FPGA for dummies

[bloodline]

thread:
So lets build a x86pc core for the Replay, then run UAE on it. What's that... simulation or emulation. ;-)

You know, I rather think that's a fun idea

[JimS]

You know, I rather think that's a fun idea

Reminds me of back when I worked in an Amiga store and showed off by running AmigaDOS, Mac 68k, and msDOS simultaneously.

[zipper]

Done it - but couldn't get a screen grabber to work ...

[ferrellsl]

thread:
So lets build a x86pc core for the Replay, then run UAE on it. What's that... simulation or emulation. ;-)

That's a waste of time and money.  It defeats the entire purpose of the Replay board which is to inexpensively recreate in hardware the classic Amigas that are so hard to come by anymore these days.

[freqmax]

The same could be said about x86-pc with VGA boards and the demos coded in assembler for them. It's just to load a different bitfile into the FPGA so it doesn't lessen the original objective.

[mongo]

That's a waste of time and money.  It defeats the entire purpose of the Replay board which is to inexpensively recreate in hardware the classic Amigas that are so hard to come by anymore these days.

That is not the entire purpose of the Replay board.

[ferrellsl]

That is not the entire purpose of the Replay board.

As far as classic Amigas are concerned, it is.  

And I'm well aware of the other systems that the Replay board is designed to replace, such as Ataris and various arcade boards thank you very much.

[JimS]

That's a waste of time and money.  It defeats the entire purpose of the Replay board which is to inexpensively recreate in hardware the classic Amigas that are so hard to come by anymore these days.

Didya miss the smiley at the end of that comment? I was mocking the more pedantic folk in this thread... What do do when faced with a synthesized PC running an emulated computer.  OK, maybe not the funniest gag... but that's my emulated sense of humor. :-)

[ferrellsl]

Didya miss the smiley at the end of that comment? I was mocking the more pedantic folk in this thread... What do do when faced with a synthesized PC running an emulated computer.  OK, maybe not the funniest gag... but that's my emulated sense of humor. :-)

Sorry.  Missed your smiley earlier.  Humor noted :-)

I do want to add that I'm very impressed with billt's patience here.  He's almost written a dissertation on FPGAs here.  Very unimpressed by those who insist on arguing with him.

[psxphill]

FPGA programming can't be compared to CPU programming at all.

It can be as VHDL is just one of many functional programming languages that are designed for parallel processing. There are many other very similar languages used on PC's.
 
Whether your program is converted to X86, ARM, 68000 or FPGA is irrlevant to the process of writing the program.

[bloodline]

It can be as VHDL is just one of many functional programming languages that are designed for parallel processing. There are many other very similar languages used on PC's.
 
Whether your program is converted to X86, ARM, 68000 or FPGA is irrlevant to the process of writing the program.

I think you are getting confused, hardware description languages are not programming languages, despite their similar appearance... Both myself and Karlos had a look at one a few years back and struggled to follow what was going on... Very different conceptually!

-edit- I should add that both myself and Karlos are quite experienced with a number of programming languages, but neither of us have done any FPGA work (though I do a lot of electronics hobby work).

[psxphill]

I think you are getting confused, hardware description languages are not programming languages, despite their similar appearance... Both myself and Karlos had a look at one a few years back and struggled to follow what was going on... Very different conceptually!
 
-edit- I should add that both myself and Karlos are quite experienced with a number of programming languages, but neither of us have done any FPGA work (though I do a lot of electronics hobby work).

VHDL is not C, but I didn't say it was. VHDL is a concurrent programming language, there are others that can be used to write applications for windows/linux etc. If you only have experience of sequential programming languages then I could see why you would struggle to follow VHDL but you'll struggle with other concurrent programming languages too.
 
Pick one out of this list and see how you get on.
 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Concurrent_computing#Concurrent_programming_languages
 
(notice that VHDL is on the list).

[billt]

As far as classic Amigas are concerned, it is.  

As far as the guy who designed it, Id be surprised if Mikej comes over and tells us that, ues, his primary intention for doing the board was so he could make a Classic Amiga, and that anything else people use it for is just bonus. I'm sure he's happy that so many of us Amigans are excited about his product, but I can't imagine this was the purpose for making it.

[billt]

There's a post at aw.net about reconfiguring the FPGA on the SAM boards.

It takes around 13-17 secs to reprogram the FPGA on a Sam440ep.

http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=34723&start=0&post_id=641977&order=0&viewmode=flat&pid=641594&forum=33#641902

I'd mentioned that reconfiguration is a significant event. You don't want to do it very often, as can be seen above. I'm sure other system designs can do it faster than that, but it's always going to be a significant "context switch" to swap out your hardware with something different. Even if only a partial reconfig.

[ferrellsl]

As far as the guy who designed it, Id be surprised if Mikej comes over and tells us that, ues, his primary intention for doing the board was so he could make a Classic Amiga, and that anything else people use it for is just bonus. I'm sure he's happy that so many of us Amigans are excited about his product, but I can't imagine this was the purpose for making it.

I meant to say that FPGAs in general are "it" as far as recreating classic Amigas are concerned.  It isn't like anyone will start manufacturing classic systems or parts for them again.  So FPGA based systems such as the Minimig, Replay and Natami are the only alternatives out there for people who can't get their hands on classic systems.

I know that Mike's Replay board didn't originally start out as a classic Amiga recreation project, but that's the beauty of FPGAs.  They're versatile enough to recreate just about any system that you can define in VHDL.

[JimS]

I do want to add that I'm very impressed with billt's patience here.  He's almost written a dissertation on FPGAs here.  Very unimpressed by those who insist on arguing with him.

Same here... I've been wanting to get one of the dev boards out there and learn some VHDL. So listening to people with actual real-world experience with the tech is helpful.