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Offline fishy_fizTopic starter

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3 days of hardcore amiga gaming lead me to think....
« on: February 25, 2011, 01:20:23 AM »
Pointless thread, but I felt the urge to share some thoughts with someone, and it made more sense to share them with other amiga people than anyone else  :)

As many of the regulars here will be aware, Ive recently gotten ahold of an a1200+'040 card again. Being that Ive only had it for a short while Ive been going through some of the old classic games again. While this has been a kind of fun, once the nostalgia receeds I find myself noticing that the majority of Amiga games havent aged well. This isnt just due to the age, I find myself still able to enjoy lots of games on machines just as old, or even older, but rather the Amiga simply got itself a lot of substandard software. There are plenty of exceptions, and I think no less of the Amiga for it (Im having a blast still), but I'd somehow not noticed just how average a lot of Amiga games are, even games that were big names back in the day. What I find disappointing though is the almost complete lack of good games that take advantage of expanded Amigas. There are some that take advantage of an expanded amiga, but so very few that are any good. The following are a few games that Ive been trying out of late.

Alien Breed 3d 1 and 2 I enjoyed, although not as good as I remembered.
Breathless is the most over rated piece of crap ever. Technically competant, but boring as mud. No imagination in levels, boring enemies, no sense of "being there", no atmosphere, boring weapons, bland textures. (I really dont like this one incase you couldnt tell :))
Flyin' High. Nice to have a 3d texture mapped racer for the amiga, and it looks ok and is technically ok, but plays badly.
Frontier. I wouldnt play it on anything less than '020 + fast mem, but a great game.
Payback. Very well done GTA clone. Not exactly my kettle of fish, but a good game nonetheless. Unfortunately not really a great experience on an aga machine unless using an '060, and even then only in lowest possible resolution/detail.
Gloom. Very simple game, but does what it sets out to do pretty well.
Virtual Karting. I really enjoyed this back in the day, but after trying to get back into it I find myself unsure what the attraction was all those years ago. Runs well, but is quite bland. I found myself mostly playing in overhead mode due to the weird perspectives for first person views.
StreetFighter2 (US Gold). Very quick using an '040 (even a stock a1200 its kinda nippy compared to a500), but plays like mud. I actually prefer it on a 68000 cpu, although it's far from great at the best of times.
SuperStreetFighter2 Turbo. Looks very nice, has all the parallax, etc. but has frames blatantly missing, which completely spoils the game.
Zool2AGA. Not quite as good as the ms dos version, but for my tastes a bloody good Amiga platformer.
Vroom. I'd never played it before, but I quite like it. Very (perhaps too?) fast.
Legends Of Valour. Smallish window, but runs great and I really like it. Not even sure why I like it, I just do  :)
Z-Out. One of the most under rated shooters on the amiga. If you like Rtype you really should check it out. Very much a clone, but very well done. Slick, fast, and with nice graphics. My only "problem" with it is that it's not until a few level later that it really shows its technical prowess (nice multi level parallax, etc.).
Birds Of Prey. No idea why I used to think this is good (maybe the intro?). Horrible game.


Reading this back I must admit the crap to good ratio isnt as bad as it felt while having the big gaming sessions I had over the last few days. That said though, there's very few games that really drew me back to them after a few hours of play. I think part of my disappointment was with the fact that the vast majority of games were games that could be played on an a500 with a floppy drive. Sure, an '040 is far from cuting edge these days, but it wouldve been nice to have a few good games that are more of a match for an a1200 + faster cpu + extra ram. PC people had a better gaming experience for the most part with equivalent machines (486 era).
Near as I can tell this is where I write something under the guise of being innocuous, but really its a pot shot at another persons/peoples choice of Amiga based systems. Unfortunately only I cant see how transparent and petty it makes me look.
 

Offline TheBilgeRat

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Re: 3 days of hardcore amiga gaming lead me to think....
« Reply #1 on: February 25, 2011, 01:36:41 AM »
I'm experiencing the same thing as of late as well.  I think I'm going to hit the RPGs and click adventures pretty hard.  And as for my absolute favorite AGA game?  WormsDC.  I play the crap out of that game every day.  Always surprising and always fun.  I also plan on trying Total Chaos, but haven't yet.
 

Offline smerf

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Re: 3 days of hardcore amiga gaming lead me to think....
« Reply #2 on: February 25, 2011, 01:57:58 AM »
Hi,

I really like Megaball, Soliton and Crazy8's. I also liked Adoom, and Dungeon Master, It came from the desert, Monkey Island, and Rolling Thunder.

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Offline runequester

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Re: 3 days of hardcore amiga gaming lead me to think....
« Reply #3 on: February 25, 2011, 02:03:44 AM »
The amiga had many crap games but there's classics that stand out to this day :)

The ones I find myself playing over and over:

Gloom, Alien breed (all of them), chaos engine, super cars 2, worms DC, Battle isle, historyline, Dune, Turrican  (2 and 3 mainly), Warlords (certainly not up to amiga spec, but a damn fine strategy game), UFO (xcom to you yanks), Lemmings 2, Settlers and a bunch others.

For long term enjoyment, RPG's, adventure games and strategy for the win.

god damn.. can't write one of these lists without hitting submit, and forgetting something. HIRED GUNS!
« Last Edit: February 25, 2011, 02:06:08 AM by runequester »
 

Offline Franko

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Re: 3 days of hardcore amiga gaming lead me to think....
« Reply #4 on: February 25, 2011, 02:08:57 AM »
Never been a big fan of Shoot'em'Ups but when it comes to Deluxe Galaga AGA I can play this brilliant wee game for hours on end... :)

(and best of all its PD... :))
 

Offline desiv

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Re: 3 days of hardcore amiga gaming lead me to think....
« Reply #5 on: February 25, 2011, 02:28:09 AM »
One thing I noticed.
It looks like 8 of your 15 games are 3D games of some type or another.

Those are specifically the type of games the Amiga has the most problems with....

I've been playing mostly shooters and side scrollers (which I'm really bad at) and find I think a lot of them hold up really well...

And to agree with smerf (OMG), MegaBall was one of the first I loaded when I got my Amiga again.  Still my favorite of that type of game..  ;-)

desiv
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Offline coldfish

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Re: 3 days of hardcore amiga gaming lead me to think....
« Reply #6 on: February 25, 2011, 02:34:35 AM »
Went through a similar process a few years back.  

I found there was no huge value having a beefed up Amiga (030+) for games and games were my main interest.  I'd say the HD was the best upgrade, then RAM, AGA and faster CPU not so much, 68882 FPU was a waste of money for me.

Demos are another venue for tooling around with a beefed up Amiga but tend to look a bit quaint out of context.
 

Offline commodorejohn

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Re: 3 days of hardcore amiga gaming lead me to think....
« Reply #7 on: February 25, 2011, 02:49:50 AM »
Quote from: fishy_fiz;617824
I think part of my disappointment was with the fact that the vast majority of games were games that could be played on an a500 with a floppy drive. Sure, an '040 is far from cuting edge these days, but it wouldve been nice to have a few good games that are more of a match for an a1200 + faster cpu + extra ram. PC people had a better gaming experience for the most part with equivalent machines (486 era).
Doubtless this is because so few people back in the day had significantly upgraded machines - the baseline pretty much stayed at "1MB A500" for most of the Amiga's life and "2MB A1200" after. PC users, on the other hand, kept the baseline constantly increasing, so it was reasonable for developers to target newer hardware specifically. Convenient for gamers who didn't want to upgrade their systems just to play new games, but it does kind of suck in retrospect. There's a fair bit of AGA 020+ homebrew stuff on Aminet, though.
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Offline runequester

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Re: 3 days of hardcore amiga gaming lead me to think....
« Reply #8 on: February 25, 2011, 04:08:39 AM »
Theres a decent handful of titles that either benefit from more oomph (dune 2 and frontier:elite 2 spring to mind) or that had provisions for nicer stuff if your machine supported it.

In the latter case, that generally means 2 megs of RAM versus 1 though :) (Walker and Hired Guns f.x.)

I remember an article in amiga format bemoaning the fact that even an 030 would make far more impressive amiga games possible, but there just wasn't a market I suppose.
 

Offline XDelusion

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Re: 3 days of hardcore amiga gaming lead me to think....
« Reply #9 on: February 25, 2011, 05:01:32 AM »
I was always partial to Alien Bash 2.
Earth has a lot of things other folks might want... like the whole planet. And maybe these folks would like a few changes made, like more carbon dioxide in the atmosphere and room for their way of life. - William S. Burroughs
 

Offline Tension

Re: 3 days of hardcore amiga gaming lead me to think....
« Reply #10 on: February 25, 2011, 12:23:23 PM »
I'd love to play Doodlebug again for one last time  :(

Offline fishy_fizTopic starter

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Re: 3 days of hardcore amiga gaming lead me to think....
« Reply #11 on: February 28, 2011, 08:34:05 AM »
Quote from: desiv;617839
One thing I noticed.
It looks like 8 of your 15 games are 3D games of some type or another.

Those are specifically the type of games the Amiga has the most problems with....

I've been playing mostly shooters and side scrollers (which I'm really bad at) and find I think a lot of them hold up really well...

And to agree with smerf (OMG), MegaBall was one of the first I loaded when I got my Amiga again.  Still my favorite of that type of game..  ;-)

desiv


Sure, a lot of them are 3d games, but as I mentioned I was looking for stuff to take advantage of an expanded amiga, and despite typically being a bit of a mismatch (amiga and 3d) it still is something that will take advantage of faster hardware (hence the reason I was trying a bunch of 3d stuff). It's a shame there's so few 2d games on the amiga that are written with an expanded AGA system in mind, or even polygonal games with high polygon counts (an updated frontier, virtua racing style racer, virtua fighters style beat 'em up, etc.), or even smething like Team17's World Rally Fever (great powerdrift style game, shame it never made it to the amiga). Besides Feeble Files and Nightlong there's not even really any point 'n click adventures that utilise an upgraded amiga (heck, very few even require AGA).
All this said though Im happy to have the '040 and will upgrade it to an '060 sooner rather than later (lots of good apps that take advantage of them). It's just a shame that the few remaining games developers that were around still around by the time most people where running upgraded systems tended to focus on trying to make Doom style games. The fat lady is yet to sing on the amiga yet though, so maybe one day still, even if I have to make them myself  :)
Near as I can tell this is where I write something under the guise of being innocuous, but really its a pot shot at another persons/peoples choice of Amiga based systems. Unfortunately only I cant see how transparent and petty it makes me look.
 

Offline Dandy

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Re: 3 days of hardcore amiga gaming lead me to think....
« Reply #12 on: February 28, 2011, 10:05:21 AM »
Quote from: fishy_fiz;617824


...
Sure, an '040 is far from cuting edge these days, but it wouldve been nice to have a few good games that are more of a match for an a1200 + faster cpu + extra ram.
...



Have you tried Wipeout 2097 on an PPC equipped classic Amiga?
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Offline fishy_fizTopic starter

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Re: 3 days of hardcore amiga gaming lead me to think....
« Reply #13 on: February 28, 2011, 10:46:10 AM »
Yeah, I used to have a bppc + grex + voodoo3 and it's not a bad version (although in my opinion it's inferior to both psx and pc versions). That said though Im more into 68k stuff these days. Pretty much anything that utilises ppc can be found elsewhere, and usually in better forms. Still nice to have for the Amiga, but Im more interested in Amiga specific games (at least when it comes to this thread).
Near as I can tell this is where I write something under the guise of being innocuous, but really its a pot shot at another persons/peoples choice of Amiga based systems. Unfortunately only I cant see how transparent and petty it makes me look.
 

Offline Amiga_Nut

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Re: 3 days of hardcore amiga gaming lead me to think....
« Reply #14 on: February 28, 2011, 11:06:56 AM »
This was always the issue with the Amiga and CPU upgrades due to the whole Amiga custom chips.

Crap scrolling and slow fighters on Street Fighter 2 on MS DOS playing on your 386? Get a 486DX and everything magically improves to arcade levels of quality. On Amiga you can load up US Gold's SF2 conversion on an 060 you spent £750 on and it will still be mildly better than a £299 ST.

I also started a thread about a year ago about why the hell was Amiga basically given such bad coin-op conversions. The Amiga is capable of something close to Sonic if you look at Kid Chaos, ditto Outrun and Lotus II, Shadow Fighters and SF2 etc etc.

It is quite sad looking back just how bad many conversions were and the best software was mostly original arcade games not arcade conversions. Luckily there were 1000s of games and there are plenty that will make your jaw drop.

Add to that there were plenty of more intellectual games like the Magnetic Scrolls adventures which were just pure class and superior to the PC versions :) If it was out on OCS/ECS then PC version would be EGA = PANTS! :roflmao: