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AuthorTopic: "New" amiga hardware  (Read 13634 times)

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Offline biggun

Re: "New" amiga hardware
« Reply #30 on: August 20, 2014, 07:35:14 AM »
Quote from: spirantho;771259
@agami

It's not really practical to do that level of detail, and I don't think it should be done.

For one thing, the blog would be the most boring ever. Imagine it being like this:
"Today I made no progress. Tracking a bug."
"Still tracking a bug."
"another day. where is it?"
"Found a missing equals sign. Hurrah!"
"Still doesn't work. D'oh!"
"Ripped out huge chunk of code. Too much like spaghetti."
"Bug gone. Now had to write data structures for input handler."
"Wrote input handler"
"Found bug and squashed it"

It'd be a proper yawn-fest, so nobody would read it anyway.

Also:


I don't know of anybody who blogs to this level, and even if someone does, it doesn't mean the rest of us have to.

Nearly all Amiga work is done part time now. You don't want to see lots of blogs saying "Nothing got done today", but that is exactly what you would see.

Also, I don't see why a developer "should" do anything. The developer is not employed by a user, nor is he behooven to him on any way. If Toni Willen does it then great, that's nice, but that's just his personal choice.

Put simply, a developer can do whatever he wants in the manner he wants, it is not for the user to decide what he must and must not do. Trying to force rules and regimes on people who are basically just doing it for a hobby and love of the platform more than anything else is just going to push what developers we have left away.



Very good write!

Offline wawrzon

Re: "New" amiga hardware
« Reply #31 on: August 20, 2014, 10:34:38 AM »
how about that manner of comments:
http://repo.or.cz/w/AROS.git
i think its pretty informative, when its comes to the progress and what is being worked on. the code itself must not necessarily be public.
 

Offline OlafS3

Re: "New" amiga hardware
« Reply #32 on: August 20, 2014, 10:49:13 AM »
Quote from: spirantho;771259
@agami

It's not really practical to do that level of detail, and I don't think it should be done.

For one thing, the blog would be the most boring ever. Imagine it being like this:
"Today I made no progress. Tracking a bug."
"Still tracking a bug."
"another day. where is it?"
"Found a missing equals sign. Hurrah!"
"Still doesn't work. D'oh!"
"Ripped out huge chunk of code. Too much like spaghetti."
"Bug gone. Now had to write data structures for input handler."
"Wrote input handler"
"Found bug and squashed it"

It'd be a proper yawn-fest, so nobody would read it anyway.

Also:


I don't know of anybody who blogs to this level, and even if someone does, it doesn't mean the rest of us have to.

Nearly all Amiga work is done part time now. You don't want to see lots of blogs saying "Nothing got done today", but that is exactly what you would see.

Also, I don't see why a developer "should" do anything. The developer is not employed by a user, nor is he behooven to him on any way. If Toni Willen does it then great, that's nice, but that's just his personal choice.

Put simply, a developer can do whatever he wants in the manner he wants, it is not for the user to decide what he must and must not do. Trying to force rules and regimes on people who are basically just doing it for a hobby and love of the platform more than anything else is just going to push what developers we have left away.

a daily blog would be too much indeed (expecially when dealing with hobby projects where you not work regularly) so the update interval could depend on project progress, perhaps once a week or once a month. People have seen so many projects where people promised something, then stayed calm but still claiming project is still living and after years realizing that it propably is dead for a long time with them still hoping. Communication in "amiga country" is not the strongest part and the same doing in a more competitive environment would have meant "game over" for even some of the more known names.
 

Offline spirantho

Re: "New" amiga hardware
« Reply #33 on: August 20, 2014, 11:18:48 AM »
Absolutely. I'm all in favour of updates as and when they're useful. But there's no point in updating just for the sake of updating.
Many of my projects are years old - I'll work on them a bit, then I'll work on something else. Then I may come back to my other project again. If I make a big advance, then I tell people, but there's no point in updating people to say "I'm still not working on this project right now, but I may do in the future". My projects never die, they just rest. Sometimes permanently. :)
--
Ian Gledhill
ian.gledhill@btinternit.com (except it should be internEt of course...!)
Check out my shop! http://www.mutant-caterpillar.co.uk/shop/ - for 8-bit (and soon 16-bit) goodness!
 

Offline OlafS3

Re: "New" amiga hardware
« Reply #34 on: August 20, 2014, 11:27:16 AM »
Quote from: spirantho;771272
Absolutely. I'm all in favour of updates as and when they're useful. But there's no point in updating just for the sake of updating.
Many of my projects are years old - I'll work on them a bit, then I'll work on something else. Then I may come back to my other project again. If I make a big advance, then I tell people, but there's no point in updating people to say "I'm still not working on this project right now, but I may do in the future". My projects never die, they just rest. Sometimes permanently. :)

perhaps you should optimize your "working process" a little :)

I must admit if you are working on different projects now and then communication and blog might become complicated

like "I wanted to continue on xxx and did a little debugging found wrong typo but then I lost interest" :)

perhaps I am a little different there, I do not like to way to get somewhere, I like to reach the goals. Because of that I will not work on "many" different projects but only few (at the moment I am only working on one and still have new ideas even after years). But everybody is different.
 

Offline spirantho

Re: "New" amiga hardware
« Reply #35 on: August 20, 2014, 11:50:51 AM »
My working model is usually "Get a bit more done to do what I want it to do then, whatever" :)
For instance, in the Catweasel driver, I'll suddenly find I need a new codec for a different disk format. Or, I need to support a new file format like IPF, that sort of thing.
The unfortunate truth is that most coding updates really would be incredibly dull. Better to just to update when you have something to say.
--
Ian Gledhill
ian.gledhill@btinternit.com (except it should be internEt of course...!)
Check out my shop! http://www.mutant-caterpillar.co.uk/shop/ - for 8-bit (and soon 16-bit) goodness!
 

Offline agami

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Re: "New" amiga hardware
« Reply #36 on: August 21, 2014, 02:22:17 AM »
Quote from: spirantho;771259
@agami

It's not really practical to do that level of detail, and I don't think it should be done.

For one thing, the blog would be the most boring ever. Imagine it being like this:
"Today I made no progress. Tracking a bug."
"Still tracking a bug."
"another day. where is it?"
"Found a missing equals sign. Hurrah!"
"Still doesn't work. D'oh!"
"Ripped out huge chunk of code. Too much like spaghetti."
"Bug gone. Now had to write data structures for input handler."
"Wrote input handler"
"Found bug and squashed it"

It'd be a proper yawn-fest, so nobody would read it anyway.

Also:


I don't know of anybody who blogs to this level, and even if someone does, it doesn't mean the rest of us have to.

Nearly all Amiga work is done part time now. You don't want to see lots of blogs saying "Nothing got done today", but that is exactly what you would see.

Also, I don't see why a developer "should" do anything. The developer is not employed by a user, nor is he behooven to him on any way. If Toni Willen does it then great, that's nice, but that's just his personal choice.

Put simply, a developer can do whatever he wants in the manner he wants, it is not for the user to decide what he must and must not do. Trying to force rules and regimes on people who are basically just doing it for a hobby and love of the platform more than anything else is just going to push what developers we have left away.


Actually, even though it was a mock journal you wrote, that was interesting to read. Beats silence.

And also, I'll repeat it for the cheap seats, I said "at the end of a day of work", which means you don't post anything if you didn't work on it. If 6 months go by and you haven't posted then we know it hasn't been worked on in 6 months. And if you chase a bug for 5 days straight then we know more about how challenging this type of engineering is. In this game you don't score extra points for keeping your cards close to your chest.

Yes, some of it may be very "inside baseball", but another software or hardware engineer will appreciate it. It may give them some clues for their own project and it may open up your own project to comments from other engineers.

I am saying this of course for projects aimed at products planned for consumption  by the Amiga hobby community. If you are working on something purely for yourself then do whatever. Post or don't. But if you a looking for others to eventually buy your product then transparency is your friend.

This is just friendly marketing advice. As an Amiga hobbyist I'd like to know that there are people working on things that I could potentially use. But if enough months of silence go by then I'll pack up my A1200 and put in storage. Then when you decide your product is ready do you think I'm rushing to pull my Amiga out of storage?
---------------AGA Collection---------------
1) Amiga A4000 040 40MHz, Mediator PCI, Voodoo 3 3000, Creative PCI128, Fast Ethernet, Indivision AGA Mk2 CR, DVD/CD-RW, OS 3.9 BB2
2) Amiga A1200 040 25MHz, Indivision AGA Mk2 CR, IDEfix, PCMCIA WiFi, slim slot load DVD/CD-RW, OS 3.9 BB2
3) Amiga CD32 + SX1, OS 3.1
 

Offline biggun

Re: "New" amiga hardware
« Reply #37 on: September 05, 2014, 03:51:18 PM »
http://www.apollo-core.com/bringup/

Newsflash:
No real news.
We are still testing.
To make sure that all the games really work fine we have to play them to the end of course.
Therefore our testrate per day is limited.

Offline ElPolloDiabl

Re: "New" amiga hardware
« Reply #38 on: September 05, 2014, 04:37:01 PM »
I'd like to hear the occasional:
 "Made some progress"... "Didn't make any progress"
If there is no news at all, I start to worry that people might be leaving.
Go Go Gadget Signature!
 

Offline kickstart

Re: "New" amiga hardware
« Reply #39 on: September 05, 2014, 05:03:29 PM »
Quote from: spirantho;771259
@agami

It's not really practical to do that level of detail, and I don't think it should be done.

For one thing, the blog would be the most boring ever. Imagine it being like this:
"Today I made no progress. Tracking a bug."
"Still tracking a bug."
"another day. where is it?"
"Found a missing equals sign. Hurrah!"
"Still doesn't work. D'oh!"
"Ripped out huge chunk of code. Too much like spaghetti."
"Bug gone. Now had to write data structures for input handler."
"Wrote input handler"
"Found bug and squashed it"

It'd be a proper yawn-fest, so nobody would read it anyway.

Also:


I don't know of anybody who blogs to this level, and even if someone does, it doesn't mean the rest of us have to.

Nearly all Amiga work is done part time now. You don't want to see lots of blogs saying "Nothing got done today", but that is exactly what you would see.

Also, I don't see why a developer "should" do anything. The developer is not employed by a user, nor is he behooven to him on any way. If Toni Willen does it then great, that's nice, but that's just his personal choice.

Put simply, a developer can do whatever he wants in the manner he wants, it is not for the user to decide what he must and must not do. Trying to force rules and regimes on people who are basically just doing it for a hobby and love of the platform more than anything else is just going to push what developers we have left away.


Thats not the problem, no one force to developers to code... the problem is the announced projects, years of "news" and a bunch of pics on a outdated web... if someone ask for news about the projectthe anwser is ambiguous... but isnt better to be a victim.

A good example are the morphos team, they advertise a real work which can be used.
a1200 060
 

Offline Darth_X

Re: "New" amiga hardware
« Reply #40 on: September 05, 2014, 07:36:52 PM »
Quote from: magnetic;771152
Amiwest is about like minded people getting together and having fun. The only place in usa where amigans can get together. News from the show is not important to me especially concerning amiga os as its usually propaganda and nonsense. (such as gallium talk, multi core support, and my ALL TIME FAVORITE the Amiga Laptop "Already running OS4" which was a complete fabrication to dissuade amigans from having an awesome NG amiga laptop with Morphos and powermac)
I picked up a used G4 powerbook for $80 and it runs MorphOS just fine!

My main issue with these *Amigans* is that they seem to want to just suck a lot of money out of the last remaining Amiga fans instead of wanting to build up a new niche market for the Amiga computer platform. There's 7 billion people on this planet, so a happy niche/hobby/etc Amiga platform with 10 million or so people would be totally possible and viable..

They're making computers for the classes, not the masses! Which is completely opposite from the original Commodore & Amiga philosophy.
« Last Edit: September 05, 2014, 07:42:51 PM by Darth_X »
 

Offline wrath of khan

Re: "New" amiga hardware
« Reply #41 on: September 05, 2014, 11:45:24 PM »
Quote from: Darth_X;772393
I picked up a used G4 powerbook for $80 and it runs MorphOS just fine!

My main issue with these *Amigans* is that they seem to want to just suck a lot of money out of the last remaining Amiga fans instead of wanting to build up a new niche market for the Amiga computer platform. There's 7 billion people on this planet, so a happy niche/hobby/etc Amiga platform with 10 million or so people would be totally possible and viable..

They're making computers for the classes, not the masses! Which is completely opposite from the original Commodore & Amiga philosophy.
Is this necessarily the reasoning though? Perhaps they simply do not believe. It is imo idealistic to try and bring back the Amiga; but not impossible, I guess, as a niche anyways. It would be done 'for the love of it' though -and not for any grand notions of making lot's of money.

I guess also, that they are not exactly forcing people to buy their hardware, either.
Personally I think we need all hands on deck and so I would not think it sensible to alienate any people active in the amiga hardware scene by implying such things.

I'm hoping the apollo board bears fruit though; I want one.:)
 

Offline Darth_X

Re: "New" amiga hardware
« Reply #42 on: September 06, 2014, 08:38:59 AM »
Quote from: wrath of khan;772399
Is this necessarily the reasoning though? Perhaps they simply do not believe. It is imo idealistic to try and bring back the Amiga; but not impossible, I guess, as a niche anyways. It would be done 'for the love of it' though -and not for any grand notions of making lot's of money.

I guess also, that they are not exactly forcing people to buy their hardware, either.
Personally I think we need all hands on deck and so I would not think it sensible to alienate any people active in the amiga hardware scene by implying such things.

I'm hoping the apollo board bears fruit though; I want one.:)


Exacty! Well said. ;-)
 

Offline ElPolloDiabl

Re: "New" amiga hardware
« Reply #43 on: September 06, 2014, 08:51:38 AM »
@ above
Would both be true? The high prices keep the hobby going. It encourages developers and help fund future hardware.

Some people did hang around to take advantage of users. I think because of bitterness that Amiga did not make them rich.
Go Go Gadget Signature!
 

Offline biggun

Re: "New" amiga hardware
« Reply #44 on: September 06, 2014, 12:12:13 PM »
Update:
new progress video uploaded
http://www.apollo-core.com/bringup/

Is this way of updating the progress what people want?