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Author Topic: Flyer and SCSI drives  (Read 4400 times)

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Offline videofxTopic starter

Flyer and SCSI drives
« on: February 18, 2013, 04:28:17 PM »
Hi,
 
I bought a Toaster Flyer and it has 3 SCSI connections. 2 for video and 1 for audio.
 
I will be connecting only one drive per cable.
 
Do the drives need to be terminated? If yes active or passive?
 
THanks
 
Bill
 

Offline mark_k

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Re: Flyer and SCSI drives
« Reply #1 on: February 18, 2013, 06:23:51 PM »
According to amiga-hardware.com the Flyer SCSI can't be used as a general-purpose SCSI card, if that's what you were planning. :(

The shorter the SCSI chain, the less critical termination is. You might be able to get away with no termination, or the hard drive's built-in termination. If the hard drive's built-in termination is passive, you might get better results with a separate active terminator. But it probably won't make much difference if your cables are short.
 

Offline Zac67

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Re: Flyer and SCSI drives
« Reply #2 on: February 18, 2013, 08:48:06 PM »
A SCSI bus requires two terminators, one at each end. The Flyer's got 3 busses. You need each drive to provide termination or a cable terminator each. Active ones are slightly better but passive will suffice.
 

Offline mbrantley

Re: Flyer and SCSI drives
« Reply #3 on: February 19, 2013, 05:30:06 AM »
I need to start reading all these recent Toaster/Flyer cards, as this fall I got my 2000/060-based Toaster Flyer system up and running.

I am running three flat SCSI cables out of the back of my 2000 to external cases with a trio of 36GB Seagate drives. I got these drives new from Amazon in recent months. No, they were not cheap compared to today's price-per-gig in SATA drives.

Apparently these new(er) SCSI hard drive do not have terminators on them. My system mostly works without them, but every now and again I will get an error mentioning to check termination. I have bought three (I guess passive) terminators but have not yet installed them. I have to take the drive enclosures apart again to do that. My flat SCSI cables have connections for 2 drives each, so I guess I will plug the terminators in where the 2nd drive would go.

I'll report back when I get that done, but it might be days/weeks before I get around to it.

I have edited one short video with footage I shot a few years ago when my little girl was a toddler. What fun! I really like the Flyer interface. Amazing stuff for the 1990s.

On my job I use Adobe Premiere Pro CS6 and Final Cut Pro X. But I like playing with this old Amiga stuff too.
 

Offline videofxTopic starter

Re: Flyer and SCSI drives
« Reply #4 on: February 19, 2013, 05:34:40 AM »
I just picked up brand new 73GB Seagate Cheetah 10k drives for $20 each.
 
I will use short cables and have passive terminators on each drive.
 
I will let you know how it works.
 

Offline mbrantley

Re: Flyer and SCSI drives
« Reply #5 on: February 19, 2013, 05:39:03 AM »
Very cool! Look forward to reading how you make out. :D
 

Offline videofxTopic starter

Re: Flyer and SCSI drives
« Reply #6 on: February 19, 2013, 05:40:26 AM »
By the way, for the flyer how many inches is short? Will 24 inches be too long?
 

Offline Heiroglyph

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Re: Flyer and SCSI drives
« Reply #7 on: February 19, 2013, 05:41:20 AM »
If you can find scsi to IDE adapters cheap enough, I've used newer IDE drives on Flyers with no problems.  I think I was using 160GB 7200 RPM drives.

At the time the price per GB for IDE was much better, but probably not worth it anymore.  People practically give those old SCSI drives away now.

Awesome deal for those 73GB drives.
 

Offline mbrantley

Re: Flyer and SCSI drives
« Reply #8 on: February 19, 2013, 05:44:16 AM »
Quote from: videofx;726918
By the way, for the flyer how many inches is short? Will 24 inches be too long?


I am pretty sure mine are slightly longer than that since I am going out to external enclosures. Not sure exactly the length, however.

I have also acquired a crimping tool and materials to make my own SCSI cables, in case I need to further customize my setup.
 

Offline Heiroglyph

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Re: Flyer and SCSI drives
« Reply #9 on: February 19, 2013, 05:46:05 AM »
Quote from: videofx;726918
By the way, for the flyer how many inches is short? Will 24 inches be too long?

There is no too short.  With good quality shielded cables 3+ feet isn't uncommon and the max is seriously like 9 feet!

2 feet isn't bad even with flat ribbon cables.
« Last Edit: February 19, 2013, 02:25:23 PM by Heiroglyph »
 

Offline Zac67

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Re: Flyer and SCSI drives
« Reply #10 on: February 19, 2013, 07:28:48 AM »
Fast SCSI allows up to 3m cable, terminator-to-terminator.
 

Offline Heiroglyph

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Re: Flyer and SCSI drives
« Reply #11 on: February 19, 2013, 02:24:36 PM »
Quote from: Zac67;726929
Fast SCSI allows up to 3m cable, terminator-to-terminator.


Man, why did I jump to metric mid sentence?  Don't drink and post...

I'll edit the post.  I meant 3 meters or 9 feet.
 

Offline videofxTopic starter

Re: Flyer and SCSI drives
« Reply #12 on: February 19, 2013, 03:32:15 PM »
Everyones suggestion to use SCSI to IDE adapters was a good one. I looked at this first. The only problem was the best price I could find the ACARDS for was $80 each X 4= $320 + hard drives. So I thought 4 drives at a total cost $80 was the way to go for now :)
 
Now I need to order cables. Hopefully my flyer will show up soon :biglaugh:
 

Offline videofxTopic starter

Re: Flyer and SCSI drives
« Reply #13 on: February 19, 2013, 05:35:20 PM »
When I meant short cable I meant how short do they need to be not to have to worry about temination?
 

Offline mark_k

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Re: Flyer and SCSI drives
« Reply #14 on: February 19, 2013, 06:44:41 PM »
You should always terminate the SCSI chain properly, if possible. But you might be able to get away with not terminating a 2ft chain. The chances of getting away with it are better for asynchronous SCSI (3MB/sec) rather than synchronous SCSI (10MB/sec).