SAM 460 poor performance, high price

[itix]

But it's so exciting to follow all the improvements in my beloved OS from my childhood when Aos was king even if it's lightyears behind now. Aros and morphos has no roots for me even if i have been using it for many years now (have only tested aros quickly a few times). It sucked from the beginning and it sucks now.

That is going to change when UAE users adopt new AROS/68k.

[zylesea]

Out of interest, how much would non-OS4 user's be happy to pay for the 460 so that they could give OS4 a try?   Personally, I'd consider anything over 300 EUR a high price, all things considered.

300EUR (incl. German VAT of 19%) is my maximum. That would be 5  times the price of an D510 itx-Atom board (which all in all is better spec'd than the Sam460).
http://shop.e-bug.de/shop/product_info.php?info=p238816&refID=FR

I'm actually very surprised that ACube have even released a new MB, maybe they really do sell most of them to Industry?

That would be interesting to know. Some ppl claim they do, but there is very little evidence for that on the net...

[jj]

In powerpc amiga terms, I am still using a 603e, therefore by the "law of trying to compensate for other inadequacies", I clearly have the biggest manhood.
 

 
:roflmao:   :roflmao:     :roflmao:

[jj]

300EUR (incl. German VAT of 19%) is my maximum. That would be 5 times the price of an D510 itx-Atom board (which all in all is better spec'd than the Sam460).
http://shop.e-bug.de/shop/product_info.php?info=p238816&refID=FR
 
 
That would be interesting to know. Some ppl claim they do, but there is very little evidence for that on the net...

Not everything is put on the net for everyone to find out mind you.

[jacadcaps]

Thats odd since Treavor sent an X1000 board to the MorphOS development team a long time ago.

No, he did not. We were never interested in getting one in the first place.

[klx300r]

300EUR (incl. German VAT of 19%) is my maximum. That would be 5  times the price of an D510 itx-Atom board (which all in all is better spec'd than the Sam460).
http://shop.e-bug.de/shop/product_info.php?info=p238816&refID=FR
..

hey you just might get a Blizzard PPC card for that price with luck:afro:

[jj]

I beggining to wonder is I should sell mine, been sitting unused in my miggy for years.
 
What you reckon a 603e/175 040/25 and Bvision would go for ?

[Louis Dias]

Actually, Altivec isn't irrelevant. It is used (albeit not as extensively as I'd like) in MiniGL, the avcodec library, and IIRC, some other parts of the OS too. Even if it weren't used at present, it's important enough that Freescale have finally decided to add it to their QorIQ range of processors. About time! It would be nice if Applied Micro could follow suit; their new dual-core PowerPC processor would be a lot more interesting if it included altivec.

The Sam 460ex is meant to be a low-end machine. It may not have altivec, but it's still a nice machine. It's a good step up from the Sam 440 series, and I prefer it over my A1-XE G4. Why? Mainly because of the PCI-Express bus and faster RAM.

Having said that, I'm still getting an A1-X1000.

Hans

+1

I think the faster bus and gpu will give it quite a gaming edge over Macs once good 3d drivers are done!

[jj]

By the time its released I would imagine the last of the line of the PPC macs will be supported, and from what I can gather there will be very little difference between them and the X1000, excepet of course about £2k in price

[zylesea]

hey you just might get a Blizzard PPC card for that price with luck:afro:

For 300 EUR I can easily get a 1500MHz G4 Mac mini (which is significantly faster than the Atom) plus a MorphOS license. No need for old 603 stuff...

[Louis Dias]

By the time its released I would imagine the last of the line of the PPC macs will be supported, and from what I can gather there will be very little difference between them and the X1000, excepet of course about £2k in price

As I've mentioned before, the fastest PPC Mac (G5) used DDR2-533 memory.
The X1000 should outperform it.  The SAM460 already outperforms a G4 1.5Ghz on large memory intensive tasks.

They both support modern graphics cards that will never see the light of day on Mac hardware so they will have a gaming edge for 3D.

The classic Amigas were faster in there day than PCs because the cpu had fast custom chips supporting it.  SAM460 and X1000 have faster "custom" chips (and bus) than the Macs...and by "custom", I mean every chip that is not the cpu.

There is also something to be said for *new* vs. *used*.

Personally, I don't see why MOS isn't ported to SAM440/460.  People in particular currently owning 440's may be selling them in order to upgrade to the 460...  People already in possession of a SAM would be making a conscious decision to support MOS so I don't see why the powers that be simply don't do it.  Gotta love politics...

[jj]

Well I heard they were porting MorphOS to the GC and Wii next

[Louis Dias]

I guess we should all laugh at everyone that bought a Minimig!
Those suckers paid >$42/Mhz...

/fail

I own 3 cars.  A 1997 Corvette and 2 1987 Fiero GT's.  I've spent more on the Fieros (each) than the Corvette.  It's a hobby.  Prices are irrelevant.

People complaining about prices need a new hobby.

[Louis Dias]

Well I heard they were porting MorphOS to the GC and Wii next

Then I'd actually try it out using hardware I actually own.  What a novel concept.

I also love how everytime I say something you don't agree with and can't counter, you go into stupid-troll mode.

[Piru]

The SAM460 already outperforms a G4 1.5Ghz on large memory intensive tasks.

Really? What are you basing this on?

The numbers I've seen are:

SAM460 AMCC460 1.167GHz

Code: [Select]

---> RAM <---
READ32: 311 MB/Sec
READ64: 310 MB/Sec
WRITE32: 521 MB/Sec
WRITE64: 521 MB/Sec
WRITE: 1251 MB/Sec (Tricky)
Mac Mini 7447 1.5GHz

Code: [Select]

---> RAM <---
READ32: 387 MB/Sec
READ64: 403 MB/Sec
WRITE32: 771 MB/Sec
WRITE64: 771 MB/Sec
WRITE: 809 MB/Sec (Tricky)
(source)

[Louis Dias]

Really? What are you basing this on?

The numbers I've seen are:

SAM460 AMCC460 1.167GHz

Code: [Select]

---> RAM <---
READ32: 311 MB/Sec
READ64: 310 MB/Sec
WRITE32: 521 MB/Sec
WRITE64: 521 MB/Sec
WRITE: 1251 MB/Sec (Tricky)

Mac Mini 7447 1.5GHz

Code: [Select]

---> RAM <---
READ32: 387 MB/Sec
READ64: 403 MB/Sec
WRITE32: 771 MB/Sec
WRITE64: 771 MB/Sec
WRITE: 809 MB/Sec (Tricky)

By your own listing there, the last write speed listed was 50% higher probably because it involves writing to main ram.  If these tests were performed using local cache then the Mac will win.  Writing to actually RAM and reading from actual ram should be faster on the SAM as someone else posted earlier.

Anyone can make a test that is more favorable to one platform or the other.

I'll wait for some real world benchmarks.
The fact of the matter is it will talk faster to the gpu, like it or not.  SAM460 will *feel* faster than it's 1.15MHz.

SAM
---> VIDEO BUS <---
READ: 72 MB/Sec
WRITE: 261 MB/Sec

MAC
---> VIDEO BUS <---
READ: 32 MB/Sec
WRITE: 180 MB/Sec

Even your posting was biased...sad...