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Author Topic: Amiga Case Designer Faces Intimidation  (Read 77546 times)

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Offline spirantho

Re: Amiga Case Designer Faces Intimidation
« Reply #404 from previous page: May 10, 2012, 07:18:33 PM »
Quote from: jorkany;692631
This is a joke, right? Or are you posting this from 1990?


This is basically the crux of the C=USA argument, that Amiga is a cutting edge industry respected brand.

So unless you're calling the entire C=USA operation a joke, then....

... oh, hang on.... er...
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Offline mongo

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Re: Amiga Case Designer Faces Intimidation
« Reply #405 on: May 10, 2012, 07:19:43 PM »
AMIGA, INC. CORPORATION WASHINGTON, the registered owner of the Amiga trademark is an inactive corporation and is unable to conduct any business, including licensing their trademark to Commodore USA.
 

Offline startup-sequence.bat

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Re: Amiga Case Designer Faces Intimidation
« Reply #406 on: May 10, 2012, 07:32:04 PM »
Quote from: TheDaddy;692621
LOL! :)

Smells like CUSA...

Amiga strong, cutting edge technology? LOL! Which one...the one of the '80s-'90s?
Steal the name? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! Nice one!

Another fresh account...2 posts...this is a farce! Priceless!


Well, surely people wouldn't go to so much trouble and money to purchase one of the few machines capable of running modern versions of amigaos 4.x or morphos if it was just some obsolete, worthless thing, right?
 

Offline DutchinUSA

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Re: Amiga Case Designer Faces Intimidation
« Reply #407 on: May 10, 2012, 07:39:19 PM »
*Yawn* the games people play

:uzi: Trolls !! :destroy:
 

Offline TheDaddy

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Re: Amiga Case Designer Faces Intimidation
« Reply #408 on: May 10, 2012, 07:43:31 PM »
Quote from: startup-sequence.bat;692638
Well, surely people wouldn't go to so much trouble and money to purchase one of the few machines capable of running modern versions of amigaos 4.x or morphos if it was just some obsolete, worthless thing, right?


What's that got to do with anything?

Read your comment again...it's laughable. :D
 

Offline commodorejohn

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Re: Amiga Case Designer Faces Intimidation
« Reply #409 on: May 10, 2012, 09:29:01 PM »
Quote from: startup-sequence.bat;692615
Amiga is a strong, cutting edge technology and brand but if anyone can  steal the name and put it on anything then its rightful owners won't be  able to make a living out of it, much less bring it back to its rightful  position as market leader.
Yeah, there's just a bit of a gap between "long-abandoned but beloved machine with a devoted and still-active fanbase" and "actually any kind of contender at all in any corner of the general PC market." Cripes, even to match up with Apple you'd have to get somewhere between 15-20% of the market.

(And by "a bit of a gap" I of course mean "Valles Marineris.")
Computers: Amiga 1200, DEC VAXStation 4000/60, DEC MicroPDP-11/73
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Offline vox

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Re: Amiga Case Designer Faces Intimidation
« Reply #410 on: May 10, 2012, 09:30:44 PM »
Quote from: startup-sequence.bat;692638
Well, surely people wouldn't go to so much trouble and money to purchase one of the few machines capable of running modern versions of amigaos 4.x or morphos if it was just some obsolete, worthless thing, right?


Surely all MOS / OS4 users have been through a lot of trouble and investment, you are right about that.

But, its not "obsolete, worthless thing" but most modern editions of AmigaOS`s.

Surely just easy web shopping with credit card is not enough to get people buying fake Amigas for twice price of same x86 system.
Future Acube and MOS supporter, fi di good, nothing fi di unprofessionals. Learn it harder way! http://www.youtube.com/user/rasvoja and https://www.facebook.com/rasvoja
 

Offline startup-sequence.bat

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Re: Amiga Case Designer Faces Intimidation
« Reply #411 on: May 10, 2012, 09:52:15 PM »
Quote from: vox;692650
Surely all MOS / OS4 users have been through a lot of trouble and investment, you are right about that.

But, its not "obsolete, worthless thing" but most modern editions of AmigaOS`s.

Is there a difference? Are those modern editions of amiga os more capable than the original, or as capable as any popular os?

Quote
Surely just easy web shopping with credit card is not enough to get people buying fake Amigas for twice price of same x86 system.


What is a true amiga?
 

Offline vox

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Re: Amiga Case Designer Faces Intimidation
« Reply #412 on: May 10, 2012, 10:41:45 PM »
They are way more powerful then AmigaOS.
Reason why it isnt developed as Linux are gaps in development from OS 3.5 to OS 3.9, OS 3.9 to OS 4.0 final and during process with Amiga Inc. One or two releases and OS alone will be quite modern (same goes for MorphOS and AROS)

True Amiga isnt just some (in)valuable everyday commodity with sticker over it trying to increase value.

Even X1000 and SAMs (Minimig, Natami, FPGA Arcade, Pegasos, Efika ...) are also motherboards, they are quite unique as similar are rarely available today.

True Amiga is in user controlled experience over computer (=OS), and was over hardware at chipset time. Experienced user in charge of fully customizable responsive OS. It would stand for optimized software that should take best out of hardware.
« Last Edit: May 10, 2012, 10:46:29 PM by vox »
Future Acube and MOS supporter, fi di good, nothing fi di unprofessionals. Learn it harder way! http://www.youtube.com/user/rasvoja and https://www.facebook.com/rasvoja
 

Offline spirantho

Re: Amiga Case Designer Faces Intimidation
« Reply #413 on: May 10, 2012, 10:47:13 PM »
Quote from: startup-sequence.bat;692651
Is there a difference? Are those modern editions of amiga os more capable than the original, or as capable as any popular os?


Yes. They are all three (AOS 4, MOS, AROS) more capable than AOS 3 by quite some way.
Don't get me wrong, AOS 3.x is a brilliant OS, but these days it lacks some features which are necessary.

Quote

What is a true amiga?


There will always be differing opinions - and it's a debate that's being going on for years.
However, I think any Amiga user can agree that a Linux PC with "Amiga" engraved on the front is no more an Amiga than it is a Cray 2 Supercomputer.
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Offline startup-sequence.bat

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Re: Amiga Case Designer Faces Intimidation
« Reply #414 on: May 10, 2012, 10:54:05 PM »
Quote from: vox;692659
They are way more powerful then AmigaOS.

In which way?

Quote
Even X1000 and SAMs (Minimig, Natami, FPGA Arcade, Pegasos, Efika ...) are also motherboards, they are quite unique as similar are rarely available today.

They are unique, but what are their unique selling point? From a hardware point of view, why do I want one of those instead of commodity hardware?

Quote
True Amiga is in user controlled experience over computer (=OS), and was over hardware at chipset time. Experienced user in charge of fully customizable responsive OS.

How is that different from a linux? Actually, linux being open source I would think the user would be in charge on a level unparalleled by any closed source os.

Quote
It would stand for optimized software that should take best out of hardware.

But is it worth to bother taking the most out of hardware which is orders of magnitude less powerful than commodity hardware anyway?
 

Offline lsmart

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Re: Amiga Case Designer Faces Intimidation
« Reply #415 on: May 10, 2012, 11:03:03 PM »
Quote from: startup-sequence.bat;692651
Is there a difference? Are those modern editions of amiga os more capable than the original, or as capable as any popular os?

Is this a trick question? The answer is a bit complicated:

Amiga OS had a low overhead architecture and both MorphOS and AmigaOS4 are trying to keep this intact ... with varying degrees of success.

There is great software that hasn't been adequately replaced on other platforms and can only be run in emulation or the real Amiga.

Old Amigas can not easily produce or consume data formats that are common on current implementations of Linux, Mac OS, IOs and Windows, except when it is plain text. NG Amigas are far better in that respect. NG Amiga Hardware is dreadfully slow, even the X1000 is no match for a modern PC. G4 Macs perform worse than iPads.

So Amigas and NG Amigas are less capable than current PCs but very different in software. The original Amiga HW has a superior design compared to the NG Amigas, but suffer from their slow clock speeds and cacheless architecture.

The Amiga line of computers has ended and so will the NG Amiga line in about ten years. If you want to open a new line of computers and give the name Amiga to them - fine, but don`t fool yourself: branding something "Amiga" doesn't change the value of the product by one iota. So if you are selling vanilla PCs you have to face it: they are just PCs nothing more.

The honest way of selling them would be calling them "Amiga PC i7" or "ARM Amiga Windows Tablet", but I guess "Commodore PC i7" is the better name.
 

Offline spirantho

Re: Amiga Case Designer Faces Intimidation
« Reply #416 on: May 10, 2012, 11:05:54 PM »
Quote from: startup-sequence.bat;692665
In which way?


Mostly under the hood. There's a heck of a lot of work gone into bringing stability and compatibility to all the NG OSes. To a user, OS 4 probably seems much like OS 3 with bells and whistles, but to a coder they're leagues away from OS 3. This allows much faster porting and creation of programs which would not have been possible.
Then there's the ability to use hardware which we take for granted these days - USB 2, PCI Express, SATA, Gigabit ethernet, Gigabytes of RAM, Terabytes of hard disk space. All this has to be coded into the OS.

Quote

They are unique, but what are their unique selling point? From a hardware point of view, why do I want one of those instead of commodity hardware?


Because they're different.
Why does anyone want something that's different? It depends on the individual entirely.
For myself, I love my Sam 440ep because it's so fast, responsive and co-operative. It's a wonderful machine to code on.
I love my A1 G4 because it has more power and is fast enough to do most things, but it's still fun.
I love my OS4 A4000 because it's the best of the Classic Amigas. It's 18 years old and can still run a modern browser. It's got character.

Quote

How is that different from a linux? Actually, linux being open source I would think the user would be in charge on a level unparalleled by any closed source os.


It's different because Linux was never meant to be a desktop OS. There are more streamlined distros out there, but even so I've yet to see one that comes close to AmigaOS.
As a coder, I can do things quickly and easily that I just can't do with Linux. Linux is still mired in static library hell and incompatibilities and an obscure directory structure; AmigaOS is simple. It's pure. It's fun.

I use Linux a lot - the Asus EEE PC I'm typing this on is running Linux - but I never code for it because it's horrible to code for. AmigaOS is a joy to code for.

Quote

But is it worth to bother taking the most out of hardware which is orders of magnitude less powerful than commodity hardware anyway?


Yes, most definitely. If we didn't, we'd all be using the same bog standard PC motherboard. A PC is just a PC, it's a bunch of chips shoved onto a motherboard in China that runs an OS.

An Amiga - be it an A4000, an AmigaOne X1000, a Sam, a Pegasos II, whatever - has character. You can customise it, tweak it, develop it, enhance it, whatever you want, but most of all you can enjoy it.

That is why a Linux PC will never replace my Amigas. I have used both; I do not enjoy Linux. I do enjoy AmigaOS.
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Offline startup-sequence.bat

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Re: Amiga Case Designer Faces Intimidation
« Reply #417 on: May 10, 2012, 11:09:13 PM »
Quote from: lsmart;692667
The original Amiga HW has a superior design compared to the NG Amigas, but suffer from their slow clock speeds and cacheless architecture.

So is it a question of how "clever" an architecture is versus how much "muscle" it has? In that case, would you say that the original amiga hardware had a superior design to modern PCs (in terms of "cleverness", setting aside the obvious gap in frequency, transistor counts, cache amount etc.)? And if so, in which way?
 

Offline commodorejohn

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Re: Amiga Case Designer Faces Intimidation
« Reply #418 on: May 10, 2012, 11:18:37 PM »
Quote from: startup-sequence.bat;692670
So is it a question of how "clever" an architecture is versus how much "muscle" it has? In that case, would you say that the original amiga hardware had a superior design to modern PCs (in terms of "cleverness", setting aside the obvious gap in frequency, transistor counts, cache amount etc.)? And if so, in which way?
Well, for starters, it's not a nigh-endless succession of one kluge on top of another to address design flaws stemming from IBM's sudden rush to get in on the personal-computer market.
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Offline darkage

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Re: Amiga Case Designer Faces Intimidation
« Reply #419 on: May 11, 2012, 12:50:07 AM »
I dont know how this thread started off as a battle between CUSA and a case designer, then Moochie got the limelight and now we are arguing what makes an Amiga a true Amiga..  Whao!  only in Amiga land :)

I wonder what Moochie would think of all this commotion :-/