My evening with Commodore USA, LLC

[dammy]

But he could have been if they had a sane business model that didn't involve shafting those who had been keeping the Amiga name alive through the dark years.

How is he shafting "The Name"?  He's spending millions on the first TV advertising for the C64x, something I don't think C= did for an entire year worth of advertising budget.  So far he's shown off some possible cases for the Amiga series, is that enough for you to damn him and his company for showing off possible cases?  I don't get it, perhaps I shouldn't want to.

[Darrin]

Again, how are they shafting ANYONE? right from the beginning they said they wanted to work with the powers that be, they even considered AROS as an OS. They didnt consider OS4 because there is no way to do that and stay in business.

I have come to the conclusion that you are a C-USA "sock puppet" and you're only here to continually repeat their party line.

I'm done with you.

You know they're scum and their business model sucks.  You fail to address my alternative business plan, because this isn't about business plans.  It probably has more to McEwan sticking it to Hyperion which either means he has his fingers in C-USA or sgafting Hyperiod was part of the deal.

[KThunder]

No, I'm perfectly sane.  I admit my choice of words is a little colourful, but they're not off the mark.

Red is a longterm, respected member of amiga.org, he went, he saw, he reported, they arent up to anything sinister, Barry Altman is a long time Commodore fan, and successful business man, who wants to do more than just a case mod for himself.

Your comments, are off the mark.

[AmigaNG]

Not sure why all the hoo har?
The guy is building novelty PCs with a retro name that he has licensed. One of them a pretty neat looking c64.
My view is there's room in the world for this type of kit. it's a positive effort.
As was Red's. WD Red.
As long as there is clarity as to what these machines do, and are, and what they arent.

I agree, and if they had handled them self much better in the community from the start then I would have no problem with what they are trying to do and understand the market they are targeting are people with fond memories of the device, not the people that still use them. The problem I have is there lack of any recpect to the current community, or to the brand and what it has become before they even entered the market. How quickly some of you forgotten he threaten this very Site because it uses Amiga.org. with worlds like "who gave you the right to use that!" and "your just going to have to deal with it" when asked if Workbench 5 is not going to cause more issues or conflict with OS4. I personally hope Hyperion names their next version AmigaOS 6.0 if they want to play that game.

Its very sad, maybe they can turn it around, but I still feel they have a lot to learn about the market they are entering (example marketing your OS is going to be called Workebench when there is legal case going on about who actually owns that trademark) and I do feel if any one in the Amiga community really want what they are offering then get your modding hats on and just get one with it, you don't have to wait, the full details of how to do a C64 mod is online (somewhere) install Aros, linux, Windows, Amiga forever you got a pretty neat system. Just like I'm hooping to do with my MCC machine  

[Darrin]

How is he shafting "The Name"?  He's spending millions on the first TV advertising for the C64x, something I don't think C= did for an entire year worth of advertising budget.  So far he's shown off some possible cases for the Amiga series, is that enough for you to damn him and his company for showing off possible cases?  I don't get it, perhaps I shouldn't want to.

Ah, "Sock puppet #2".

I've explained it and so have several others.

[commodorejohn]

You are a waster and this nonsense is disgusting. Trashng a company that is legally starting a retro based company.

If they were just promoting themselves as a "retro-based company," that wouldn't be a problem, but they're not - they're promoting themselves as Commodore and touting an Amiga product line. Their whole site is based around this assumed identity. I don't want to jump to the conclusion that they're trying to mislead people, but it's difficult, considering how much their site tries to position them as The New Commodore. The only thing that could even be considered Commodore-related about this whole affair, aside from the C-64x's reproduction case, is the inclusion of emulators, which aren't even theirs. It's like some people here are so desperate for anything that has the "Amiga" name on it that they'll willfully blind themselves to the fact that there is no significant difference between this and any other PC that's had an emulator installed on it.

While I don't agree with Darrin's "evil" rhetoric, I think he's onto something with the idea of differentiated product lines providing some actual support for those of us in the community who see the Amiga brand as something more than just a sticker to be slapped onto whatever's selling well. Instead, C-USA seems to be completely in the dark about this, and its supporters actively hostile to anybody with a different view.

[dammy]

It probably has more to McEwan sticking it to Hyperion which either means he has his fingers in C-USA or sgafting Hyperiod was part of the deal.

That's what this boils down to, Hyperion.  That's your real worry, not about legacy, it's about Hyperion...

[Darrin]

Red is a longterm, respected member of amiga.org, he went, he saw, he reported, they arent up to anything sinister, Barry Altman is a long time Commodore fan, and successful business man, who wants to do more than just a case mod for himself.

Your comments, are off the mark.

Red has is a born optimist and more interested in "Commodore" than "Amiga".

The attempts to recruit him are smart and reminds me of the actions of another company from several years ago.

[Darrin]

That's what this boils down to, Hyperion.  That's your real worry, not about legacy, it's about Hyperion...

No, "doing what is right" is what it boils down to.

"Ethics" is another.

Something you and C-USA fail to promote.

[Franko]

If you aren't a potential customer what are your opinions worth to them. Not much. If you continue expessing them like this? they will, because you will be an enemy.

Now you've really lost me an enemy to who

[EDanaII]

Nothing CUSA could possibly do would appeal to everyone. They are making stratigic choices, except possibly forgetting or not knowing how much of a cult we really are in.

Did you read the article I linked? Coke did all the right things, made all the correct choices, except for one thing: they ignored the "cult" that supported them.

When entering a new market, or in this case, being a new entry into the market, don't ignore your early adopters. It could make all the difference. And who are the early adopters in an Amiga branded market? Ummm... all you have to do is read here and get the majority of opinions. At least, you can get a good idea of who they aren't.

If it won't have an Amiga-like OS, then C=USA is making a fatal mistake. Better to call it the Commodore Colt or the Commodore PC10 than the Amiga.

If they don't, those prodigal Amigans they do bring back will end up wondering why their "Coke tastes funny."

[KThunder]

I have come to the conclusion that you are a C-USA "sock puppet" and you're only here to continually repeat their party line.

I'm done with you.

You know they're scum and their business model sucks.  You fail to address my alternative business plan, because this isn't about business plans.  It probably has more to McEwan sticking it to Hyperion which either means he has his fingers in C-USA or sgafting Hyperiod was part of the deal.

You THINK they are scum, you THINK the model suck, but what the heck do you know. Barry Altman has started several sucessful businesses. Red has reported he is not full of crap.

Your business model looks fine but who cares you aren't a entrepenuer with money to spend on CUSA, Barry is.

As for me being a sock puppet? I have been on Amiga.org for years, Ive never been banned, or even moderated (ahem, you yesterday) I have posted on many different amiga products and this is another. I think it has potential. I probably wont buy one because I am cheap like heck and build my own PCs. But if I were to buy a new computer, it very well might be a commodore.

[takemehomegrandma]

Legal or ethical?  Their ethics stink.

Then we have Hyperion, who was contracted by Amiga Inc to do 4 months of developing work (some carefully defined work tasks, as outlined by the Friedens themselves) for which they would get a specified sum of money.

The four months passed. *Years* passed. But Hyperion never delivered according to their contract. Instead they simply took the money, held the code hostage for years while hoping for Amiga Inc to die, constantly FUD'ing MorphOS in the meantime in order to sabotage its market (this one is a personal favorite of mine: "The failure of Amiga Inc and the MorphOS team to come to terms is in part due to the fact that Amiga wants to assert their ownership and intellectual property rights over the Amiga OS (for which they paid 4.5 M USD) whilst the MorphOS team happily continues to refute those claims", as it so beautifully pictures the hypocrisy of Hyperion and irony of the situation that came to follow).

Then they try to rob Amiga Inc of their IP, but luckily the resulting "settlement" (cough cough) didn't result in a transfer of ownership of the Amiga IP to this mediocre Linux game porting company, and I'm glad that their products won't be called "Amiga", but amigaos or amigaone. Because Hyperion's ethics stinks, and so does their code, and nobody gave them the right to proclaim "Amiga" to be the degraded mishmash of poor performing code, poor and partly broken Amiga compatibility, relying on the second class Amiga API's and standards, Linux API's, lacking important standards, etc, and tying it to usury priced HW of poor performance and dubious quality. So I'm glad they aren't allowed to sell it as "Amiga"; since this will make it easier to advice people to stay clear from Hyperion's products without necessarily staying clear of "Amiga".

AFAIK, Commodore has a valid agreement with the IP owner to use the *Amiga* brand. This is very legal, and compared to what Hyperion has done during the last years, it's *very* ethical!

[commodorejohn]

Your business model looks fine but who cares you aren't a entrepenuer with money to spend on CUSA, Barry is.

So that makes his opinion invalid? Is that what this comes down to, money? 'Cause people who will take anything from anybody as long as they bring the cash, there's a word for them...

[KThunder]

...
While I don't agree with Darrin's "evil" rhetoric, I think he's onto something with the idea of differentiated product lines providing some actual support for those of us in the community who see the Amiga brand as something more than just a sticker to be slapped onto whatever's selling well. Instead, C-USA seems to be completely in the dark about this, and its supporters actively hostile to anybody with a different view...

Why should they provide a differetiated product line? Hyperion etc. haven't, Cloanto doesnt. OS4 is for PPC only, Aros is open source and can be ported to different archs but x86 is the main one.

This guy recognizes that x86 rules the world. Even Apple recognized that.

[KThunder]

So that makes his opinion invalid? Is that what this comes down to, money? 'Cause people who will take anything from anybody as long as they bring the cash, there's a word for them...

He isn't spending his own money to start a company. Barry is.