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Author Topic: More Kudos for IE....NOT!  (Read 4581 times)

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Offline ottomobiehlTopic starter

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More Kudos for IE....NOT!
« on: December 12, 2003, 02:07:55 AM »
I was scanning through some news today when I found this.

My favorite part of the story is the Microsoft Bit.
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A Microsoft spokeswoman said the company is investigating the flaw. The company also chastised security experts for releasing the information to the public before giving Microsoft a chance to fix the bug.


How about making sure the product is done before shipping it out.  Like making a half-baked loaf of bread and then serving it to people. :-)
 

Offline adolescent

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Re: More Kudos for IE....NOT!
« Reply #1 on: December 12, 2003, 02:23:29 AM »
Well, until a bug is found it's not a bug.  So really, this can happen to any software.  
Time to move on.  Bye Amiga.org.  :(
 

Offline ottomobiehlTopic starter

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Re: More Kudos for IE....NOT!
« Reply #2 on: December 12, 2003, 02:37:01 AM »
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adolescent wrote:
Well, until a bug is found it's not a bug.  So really, this can happen to any software.  


True.  But as the saying goes, "The more you overwork the plumbing the easier it is to clog up the pipes." (Paraphrasing) :-)

I know Microsoft isn't the only company who is guilty of this.
 

Offline Wolfe

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Re: More Kudos for IE....NOT!
« Reply #3 on: December 12, 2003, 06:16:15 AM »
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adolescent wrote:
Well, until a bug is found it's not a bug.  So really, this can happen to any software.  


True, but this kind of thing happens all the time in all things M$.   :-x
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Offline Effy

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Re: More Kudos for IE....NOT!
« Reply #4 on: December 12, 2003, 06:54:08 AM »
That´s why I prefer to use only Opera V7 on my pc for browsing and mailing. I only use IE when a site won´t work with Opera, but I handle NO mails with Outlook, only with Opera !!!

Offline Cyberus

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Re: More Kudos for IE....NOT!
« Reply #5 on: December 12, 2003, 09:28:59 AM »
I use an electric generator powered by burning cow turds for my house's power needs, just in case Bill Gates has a share in the local power company. Everyone give me a pat (not of the cow variety) on the back for not endorsing M$...
I like Amigas
 

Offline Piru

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Re: More Kudos for IE....NOT!
« Reply #6 on: December 12, 2003, 09:37:43 AM »
There's a demonstration page, too.
 

Offline mikey2001

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Re: More Kudos for IE....NOT!
« Reply #7 on: December 12, 2003, 11:14:20 AM »
That news  doesn't bother me, I stop using IE about three months ago and ive been a Netscape man ever since!  :-D
Mike
 

Offline Rodney

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Re: More Kudos for IE....NOT!
« Reply #8 on: December 12, 2003, 12:30:55 PM »
Seriously, is anyone else getting tired of the microsoft bashing? Yes their software is buggy, yes their software is insecure, but can you honestly say that AmigaOS is less bugy and more secure when Windows has a larger tester/user base and thus more of a chance to find bugs/security flaws?

When someone brings me a peice of software that is bugless i'll declair hell frozen over. But beware, i was tought that hello world programs have bugs :) Every peice of software has bugs, you just have to look harder and harder to find them the longer you keep fixing them!

Also, if something is marked as stable and/or reliable, all that means is that no major bugs exist that anyone knows of that should keep back the release of some program. I garrentee that AmigaOS will have a lot of bugs after its released, then same goes for morphos, linux, everything!
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Offline mikeymike

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Re: More Kudos for IE....NOT!
« Reply #9 on: December 12, 2003, 12:55:47 PM »
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Well, until a bug is found it's not a bug.

Pardon?
 

Offline KennyR

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Re: More Kudos for IE....NOT!
« Reply #10 on: December 12, 2003, 01:40:02 PM »
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Rodney wrote:
Seriously, is anyone else getting tired of the microsoft bashing?


No. Bad coding should always result in bad publicity. Microsoft seem never to test their stuff - with their budget bugs like this are absolutely inexcusable, and a prime example why their monopoly is detrimental if not debilitating to the computing scene.
 

Offline Rodney

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Re: More Kudos for IE....NOT!
« Reply #11 on: December 12, 2003, 02:30:15 PM »
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No. Bad coding should always result in bad publicity. Microsoft seem never to test their stuff - with their budget bugs like this are absolutely inexcusable, and a prime example why their monopoly is detrimental if not debilitating to the computing scene.


Im not even sure MS have bad programming practices. No one knows that unless they work there.

But even so, MS products are some of the most complicated software in the world. Especialy with their OS. It'd be damn hard to manage a project that large.

Software Engineering is a very new profession in terms of professions. We didnt learn to make bridgets over night and some still fall down. I remember one feel down in tasmania whilst only just being finished or still under construction. There still needs to be better models and designs pattersn worked out.

Microsoft have good products and thats why their the most dominate Software house in the world!
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Offline mikeymike

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Re: More Kudos for IE....NOT!
« Reply #12 on: December 12, 2003, 02:31:21 PM »
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No. Bad coding should always result in bad publicity. Microsoft seem never to test their stuff - with their budget bugs like this are absolutely inexcusable, and a prime example why their monopoly is detrimental if not debilitating to the computing scene.


I hardly go around defending MS all the time, but I disagree with you here.

This is a fairly obscure vulnerability, even though it appears simple.  But, as with many things, the "solution" appears simple once it has been found.  Many other vulns have been found in IE6 SP1 since it was released late last year.

Microsoft do have an awesome budget at their disposal, but I don't think it's QA that is the problem here, it's that functionality is regarded as a far higher priority than security, reliability and performance.  The last three factors do not directly earn MS money.  Functionality is something definite that can be heralded by their sales/marketing reps.  Security, reliability and performance aren't anywhere near so easily marketed.

If people honestly judge Windows, it should be admitted that Windows for example is a fairly awesome product, and in many respects far ahead of the competition for the audience it is primarily aimed at (average desktop users).  However, its main problem is that, a bit like with Netscape 4x, true innovation has plateaued.  What is needed is for it to break out of that mould, which to a certain extent in the case of Netscape 4x, Mozilla did, and Firebird/Thunderbird has done also to a greater extent.  However, "breaking out of the mould" for a business is risky, and while in long development, doesn't earn them any money.
 

Offline mikeymike

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Re: More Kudos for IE....NOT!
« Reply #13 on: December 12, 2003, 02:38:47 PM »
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But even so, MS products are some of the most complicated software in the world. Especialy with their OS. It'd be damn hard to manage a project that large.


Ok, it is more difficult to manage a larger project, however MS are in a mess of their own making.  For example, the only reason IE is integrated into the OS is to push out browser competition.  All the other little features it has brought all stem from that bad intention ("what can we offer our users to distract them from the fact that we screwed them?").  It was implemented badly, the idea is flawed, and so Windows has a largely increased number of attack vectors as a result.  The project was unnecessarily complicated.
 

Offline KennyR

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Re: More Kudos for IE....NOT!
« Reply #14 on: December 12, 2003, 03:09:17 PM »
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Rodney wrote:
But even so, MS products are some of the most complicated software in the world. Especialy with their OS. It'd be damn hard to manage a project that large.


They've only made it hard for themselves by poor visualisation of new additions and even poorer execution. DLL hell and most of the other criticisms of Windows comes directly from this.

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Microsoft have good products and thats why their the most dominate Software house in the world!


If you went by that logic, IBM or Sun Microsystems would dominate the world, since their software is a lot better than Microsoft's.

Microsoft dominate the world because they bundled their bad software with PCs, pure and simple. It has nothing to do with their skills. If the market was open to real competition Microsoft would do very badly, unless they improved a lot.