Question about Hydra Systems AmigaNet 500

[xboxOwn]

I have some questions to ask about Hydra System AmigaNet 500: http://amiga.resource.cx/photos/amiganet500,2. Is this a normal Ethernet standard card like you see in normal nowadays PC? Can I just hook it directly to my modem and I immediately get access to the internet?

These are the specs mentioned below:

Hydra Systems, UK                 Date
1990Amiga
A500
Interface
side expansion port
Autoconfig ID
2121 / 1
            

Ethernet interface

• connects to the side expansion port - the case contains a standard Zorro II AmigaNet card
  
• National Semiconductor DP8390 Ethernet controller
• 16 kB SRAM buffer using DMA to and from the DP8390
• DB15 AUI port (10Base5)
• two BNC connectors (10Base2) - no need for T connectors, Hydras can be simply daisychained
• SANA II compatible driver (hydra.device)
• supported by Linux, NetBSD and OpenBSD

 
I am not so sure I understand the speed of it. Can I download 1 MB/sec file? How about 512 KB/sec file? Can I do that? There is works on a new internal accelerator for the Amiga 500 that suppose to give the Amiga 500 a major boost in CPU speed which outshines all the normal accelerators for the A500 (which when I look at them is truly horrible). Would I get a good internet performance or would I drop to 1 byte/sec even with this card? I understand zorro 2 is a horrible expansion port because it can only do 3.5 Mb/sec. However, this is great speed for internet for the A500 and I will be really happy if I get half or even 1 Mb/sec speed.

Thanks guys for taking your time and responding to my questions.

[Oldsmobile_Mike]

You're joking, right?  Just looking at the picture I can tell that card doesn't have an RJ45 jack.  So right off the bat I can tell you it won't "just plug in".  Networking on the Amiga is tricky, and moreso if you try to do it with old hardware like that.  You'd be better off to research something like the Plipbox.  Heck, even a Zorro adapter hanging off the side and connected to a modern card like the X-Surf 100 would be a better option for ya.  :lol:

[xboxOwn]

You're joking, right?  Just looking at the picture I can tell that card doesn't have an RJ45 jack.  So right off the bat I can tell you it won't "just plug in".  Networking on the Amiga is tricky, and moreso if you try to do it with old hardware like that.  You'd be better off to research something like the Plipbox.  Heck, even a Zorro adapter hanging off the side and connected to a modern card like the X-Surf 100 would be a better option for ya.  :lol:

I want to do that!! I want to connect the x-surf 100!! Where can I find such adapter? I don't care if it is * naked * without a case. I can always have fun and customize a case for it, if I want too. But that Zorro adapter you mentioned hanging, dangling on the side with x-surf 100 is the real solution I want. Are you saying if I do that, I will go get good speed and can do 512 Kb/sec download and stuff? I am happy with that number.

Again, where can I find the adapter?

[Oldsmobile_Mike]

I want to do that!! I want to connect the x-surf 100!! Where can I find such adapter? I don't care if it is * naked * without a case. I can always have fun and customize a case for it, if I want too. But that Zorro adapter you mentioned hanging, dangling on the side with x-surf 100 is the real solution I want. Are you saying if I do that, I will go get good speed and can do 512 Kb/sec download and stuff? I am happy with that number.

Again, where can I find the adapter?

I get a couple meg a second on my A2000, so yes, certainly, that speed is possible.  I run MiamiDX (Genesis, Roadshow, or any other TCP/IP stack will do), and plug right into the modern network at my office.  Obviously you're going to want some kind of internal solution that provides accelerator, extra memory, and a hard drive, of course.  Using a network with an unaccelerated, hard-drive-less Amiga isn't going to be very fun.    You might start by researching all those components, and plan carefully what you want to do.  Are you just wanting to download files off Aminet, or be able to browse the web, for example?

The adapter itself, most people make those themselves, I think.  Try posting on Amibay to see if anyone has one for sale?  They come up for sale pretty regularly over there.  Also google search "amiga 500 zorro adapter".  

[xboxOwn]

I get a couple meg a second on my A2000, so yes, certainly, that speed is possible.  I run MiamiDX (Genesis, Roadshow, or any other TCP/IP stack will do), and plug right into the modern network at my office.  Obviously you're going to want some kind of internal solution that provides accelerator, extra memory, and a hard drive, of course.  Using a network with an unaccelerated, hard-drive-less Amiga isn't going to be very fun.    You might start by researching all those components, and plan carefully what you want to do.  Are you just wanting to download files off Aminet, or be able to browse the web, for example?

The adapter itself, most people make those themselves, I think.  Try posting on Amibay to see if anyone has one for sale?  They come up for sale pretty regularly over there.  Also google search "amiga 500 zorro adapter".  

Thank you so much Oldsmobile this is my dream becoming reality. Yes, I do have intention to use my Amiga 500 for browsing the internet, aminet, gmail, downloads, IRC client (chat), etc. Yes, my intention to have the best internal accelerator in there to achieve my goal. With Vampire 500 release I will get my dream to come true. My Amiga 500 can finally compete against the A2000/A3000 series. With the fast CPU speed and RTG support and internet support my A500 can use AmiKit that is used in WinUAE for example and become a very useful computer. I would be able to use it as if I own an A4000T WITHOUT AGA which I am ok with.

I am so happy! With my Amiga 500 having also 2 MB CHIP RAM I don't think I will be asking for anymore. If this becomes true...I have sealed until I am dead and intend to mean it....the only Amiga classic configuration I will own and use. Amiga 500!! I love the fact I have external power supply, I love it's sexy case...remind me so much of the c64c or C128. I love the model as it was LITERALLY the FIRST Amiga computer I was ever introduced in MY ENTIRE life when I was in highschool and grade 10. Mmmmmm. Sweet!

[pVC]

I have some questions to ask about Hydra System AmigaNet 500: http://amiga.resource.cx/photos/amiganet500,2. Is this a normal Ethernet standard card like you see in normal nowadays PC? Can I just hook it directly to my modem and I immediately get access to the internet?

It doesn't have a modern RJ-45 connector, so you need either very old hub which has BNC connector or the easier way an AUI to RJ45 transceiver adapter. Here is a picture what kind of transceiver I have in my A2000 with Hydra's Amiganet 1.1 ZorroII card.

Of course you also need TCP/IP stack software installed, and more modern and easier options may be out of the question unless you have expanded your A500 with newer kickstart and maybe even CPU. But some old AmiTCP/IP versions probably should work with a less expanded system, but may be hard to set up.

I am not so sure I understand the speed of it. Can I download 1 MB/sec file? How about 512 KB/sec file? Can I do that? There is works on a new internal accelerator for the Amiga 500 that suppose to give the Amiga 500 a major boost in CPU speed which outshines all the normal accelerators for the A500 (which when I look at them is truly horrible). Would I get a good internet performance or would I drop to 1 byte/sec even with this card? I understand zorro 2 is a horrible expansion port because it can only do 3.5 Mb/sec. However, this is great speed for internet for the A500 and I will be really happy if I get half or even 1 Mb/sec speed.

1MB/s (about the theoretical max) will be out of the question, but the speed highly depends the CPU you have, as you have suspected.

I've got max 600kB/s with my Amiganet card in ZorroII bus on A1200 with overclocked 060/60MHz accelerator. Either Amiganet itself or ZorroII has been the limitation, because with Mediator setup and 10/100 PCI card I've now got max 1400kB/s.

I've put the Amiganet card to A2000/010, but haven't used it that much. I'm not completely sure now, but I'd remember that I got around 50kB/s speeds with it.

For comparison, my A1200/030@50MHz with PCMCIA network card gives around 400kB/s speeds, so it seems to be quite directly comparable to the CPU speed.

[danbeaver]

So what you want is an A4000T without the AGA, Zorro 3 bus, with 24-bit address lines, a couple of Zorro 2 slots that lack a bus controller for a NIC and a RTG card, using a Vampire 500 FPGA that competes with an A3000?

Is that correct?

[olsen]

I have some questions to ask about Hydra System AmigaNet 500: http://amiga.resource.cx/photos/amiganet500,2. Is this a normal Ethernet standard card like you see in normal nowadays PC? Can I just hook it directly to my modem and I immediately get access to the internet?

The short answer is "no". The "Hydra System AmigaNet 500" was designed and built 25 years ago, and the limitations of its design will restrict you to using the Internet, if at all, to how this was done back in 1990. No web browser, no gmail...

To begin with, you need an Amiga 500 to plug this hardware into. If I remember correctly, the Hydra Systems network driver software had issues with Kickstart 2.0, which is troublesome because the driver is not provided on a floppy disk, but it is stored in the ROM and cannot be changed or replaced. Chances are that it will not work well with contemporary Amiga network software.

The next problem would be in how to connect your local network and your modem (assuming that it is a cable modem or DSL modem) to this device. Modern Ethernet hardware uses a different kind of connector than you will find on the "Hydra System AmigaNet 500". The specifications state that it has an AUI interface and two BNC connectors, which means that you will have to find an additional set of hardware which connects a modern Ethernet network to the "AmigaNet 500". This is not impossible, but it's likely that you will have a hard time finding the 20 year old hardware to make this happen and which is still in good working order.

Put another way, trying to use the Amiga 500 combined with the "Hydra System AmigaNet 500" is like trying to make a 19th century narrow gauge steam locomotive run on the modern European high speed train network.

 
I am not so sure I understand the speed of it. Can I download 1 MB/sec file? How about 512 KB/sec file? Can I do that?

If I remember correctly, tests with an Amiga 600HD suggest that you may not get much more than 140 KBytes/second out of this type of hardware configuration. Hypothetically, an Amiga 500 with a "Hydra System AmigaNet 500" could probably reach that, too, but it's not a given.

There is works on a new internal accelerator for the Amiga 500 that suppose to give the Amiga 500 a major boost in CPU speed which outshines all the normal accelerators for the A500 (which when I look at them is truly horrible). Would I get a good internet performance or would I drop to 1 byte/sec even with this card? I understand zorro 2 is a horrible expansion port because it can only do 3.5 Mb/sec. However, this is great speed for internet for the A500 and I will be really happy if I get half or even 1 Mb/sec speed.

No, this won't work. Increasing the processing speed of the machine has little impact on how fast the network traffic is being processed. The limiting factor is the speed of your system memory. There is not a lot to be gained by trying to upgrade it.

Everything considered, I would strongly warn against sinking money into this hardware configuration if you expect to use it on today's Internet and not be thoroughly disappointed.

Given that the networking hardware has its limitations, the quality of the network drivers and the required additional investments into making the Ethernet connection work with today's technology, this has red flags all over it...

[olsen]

It doesn't have a modern RJ-45 connector, so you need either very old hub which has BNC connector or the easier way an AUI to RJ45 transceiver adapter. Here is a picture what kind of transceiver I have in my A2000 with Hydra's Amiganet 1.1 ZorroII card.

Just to clarify: the transceiver in question is the little gray box sticking out in the lower right corner of the machine. I believe that this device was manufactured by Allied Telesyn corporation (I have two of these myself: one for a Sun SPARC IPC workstation and one for an A2065 board).

[xboxOwn]

So what you want is an A4000T without the AGA, Zorro 3 bus, with 24-bit address lines, a couple of Zorro 2 slots that lack a bus controller for a NIC and a RTG card, using a Vampire 500 FPGA that competes with an A3000?

Is that correct?

Thank you all guys for the reply, Oldmobile have already answered my question * Looks back at danbeaver * No. What I want is an Amiga 500 (without towering) to do all my needs.

    Quote:
                                                                      Originally Posted by xboxOwn                                    
                 I have some questions to ask about Hydra System AmigaNet 500: http://amiga.resource.cx/photos/amiganet500,2.  Is this a normal Ethernet standard card like you see in normal nowadays  PC? Can I just hook it directly to my modem and I immediately get  access to the internet?
                                 
It doesn't have a modern RJ-45 connector, so you need either very  old hub which has BNC connector or the easier way an AUI to RJ45  transceiver adapter. Here is a picture what kind of transceiver I have in my A2000 with Hydra's Amiganet 1.1 ZorroII card.

Of course you also need TCP/IP stack software installed, and more modern  and easier options may be out of the question unless you have expanded  your A500 with newer kickstart and maybe even CPU. But some old  AmiTCP/IP versions probably should work with a less expanded system, but  may be hard to set up.

Can I say your A2000 looks delicious? Like one giant cheese cake waiting to be eating? I can't imagine how even more delicious the components would look inside.

[pVC]

Can I say your A2000 looks delicious? Like one giant cheese cake waiting to be eating? I can't imagine how even more delicious the components would look inside.

Hehe, well, you can't see that much, but here are inside and  front photos too This baby was going to be demolished, but I happened to rescue it just in time at the recycle center, got it for free with me.

[danbeaver]

. I would be able to use it as if I own an A4000T WITHOUT AGA which I am ok with.

Mmmmmm. Sweet!

I'm sorry if I misquoted exactly what you posted.

[Oldsmobile_Mike]

Hehe, well, you can't see that much, but here are inside and  front photos too This baby was going to be demolished, but I happened to rescue it just in time at the recycle center, got it for free with me.

That is a damned shame how people would send a nice system like that to the recycle center.    Kudos for saving her!  

[xboxOwn]

I'm sorry if I misquoted exactly what you posted.

No problem

[xboxOwn]

Hehe, well, you can't see that much, but here are inside and  front photos too This baby was going to be demolished, but I happened to rescue it just in time at the recycle center, got it for free with me.

Aaaaaaaaashhhhhhhh what a beautyyyyyyyyyyy!!!!!!!!!!!!!!