opinions on ppc options ..please

[AAACHIPSET]

i enjoy  my 1200 ..truely  with the  cd  fast readin  an writing ,90 meg ram
blizzard 030/50/fpu  .2 compact flash 4 gig cards ..indivision aga (fantastic)  an  lots  whdownload  games  ..fully registered  i might add  as well as the ability to play doom an even doom 2 running of the cd  i am quite happy  ..spoilt  i think  ..but id still like a ppc card  ...the chances  of  gettin one in australia  seems  unlikley  in good condition  ..ive  been thinking  about a sam
or similar  ppc  machine  ..that would  mean another computer  an monitor an i dont know if i can justify it ..cost  prob  similar  between a ppc/060 for the 1200  ..as  a sam  etc  ...was  gonna hold  out  hoping for a natami  but who knows when that will ever appear ..be like waiting for the AAAchipset  ..as i did before  ..id  like  to be able  to play  with a ppc machine  ..run  os4 ..an go online  with  my amiga  ..my  1200  cant  go online  ..where would i plug the broadband?? ...an although  i still want to network it eventually  to my pc
an get a usb  card  i still cant  see  it really being a net machine  ...a ppc based  amiga  can  go online  etc ...anyway  enuff rambling  ..opinions  wanted  ..those who have a ppc card on the 1200 aga only  an or  a sam  machine  with  0s4  what is it like  ..is it worth the money?? ..the time?
opinions  please ..

[pampers]

In my opinion it's not worth:

- absolutely insane price
- ok, you will install os 4.1 classic but it will be slow as hell
- no moder morphos support
- using it under os 3.x doesn't make too much sense.

[wawrzon]

no. i keep my csppc only for the scsi interface and compact form. dont use ppc side any much. might as well sell it some day.

[Piru]

If you insist on OS4 your options are either insanely expensive or underpowered.

[Kronos]

Buy a 2nd hand MacMini,PowerMac,eMac or PowerBook with G4-CPU and install MorphOS (http://www.morphos-team.net/). Will set you down just 100-300 Euro (depending on which HW you choose) and will give you as much modern PPC-Amiga as one can get.

Just read the FAQ to make sure you buy a supported model.

[gazgod]

no. i keep my csppc only for the scsi interface and compact form. dont use ppc side any much. might as well sell it some day.

I must agree, as the owner of a csppc, a ppc on a classic is about as much use as tits on a bull.

[nasty]

I spent a lot of money on building up my Amiga 1200 with all the bells and whistles (did it a few times) and for all you gain I personally don't think (now) it worth the hassle and expense.

I mostly used my Amiga for gaming and gfx work and it was nice to play games like hereticII, wipeout and nightlong but you can get all these games that run better on a pc for next to nothing.  So once I sold my BPPC's I decided I needed my Amiga fix and my first thought was OS4 but the price yet again was something to think about.

But then a few people recommend MorphOS, so I looked into that and with MOS having a FAB hes sorted all my amiga needs and Morphos is a system you can use everyday. So Morphos on a mini mac was a perfect replacement for myself. so if you going to go NG then personally ask questions and more question,watch videos and see what system is for you!

[Karlos]

I have the BlizzardPPC+BVision combination. They were expensive enough when they were new and they've only gotten moreso since.

My first caution then is the price. I really don't believe the classic PPC cards are worth the crazy prices they fetch. However, if you insist...

As for an objective opinion on performance. Well, I have the 040 version. Under OS3.1-3.9, I use the PPC principally for datatypes and media playback. There's no denying that even with the dreaded context switch overhead that it kicks the 040's ass for that. However, I reckon a fast 68060 would do just as well in many cases and potentially better in some. Beyond that, I for the various WarpOS / PowerUP applications and games that were originally written for it. Are there enough of them to be worth it? I'm not sure. Probably not, in reality. Summary: an expensive co-processor for the OS without a large enough library of software to really justify the price IMO.

Then there's OS4. At least your PPC is getting some use, but while using AGA only is possible, but you'll have to make all the same basic cutbacks you'd have to do under 3.x to get usable performance. Chip RAM access is as slow as it ever was and as the PPC can do much more work per unit time than the 040, those wasted cycles spent reading/writing ChipRAM equate to a bigger percentage reduction in real performance. It doesn't help that out of the box, it tries to use display settings that are just too slow (256 colours, gradients, solid window moving/sizing etc).

In short, unless you intend to use a graphics card with it, forget it. With a graphics card, even the BVision, there are some surprises. I found that a few 68K applications I regularly use on 3.9 under RTG ran considerably faster on 4.1 with RTG. I'd say that basically, 4.1 classic is for users that already have PPC and associated expansions rather than someone looking to upgrade.

If you must go PPC, then I'd suggest you focus on getting either a new Sam on which to run OS4.1 or a PPC Mac to run MorphOS (note to self, one has to be careful mentioning these in the same paragraph as it can be rather like using a lighter to illuminate a warehouse full of explosives during a blackout). For some, the choice between the two has become akin to a religious divide but objectively, the latter is cheaper and has been in development for longer. Be prepared to be flamed either way, if you go for 4.1 you'll be regarded as insane by some, if you go for MorphOS you'll be branded a heretic by others

Personally, I'd suggest that if you want to stay "classic", look for the fastest 68060 card you can get and give PPC a miss. Otherwise you'll need to buy more than just an already priced-as-if-made-of-gold PPC board for your A1200.

[spirantho]

I'd also look out for a second hand Sam 440ep. I have the 600Mhz one and it's a really nice machine. Plus if you get it second hand it'll likely come with the OS4 license, so you shouldn't end up paying much more than you would do for a PowerMac running MorphOS (OS4 machines can be had for quite reasonable prices now, as people have upgraded to Sam 440s to Sam 460s and XEs to X1000). True, PowerMacs are a fair amount faster, but many people don't need the extra speed (I still enjoy my Sam despite it being slower than many).
It really depends on whether you prefer MOS or AmigaOS 4, but that's an old argument that's entirely down to the user - prefer MOS? Get a PowerMac. Prefer AmigaOS? Get a Sam.

Either way, they're both good options. I wouldn't go the BlizzardPPC route, though, they're expensive, underpowered and unreliable. That said I still enjoy my CSPPC.

(My wife says get a PowerMac, because MorphOS is blue and has a pretty butterfly - can't argue with that really )

[motrucker]

For what you want to do, the only option that make any sense at all is buy a Mac mini and MorphOS. Get something you can actually use!

[rvo_nl]

well, ofcourse I disagree with most of you..

get that ppc. get the fastest one, like those 060/330mhz versions that you can find on amibay at times. get the bvision. get the pcmcia right-angle adapter and a pcmcia ethernet card. get os4.1. insanely expensive? yes. a very frustrating software installation? yes. prone to breaking down? well, yes.. but definitely worth it one you got it running! imho the most you can get out of the real classic amiga -thats what counts for me. all the other stuff I can do on my pc.

[Havie]

Well, I have dreamed of owning a PPC for Amiga 1200 but the cards do seem rather expensive and I suppose you have to ask whether you would get much use out of one?  No good for games (apart from the odd PC conversion - and that's what PCs and Playstations are for) and not a great deal of productivity software?
 
If there was a really modern browser, a copy of open office and good printer drivers then I might be convincec but from what I can see (not having one) - there isn't? (I do see that the OS4 browsers are good but not really anywhere near any of the PC ones).
 
I think you might be better dreaming of an 060 clocked as high as possible.  Definintely more useful for Amiga games and would speed up normal workbench etc.  That's certainly where I might go one day...

[Karlos]

well, ofcourse I disagree with most of you..

get that ppc. get the fastest one, like those 060/330mhz versions that you can find on amibay at times. get the bvision. get the pcmcia right-angle adapter and a pcmcia ethernet card. get os4.1. insanely expensive? yes. a very frustrating software installation? yes. prone to breaking down? well, yes.. but definitely worth it one you got it running! imho the most you can get out of the real classic amiga -thats what counts for me. all the other stuff I can do on my pc.

Don't get me wrong, I love my PPC A1200 and like yourself, enjoy seeing what can be achieved with it. I wouldn't consider myself an enthusiast otherwise. However, I'm also a realist - to build it from scratch now would cost a not inconsiderable amount of money and isn't something I could recommend to someone on a "try it and see" basis.

[klx300r]

@ AAACHIPSET

well my 2 cents is you seem happy with your current setup and it doesnt look like adding the fastest PPC card will get you running that much more stuff you already enjoying and most importantly still wont get you up to modern browsing.

With the crazy costs of classics PPC cards nowadays I would rather buy either a new/ used Sam460 with AmigaOS4.1 or if you already have some old Apple hardware lying around your place try MOS. There is also AROS which is making great strides on bog standard PC's as well as netbooks (I personally use AspireOS on an old Netbook and it's great fun)

I personally have found that since moving up to AmigaOs4.1 my 1200 with 030@50 is sadly hardly ever used nowadays as I can do all my net browsing comfortably and my favourite 68k apps & games run great on OS4.1 and seamlessly with great programs like glUAE or RunInUAE. A bonus is you can dual boot into Linux Debian and instantly use the multitude of apps available as well.

The best part of getting a NG Amiga system is the community support whether that be AOS, MOS, or AROS!

[wawrzon]

i refused or rather was not interested in p5 ppc solution since ever i remember. it was even partly the initial reason for me not to invest into the platform anymore since i regarded the technical solution clumsy, halfa$$ed while too complicated and therefore too expensive. it was clear for me that with decisions like this the end of the pole was near.
then i got the ppc board few years ago, wanting even to minimally to improve on what 060 amigas could still do for me. and was bitterly disappointed, getting os4 didnt help any further.
following development of 4.1classic since i admittedly like the w3d readeon support and compositing it got, alas it is not enough for me to invest into it and it doesnt look like it goes in any further (at least in a direction id regard any useful)