X1000 - what do you think of this

[jorkany]

Just wondering what people think about this:

http://forum.hyperion-entertainment.biz/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=908#p11316

I would'nt recommond installing a second gfx card, as there are no spare slots.
You would have to loose either sound or network.

Besides, would rather the systems are not messed with. As this could cause damage or other problems.
The system is sent as a complete system.

I guess since none of the onboard hardware is supported there has to be a card for everything. Kind of weird for a system that comes in a huge case with 8 drives bays, but there it is. Also, no tinkering - I thought part of the "Amiga spirit" was tinkering, but then again this is an AmigaOne. I dunno, for $3K just doesn't seem like that great a deal.

[Iggy]

VERY weird.
However, I doubt OS4 supports dual graphic cards.
In fact, I'd be surprised if it even supported dual monitors on one HD4650.

Hopefully, in the future, onboard hardware drivers will eliminate the need to use so many cards.

>I thought part of the "Amiga spirit" was tinkering

tinkering? Hell, I like to completely tear things apart and rebuild them however I want!

[spirantho]

Given the amount of people who are constantly waiting for Hyperion to do anything wrong so they can kick up a fuss, can you blame them for covering themselves like this?

Just about any computer company would say the same thing - "please don't fiddle with our systems, but if you do you're on your own".

I think they didn't say anything unusual for a company.

[Kronos]

VERY weird.
However, I doubt OS4 supports dual graphic cards.
In fact, I'd be surprised if it even supported dual monitors on one HD4650.

Both P96 (OS4) and CGX (MorphOS) support mutible (different) GFX-cards well since Zorro-time. None supports spanning (1 screen over 2 monitors) or the 2nd VGA/DVI of any GFX-card.

Another issue is OpenFirmware/UBoot/whatever as those will normally only init 1 card while the P96/CGX drivers for the PCI/AGP-cards might expect them to be initialized.

Successfully tested and an AGP-Radeon9000 + Voodoo3-PCI (normal PC version, but doesn't matter as CGX will take that card "raw") in my QuickSilver under MorphOS2.7.

Similar options should exist for OS4.

[Rob]

@Jorkany

First Contact wasn't supposed to be complete in terms devices being supported by OS4.  It was done to get boards out to people keen to get systems out to people who were prepared to accept that not everything would be working straight away.

This isn't something that was hidden from the customer so why make such a fuss, especially when you aren't a customer.

VERY weird.
However, I doubt OS4 supports dual graphic cards.
In fact, I'd be surprised if it even supported dual monitors on one HD4650.

Hopefully, in the future, onboard hardware drivers will eliminate the need to use so many cards.

>I thought part of the "Amiga spirit" was tinkering

tinkering? Hell, I like to completely tear things apart and rebuild them however I want!

OS4 supports multiple video cards.  I have a Radeon 9250 and an X1550 in my XE and there is no problem with running different apps on both cards at the same time.  You can do same with a classic Amiga under OS3.  A card with dual outputs can only currently display the same image

Chris is advising caution because he doesn't want inexperienced users causing warranty issues.  Most competent users will just change what they like anyway.  Changing the heatsink and fan will void the warranty but I think anything else is just advice.

[Iggy]

Both P96 (OS4) and CGX (MorphOS) support mutible (different) GFX-cards well since Zorro-time. None supports spanning (1 screen over 2 monitors) or the 2nd VGA/DVI of any GFX-card.

Another issue is OpenFirmware/UBoot/whatever as those will normally only init 1 card while the P96/CGX drivers for the PCI/AGP-cards might expect them to be initialized.

Successfully tested and an AGP-Radeon9000 + Voodoo3-PCI (normal PC version, but doesn't matter as CGX will take that card "raw") in my QuickSilver under MorphOS2.7.

Similar options should exist for OS4.

Thanks Kronos,
I may just have to try that tonight on my Powermac. I've got a Voodoo3 2000 PCI card sitting around (I use it in my PC to re-flash PC video cards with Mac compatible bios').

So, if it physically works, OS4 should support it (and it hardly surprises me that MorphOS does).

But why doesn't the second port of a graphics card work?
Under other OS' it just requires a second driver.

Edit - Hey Kronos,
Has anyone gotten a Voodoo 4500 PCI card to work with another display card under MorphOS?

[KimmoK]

I guess since none of the onboard hardware is supported there has to be a card for everything.

That's why it's called BETATESTER/EarlyBird/FirstEncounters version. Onboard components does not yet have full support.

[wawrzon]

seems each x1k will have to be sent to tha manufacturer to remove the obsolete pci cards as soon as onboard components are supported. i wonder if that is covered by service/warranty?

[Hans_]

VERY weird.
However, I doubt OS4 supports dual graphic cards.
In fact, I'd be surprised if it even supported dual monitors on one HD4650.

Hopefully, in the future, onboard hardware drivers will eliminate the need to use so many cards.

Dual graphics cards do work. I used dual graphics cards to do the initial graphics driver development. The old Radeon card was used for coding, and the Radeon X1000/Radeon HD card was used for testing new builds. That stopped when the RadeonHD driver reached the point at which it was usable.

>I thought part of the "Amiga spirit" was tinkering

tinkering? Hell, I like to completely tear things apart and rebuild them however I want!

... and when has "please don't mess with the hardware" ever stopped people from doing just that? In fact, "you will void the warranty" doesn't really stop people either, does it?

Hans

[Hans_]

But why doesn't the second port of a graphics card work?
Under other OS' it just requires a second driver.

The Radeon HD driver will quite happily output the same screen on all connected outputs. However, Picasso96 (and Cybergraphics too) isn't designed to support multiple outputs. In theory you could create a second (fake) driver in order to support it, but you would probably also have to partition the VRAM into two separate sections, one for each driver. Actually, Bernie Meyer (of Amithlon fame) did demonstrate having 5 monitors connected to one machine via two cards. He never did explain how he got the driver to do it. I have no plans to try something similar with the Radeon HD driver.

Hans

[Hans_]

Another issue is OpenFirmware/UBoot/whatever as those will normally only init 1 card while the P96/CGX drivers for the PCI/AGP-cards might expect them to be initialized.

UBoot and CFE (OpenFirmware used on the A1-X1000) initialise all cards, including extra graphics cards. Sure, it will only actually use one graphics card, but they are all initialised and ready for the OS drivers.

Hans

[vox]

Just wondering what people think about this:

http://forum.hyperion-entertainment.biz/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=908#p11316


I guess since none of the onboard hardware is supported there has to be a card for everything. Kind of weird for a system that comes in a huge case with 8 drives bays, but there it is. Also, no tinkering - I thought part of the "Amiga spirit" was tinkering, but then again this is an AmigaOne. I dunno, for $3K just doesn't seem like that great a deal.

You are overreacting. Having X1000 presale (First Encouters) with OS 4.1.5 has to have some glitches like RadeonHD driver with no 3D (same is with SAM 460 owners). On SAM 460 also PCI slots are valuable and on X1000 First Encouters, yes they are populated.

X1000 final edition in software terms - one to be shipped with OS 4.2 will solve both problems by bringing 3D RadeonHD driver (9250 is snail to any HD Radeon) and drivers for onboard sound and SATA2

[vox]

Given the amount of people who are constantly waiting for Hyperion to do anything wrong so they can kick up a fuss, can you blame them for covering themselves like this?

Just about any computer company would say the same thing - "please don't fiddle with our systems, but if you do you're on your own".

I think they didn't say anything unusual for a company.

Don`t see why so much controversy. If owner is willing to open the case (and loose the guaranty like everywhere), remove Radeon HD and one PCI card and put Radeon 9250 it will work. But he has been properly warned.

[wawrzon]

@vox: (re)configuring your hardware means a loss of warranty? must have been lucky since ive ever been able to return unsatisfactory components..

[Piru]

If owner is willing to open the case (and loose the guaranty like everywhere)

I've never heard of opening the computer case to terminate a warranty. In fact, even swapping the cards don't terminate it. All these operations are regular maintenance and expected events in the lifetime of a computer. Of course if you botch up and break something, fixing that won't be under warranty.