Trashcan from the icon information window, or replace its icon with a copy of ENVARC:Sys/def_trashcan.info

[kolla]

1.  When you format a partition it asks if you want a trashcan... is this useful for anything?  It doesn't seem to work the same as a Windows/Mac trash can... so I really don't know.....

No, not really so useful. It is really a relic from way back, when the way to delete files was to drag them into the trashcan and then empty the trashcan, sort of the way macOS still does it. However, once "delete" became a thing in the menu, the Trashcan has been mostly unused. However, it _can_ still be used, and if you install  BenchTrash (http://aminet.net/package/util/wb/BenchTrash), you can get a global trashcan on your Workbench, that will use the "per filesystem" trashcan drawers through a unified interface. The link above is to the OS3.9 version of BenchTrash, I would expect this functionality to already be present in OS4.1, or that BenchTrash will work with OS4.1 (I currently do not have OS4.1FE in front of me)

2.  Is a swap partition necessary/recommended?  I have plenty of memory in this machine... probably more than AmigaOS can even use.... but if one is still recommended, I will set one up... if it is, how large should I make it?

I doubt you will have any need for it.

[SACC-guy]

I only setup the trashcan on my bootable partition. I use it.
It is not needed on the other partitions.

If you have 2gigs of memory or more on the x5000 no swap partition is needed.

HINT: Feel free to ask x5000 questions in the Hyperion message site as well. The devs and beta testers are there more often.

http://forum.hyperion-entertainment.biz/viewforum.php?f=57

[apsturk]

@slygon

Set your all your partitions to the NGF/0 filesystem. The Trash can, I don't use or like so I don't add it but it's up to you. There is no reason to use a swap partition. That is something from the past. Not needed at all for the X5000 and you have lots of memory so you are good to go Pal

-A

[Pat the Cat]

If you have 2gigs of memory or more on the x5000 no swap partition is needed.

Sounds sensible enough, but I guess if you are running really big apps, a swap area for memory becomes necessary.

I guess if you never used an Amiga in the first place, X5000 is a whole load of fun. What a place to start!

[magnetic]

It would be good to get some sort of official word if the "Swap" is used or not in os4.

[chris]

It would be good to get some sort of official word if the "Swap" is used or not in os4.

It does definitely use it, however only 2GB RAM is directly accessible, so if you have that much physical memory, the swap partition probably isn't going to see any action.

[Rob]

I never bothered with a swap partition on my XE either and that had 1GB.

[slygon]

Thanks everyone for the answers!  

This already has been a ton of fun to play with.

I did do a clean install, it worked perfectly.  I used everyone's advice, I used the new file system (that was set up on the machine when I got it, and I believe it is you Aaron who recommended it on this thread!) no issues on re-partitioning the drive... I had to figure out how the graphics settings work... but I think I have that now....maybe.... it seems to work! and I skipped the trash can and swap.

Now... one more hopefully silly question... is there a "force quit" option in AmigaOS if an application hangs?  like CTRL-ALT-DEL on Windows or OPT-CMD-ESC on a Mac?  either way, is there a way to kill classic apps or the E-UAE emulator without rebooting the machine?  I have tried a few classic games, they work fine, but I can't figure out how to get out of them.... I am sure this is a silly question... but I can't find the magic button......

Thanks again everyone!

-Slygon

[amoskodare]

Not really.. but you can close the crashed program's window with a utility like Exorcist.

http://www.os4depot.net/index.php?function=showfile&file=utility/misc/exorcist.lha

[Pat the Cat]

Not really.. but you can close the crashed program's window with a utility like Exorcist.

http://www.os4depot.net/index.php?function=showfile&file=utility/misc/exorcist.lha

I understand that is one of the big advantages of V4 Amiga. You can more reliably shut down out of control software, unlike classic OS 3.9 and earlier, where sometimes you could, and sometimes, you couldn't. All classic OS has that kind of issue, and so does most Classic hardware. OK, most classic hardware you just soft reset or maybe power off too and try a different program. Different era of hardware.

What's also nice is, the software doesn't just load and execute in the first place, it's kind of assessed for compatibility with resources before it's executed. It doesn't just blindly expect everything to be loaded in the right place and ready to go.

[slygon]

Thanks!

How about programs that have not crashed, but take up the full screen, like classic apps running in E-UAE.... I know in the "old days" you just shut the machine off.... that is what I am doing now... but is that the only way?

And... speaking of... I have not found a way to "shutdown" the Amiga.... from what I can tell, you close your apps, and turn it off.... is this true?  I just want to make sure I am not missing something.... I am out of the habit of just turning off my computers... except for my trusty C-64.....

-Slygon

[amoskodare]

You can quit E-UAE with the shortcut left CTRL + left ALT + q
http://www.amigans.net/modules/xforum/viewtopic.php?post_id=43126

Yes, after (you have made sure you haven't any unsaved data and) the HD has stopped blinking, it's safe to just turn off the machine. However there are some tools to turn off the machine via software as well, like pOff (I'm unsure if it supports X5000 though).

[amigasociety]

You can quit E-UAE with the shortcut left CTRL + left ALT + q
http://www.amigans.net/modules/xforum/viewtopic.php?post_id=43126

Yes, after (you have made sure you haven't any unsaved data and) the HD has stopped blinking, it's safe to just turn off the machine. However there are some tools to turn off the machine via software as well, like pOff (I'm unsure if it supports X5000 though).

I liked the 4 or so second grace period the X1K had for shutdown.

Don't think that is an option as far as I know for X5K.

If I remember right... push the power button for like 4 seconds in order for the X to shutoff.  That way it gave the data time to save if something was wrapping up and you hit the button too soon.

TJ