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Offline vidarh

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Re: Amiga workbench
« Reply #14 on: May 02, 2011, 04:53:31 PM »
Quote from: Darrin;634777

When I think back to early days of the Amiga, most software on floppies actually contained Workbench (or at least a cut-down version of it)


Workbench was/is in kickstart. The only thing that's absolutely needed to start Workbench from a floppy is C:loadwb + a very basic startup sequence to call it.
 

Offline lsmart

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Re: Amiga workbench
« Reply #15 on: May 02, 2011, 08:35:45 PM »
Quote from: commodorejohn;634878
Yeah, basically. The hell with the Amiga legal shenanigans, I'll just pirate.

So this is it? Amiga.org has become a forum for thiefs and naysayers?
 

Offline paul1981

Re: Amiga workbench
« Reply #16 on: May 02, 2011, 08:39:03 PM »
This actually takes me back to the 90's and I'm thinking of CUCD's and AFCD's (Amiga Format & CU Amiga).  They were bootable and contained Workbench in its entirety from what I can remember.  From memory, you could create a whole Workbech 3.1 system if you wanted to...and that's one way I upgraded my Workbench files - I just copied later versions of libraries and other system files from CU Cd's over to my 3.0 system to upgrade it.  I'm sure I wasn't alone in doing that.
I wonder if those magazines had to foot the bill to do this?  After all, CBM was history and it was Escom, then GW2000.  If it was only $100 per year back in 1992, I think that would make it $200 x 12 months probably for a new release each month back in mid-late 90's of the cover cd's.  Still peanuts though for what it is, I mean they gave away Workbench3.1 every month!
It would be interesting to know what indeed those magazines had to pay for the license.  If anything, because if you think about it - there was never a need to have a bootable cd, let alone including Workbench3.1...
Yes, there were CD32 owners, but serious users would have bought a computer with a keyboard if they wanted to use utilities and the like from magazine cover cd's.
 

Offline commodorejohn

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Re: Amiga workbench
« Reply #17 on: May 02, 2011, 08:56:57 PM »
Quote from: lsmart;634931
So this is it? Amiga.org has become a forum for thiefs and naysayers?
Yeah, pretty much. It's not like the money would be going to the people who actually made OS3.1, anyway.
Computers: Amiga 1200, DEC VAXStation 4000/60, DEC MicroPDP-11/73
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Offline nicholas

Re: Amiga workbench
« Reply #18 on: May 02, 2011, 09:06:25 PM »
Quote from: lsmart;634931
So this is it? Amiga.org has become a forum for thiefs and naysayers?


What can you do about it?
“Een rezhim-i eshghalgar-i Quds bayad az sahneh-i ruzgar mahv shaved.” - Imam Ayatollah Sayyed  Ruhollah Khomeini
 

Offline Franko

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Re: Amiga workbench
« Reply #19 on: May 02, 2011, 09:12:44 PM »
Quote from: lsmart;634931
So this is it? Amiga.org has become a forum for thiefs and naysayers?


Well it is an Amiga site and by default nearly 25 years of thieves and naysayers (being the Amiga way of things) it hasn't "become" it always has been and it's only that you've just noticed it... :)
 

Offline Franko

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Re: Amiga workbench
« Reply #20 on: May 02, 2011, 09:16:33 PM »
Quote from: paul1981;634932
This actually takes me back to the 90's and I'm thinking of CUCD's and AFCD's (Amiga Format & CU Amiga).  They were bootable and contained Workbench in its entirety from what I can remember.  From memory, you could create a whole Workbech 3.1 system if you wanted to...and that's one way I upgraded my Workbench files - I just copied later versions of libraries and other system files from CU Cd's over to my 3.0 system to upgrade it.  I'm sure I wasn't alone in doing that.
I wonder if those magazines had to foot the bill to do this?


It states quite clearly on the old AF & CU CDs that the Workbench sets on them were only there under licence... :)
 

Offline whabang

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Re: Amiga workbench
« Reply #21 on: May 02, 2011, 09:20:38 PM »
Quote from: lsmart;634931
So this is it? Amiga.org has become a forum for thiefs and naysayers?


I find it funny how the Coffee house-section is filled with all kinds of controversial statements, and how people still get offended whenever they encounter someone who openly admits pirating software.

To get back on topic, yes, you can load Workbench straight off a floppy, using nothing but an AmigaDOS prompt as long as you're using 3.1 (can't remember how it was in the old days, but that's irrelevant) or higher. The problem is that you will lack quite a few basic utilities, but I assume that can be solved with third-party software.

It would be interesting to see how far one can get using nothing but open-source and freeware/PD. I might actually give it a try, just for the challenge. :)
Beating the dead horse since 2002.
 

Offline DarrinTopic starter

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Re: Amiga workbench
« Reply #22 on: May 02, 2011, 11:25:00 PM »
Quote from: paul1981;634932
This actually takes me back to the 90's and I'm thinking of CUCD's and AFCD's (Amiga Format & CU Amiga).  They were bootable and contained Workbench in its entirety from what I can remember.  From memory, you could create a whole Workbech 3.1 system if you wanted to...and that's one way I upgraded my Workbench files - I just copied later versions of libraries and other system files from CU Cd's over to my 3.0 system to upgrade it.  I'm sure I wasn't alone in doing that.
I wonder if those magazines had to foot the bill to do this?  After all, CBM was history and it was Escom, then GW2000.  If it was only $100 per year back in 1992, I think that would make it $200 x 12 months probably for a new release each month back in mid-late 90's of the cover cd's.  Still peanuts though for what it is, I mean they gave away Workbench3.1 every month!
It would be interesting to know what indeed those magazines had to pay for the license.  If anything, because if you think about it - there was never a need to have a bootable cd, let alone including Workbench3.1...
Yes, there were CD32 owners, but serious users would have bought a computer with a keyboard if they wanted to use utilities and the like from magazine cover cd's.


Damn, I forgot about those cover CDs.  You're quite right that effectively WB3.1 was being handed out every month at the newsagent to anyone who bought a cheap computer magazine.  You didn't even need to own an Amiga.

I'm pretty sure some magazines even included "Relokick" (I think that is what is was called) which means they were effectively giving away Kickstart 1.3 too.  :)
A2000, A3000, 2 x A1200T, A1200, A4000Tower & Mediator, CD32, VIC-20, C64, C128, C128D, PET 8032, Minimig & ARM, C-One, FPGA Arcade... and AmigaOne X1000.
 

Offline Gulliver

Re: Amiga workbench
« Reply #23 on: May 03, 2011, 01:40:08 AM »
My 2 cents:

If you just take a peek at the last two or three Amiga Format coverdisk CD-Roms, you will find a fully legal set of Workbench 3.0 floppy images, authorized by uncle Petro for free distribution and use.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Quote from Amiga Format CD #51:  AFCD51/+System+/Tools/Workbench/Workbench 3.x/AF_Readme

Here are the DMS archives for the complete Workbench 3.0, in case you haven't
got an install disk, or you corrupt your originals. We can't put later versions
on because we'd need a licence to do so, but Petro Tyschtschenko has given us
permission to include this version of AmigaOS on all AFCDs from now on.

To extract the files, simply have a stack of six disks at the ready for
insertion into df0: (or whichever drive you've set up in AFCDPrefs) and then
double click on the DMS archive icons.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Files on Amiga Format CD #51:  AFCD51/+System+/Tools/Workbench/Workbench 3.x/

Install.dms
Workbench.dms
Locale.dms
Fonts.dms
Extras.dms
Storage.dms
OS3.1_BoingBag1.lzx
AF_Readme
« Last Edit: May 03, 2011, 02:13:55 AM by Gulliver »
 

Offline DarrinTopic starter

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Re: Amiga workbench
« Reply #24 on: May 03, 2011, 03:01:51 AM »
Quote from: Gulliver;635004
My 2 cents:

If you just take a peek at the last two or three Amiga Format coverdisk CD-Roms, you will find a fully legal set of Workbench 3.0 floppy images, authorized by uncle Petro for free distribution and use.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Quote from Amiga Format CD #51:  AFCD51/+System+/Tools/Workbench/Workbench 3.x/AF_Readme

Here are the DMS archives for the complete Workbench 3.0, in case you haven't
got an install disk, or you corrupt your originals. We can't put later versions
on because we'd need a licence to do so, but Petro Tyschtschenko has given us
permission to include this version of AmigaOS on all AFCDs from now on.

To extract the files, simply have a stack of six disks at the ready for
insertion into df0: (or whichever drive you've set up in AFCDPrefs) and then
double click on the DMS archive icons.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Files on Amiga Format CD #51:  AFCD51/+System+/Tools/Workbench/Workbench 3.x/

Install.dms
Workbench.dms
Locale.dms
Fonts.dms
Extras.dms
Storage.dms
OS3.1_BoingBag1.lzx
AF_Readme


Holy crap!  So Petro actually gave OS 3.0 to the Amiga community!  What a guy!
A2000, A3000, 2 x A1200T, A1200, A4000Tower & Mediator, CD32, VIC-20, C64, C128, C128D, PET 8032, Minimig & ARM, C-One, FPGA Arcade... and AmigaOne X1000.
 

Offline Franko

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Re: Amiga workbench
« Reply #25 on: May 03, 2011, 03:26:08 AM »
Quote from: Darrin;635010
Holy crap!  So Petro actually gave OS 3.0 to the Amiga community!  What a guy!


That's one of the reasons I don't get what the copyright mafia on this site rattle their gums about, they seem to conveniently forget about things like the old AF Coverdisk CDs where the stuff was released free into the wild many moons ago.. ;)

Methinks they just like a good moan even more than me... :)
 

Offline Bamiga2002

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Re: Amiga workbench
« Reply #26 on: May 03, 2011, 08:46:05 AM »
Quote from: Gulliver;635004
...OS3.1_BoingBag1.lzx...
Would that be a pack that updates WB3.0 to WB3.1 perhaps? That would mean there is a free WB 3.1 available *legally* ...
CD32
A500
 

Offline Gulliver

Re: Amiga workbench
« Reply #27 on: May 03, 2011, 09:03:07 AM »
Quote from: Bamiga2002;635033
Would that be a pack that updates WB3.0 to WB3.1 perhaps? That would mean there is a free WB 3.1 available *legally* ...

From what I remember, it was a wrongly named AmigaOS 3.5 BoingBag 1 archive
 

Offline gertsy

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Re: Amiga workbench
« Reply #28 on: May 03, 2011, 02:09:12 PM »
Workbench is free?  
Wow does that mean from now on I don't have to buy Workbench 3.1 online from the myriad of suppliers out there...

I own 4 Amiga computers with 3.1 Roms in them. I only have 2 copies of WB3.1 disks. I've been duded....

PS: Multiple programs and utilities used their own cutdown workbench disks, complete with OS Folders.  Maybe they had a license to do so.  Who knows.
 

Offline PanterHZ

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Re: Amiga workbench
« Reply #29 from previous page: May 05, 2011, 02:40:23 AM »
Quote from: Darrin;634777
I was just thinking to myself how silly it is that  people who create patched Workbench installs or even Emergency Install  disks cannot actually include the Workbench files and you have to run a  program to copy files from your own Workbench disks.

I seem to remember that one of the patched Workbench packages actually  did include all WB files at one point, but that the author had to remove  them after being told to do so.
But it is my impression that it's OK to include some WB files as long as  the main system files are not included, and this is the reason why  ClassicWB only requires the Workbench disk for example.

When creating my program Amiga911 Maker, I just simply decided to follow  the trend and do what others have done in the past regarding the  Workbench files. One might say that I went a step further since the  Extras & Install disks might be required for making a boot disk as  well, but this was my attempt to make the Amiga911 Maker distribution  somewhat Aminet friendly. But since the current version of my program  still includes some WB files (icons, keymaps, PAL & NTSC drivers and  the topaz font), it still meant that it couldn't be hosted on Aminet  (who are VERY strict when it comes to WB files in the uploads).

That being said, my program will look for Workbench3.0: or  Workbench3.1:, and if neither of them exists, the user will be  instructed to insert one of them. The thing is that this doesn't  necessarily have to be a Workbench floppy in DF0:, it can  actually be any drive with a volume bearing that name, and it can also  be an assign. As a matter of fact, in the process of creating A911  Maker, I had to do a lot of test copying from my WB disks to ensure  everything was working like it should. But to make things easier, I  simply copied all disks to my harddisk (by using drag & drop), and  created a small script with the following lines that I use for copy  testing:

Assign Workbench3.1: Work:WB3.1/Workbench3.1
Assign Extras3.1: Work:WB3.1/Extras3.1
Assign Install3.1: Work:WB3.1/Install3.1


For those who are using my program, there is even an easier way to do things that might work. Assuming your boot partition is called Workbench, just open a Shell and enter the following:

Assign Workbench3.1: Workbench:
 Assign Extras3.1: Workbench:
 Assign Install3.1: Workbench:

This way, you shouldn't have to insert any WB disks at all :)

(OK, I'll admit it, this last bit is probably a bit off-topic).