Jens Shoenfeld's anwer to the Apollo petition

[AmiDude]

I can't say I've seen many problems myself, actually.. and I looked on Google too. Do you have links? (Not trolling or criticising, I'm genuinely interested)

Just google "aca1230/42 problems" and you will see various of posts.
Example link: ACA1231/42 problems

[rewlako]

#1
I'm into Amiga's since 1985, so I guess that makes me an expert user. And don't acuse me of trolling; I'm an A.org member since 2005. You on the other hand could well be a troll; member since April 2012... Very suspicious...

Oh, give me a break.  I started in 1987, not long after you.  A.org membership means nothing.  If I'm wrong in my accusations, please accept my apologies, but you do sound very novice in your posts.

#2
Why not, you say? Ask Jens!

No, you made the statement, you explain it.  At least explain what happens, and how you know the SDRAM is to blame.  Give me a reproducible real-life example.

#3
Anything can get fried, especially by very novice users that don't know what they're doing.

The whole Amiga can get fried by very novice users.  Your concern should't be focused on the ACA, but every electronic item in the world.

#4
EDO is cheap too, and very easy to replace.

Yes, but the advantage of SMD SDRAM outweighs EDO.

#5
He could put an FPU socket onto the boards, so that buyers can deside to put on an FPU or not. It's their decision in the end.

True, but that would mean A) a bigger board, B) more components (trust me, a socket isn't enough) C) more testing, D) people start messing with the boards (see your argument #3), E) more support for Jens.

#6
I did too, and find many. Sorry.

Then please give me a a few links.  I googled, and found the opposite, people love it.  But maybe my google-fu is a bit rusty.

Sorry if I come out as rude, it's nothing personal against you.
Disclaimer: I'm not Jens (nor affiliated with him in any way)

[AmiDude]

...but you do sound very novice in your posts.

You're not a bright light neither.

No, you made the statement, you explain it. At least explain what happens, and how you know the SDRAM is to blame. Give me a reproducible real-life example.

I'm not an technical engineer. I just experience problems with some games which I don't have with other accelerators.

True, but that would mean A) a bigger board, B) more components (trust me, a socket isn't enough) C) more testing, D) people start messing with the boards (see your argument #3), E) more support for Jens.

If the board has no FPU, then it's not interesting for me and a whole bunch of other Amiga fans.

Sorry if I come out as rude, it's nothing personal against you.
Disclaimer: I'm not Jens (nor affiliated with him in any way)

You do sound so.

[rewlako]

I'm not an technical engineer. I just experience problems with some games which I don't have with other accelerators.

Ok.  I am an electronics engineer, so I wanted to see if your accusations were based on facts or.. well.. speculation.  Not even being able to give a reproducible example leads me to think it's the latter.

If the board has no FPU, then it's not interesting for me and a whole bunch of other Amiga fans.

There will always be complaints about products.  Every product.  "Why doesn't it have this, why doesn't it support that..."

You can't make everyone happy.  Corners needs to be cut in order to keep the price down.  If it's too expensive, nobody will buy it.  If you have been with Amiga since 1985, you should have seen examples of this over and over again.

You do sound so.

Ok, sorry.  I have a tendency to sound very harsh and aggressive.

Again, nothing personal.  Just the way I am.

[AmiDude]

Ok.  I am an electronics engineer, so I wanted to see if your accusations were based on facts or.. well.. speculation.  Not even being able to give a reproducible example leads me to think it's the latter.

My accusations ARE based on facts. I (and others) encountered several problems with the ACA cards. I don't need to be an electronics engineer for that. That's a FACT!  
Don't get me wrong, but there is nothing wrong by holding new products against the light.

Ok, sorry.  I have a tendency to sound very harsh and aggressive.

Again, nothing personal.  Just the way I am.

I'm glad that you know yourself that good. So, you're an ACA worshipper... That's OK. Have fun!

[KimmoK]

It would be nice to see summary of ACA1231 issues & fixes, as it looks appealing if I one day own A1200.

Some things can be fixed on A1200:
http://eab.abime.net/showthread.php?t=63693

[rewlako]

My accusations ARE based on facts. I (and others) encountered several problems with the ACA cards. I don't need to be an electronics engineer for that. That's a FACT!  
Don't get me wrong, but there is nothing wrong by holding new products against the light.

Then, please, reproducible examples.  This is the third time I'm requesting it.  Start by giving me an example of a program that "doesn't work" because of the SDRAM - this should be an easy task for you.

By all means, for all that I know you could be right.  But, if you are, prove it or back down.

I'm glad that you know yourself that good. So, you're an ACA worshipper... That's OK. Have fun!

I don't even own one.  I'm sorry for pinning you down on this one, but I have problems with people blaming their incompetence on technical flaws, when it is obvious that they have no clue what they are talking about.

Unless you can give me some data to work with, I say we're done here.

[whabang]

I've been around here since the dinosaurs roamed the server halls, so if you lot would please stop bickering?

SDRAM is not a problem in itself - the problem is ancient software hard-coded to rely on chipset, CPU and RAM timing to function. Well-programmed software should have no hardware-related issues running on a system just because it has a faster type of RAM.

[AmiDude]

Then, please, reproducible examples.  This is the third time I'm requesting it.  Start by giving me an example of a program that "doesn't work" because of the SDRAM - this should be an easy task for you.

By all means, for all that I know you could be right.  But, if you are, prove it or back down.



I don't even own one.  I'm sorry for pinning you down on this one, but I have problems with people blaming their incompetence on technical flaws, when it is obvious that they have no clue what they are talking about.

Unless you can give me some data to work with, I say we're done here.

I've give you an explanation about some "older" games that refuses to work with the ACA accelerator. They just don't start or freezing while playing the game. This doesn't occur with my Blizzard or Apollo accelerators. Don't need further explanation.
So, I DO know what I'm talking about, and you're obviously NOT, since you don't even own an ACA. Don't make me laugh! You just come and barg in here, screaming and yelling. about stuff you don't even have experience with.
Now, move along and go somewhere else trolling!

[Crumb]

I've give you an explanation about some "older" games that refuses to work with the ACA accelerator. They just don't start or freezing while playing the game. This doesn't occur with my Blizzard or Apollo accelerators. Don't need further explanation.

Which ones? I'd like to test them :-)

[tribz]

My accusations ARE based on facts. I (and others) encountered several problems with the ACA cards. I don't need to be an electronics engineer for that. That's a FACT!  
Don't get me wrong, but there is nothing wrong by holding new products against the light.

 

I'm glad that you know yourself that good. So, you're an ACA worshipper... That's OK. Have fun!

Just do the timing fixes and see if its a problem after that.

[Snoozy]

I've give you an explanation about some "older" games that refuses to work with the ACA accelerator. They just don't start or freezing while playing the game. This doesn't occur with my Blizzard or Apollo accelerators. Don't need further explanation.
So, I DO know what I'm talking about, and you're obviously NOT, since you don't even own an ACA. Don't make me laugh! You just come and barg in here, screaming and yelling. about stuff you don't even have experience with.
Now, move along and go somewhere else trolling!

I have an ACA card and the total number of games i have found incompatible on my 1200 2b are zero.
 
And i wouldn't touch an apollo card with a bargepole (I have a blizzard though)

[mechy]

Mechy I wasnt talking about Jens specifically. I was adressing the comment "i would have told them to F-off tossers"

Also, I had a Toaster and amiga business with a public phone number. Believe me I know how hard it is to deal with amiga customers :0

Sorry about that if i misread.

Mech

[runequester]

I have an ACA card and the total number of games i have found incompatible on my 1200 2b are zero.
 
And i wouldn't touch an apollo card with a bargepole (I have a blizzard though)

I've had exactly one game that didn't work, but I forget the title now. Otherwise, the ACA's are what I'd call "pretty damn compatible".

Of course, the difference between the EC020 and an 030 in itself can cause an incompatibility.

[Zac67]

Of course, the difference between the EC020 and an 030 in itself can cause an incompatibility.

Actually, the '030 is a shrinked '020 with a (slightly simplified) MMU plus a tiny data cache. Not much of a source for incompatibilities unless you forcefully create one.

[runequester]

Actually, the '030 is a shrinked '020 with a (slightly simplified) MMU plus a tiny data cache. Not much of a source for incompatibilities unless you forcefully create one.

Gotcha. When I got my first 030/25 card, forget the manufacturer, I saw some very slight issues, so I figured there were some loss of compatibility