PPC accelerator poll

[Cammy]

I'd rather it if someone brought out an Amiga-style keyboard wedge case that fits a Mini-ITX motherboard and stick in a Sam440 to run OS4, or an iMica to run Aros.

Since Aros is making its way to 68k Amigas we're going to have a major OS update soon, meaning there's even less reason to upgrade to PPC just to use a newer OS on our classics.

Even if we got a new PPC accelerator, the Sam still has USB, RTG and 16bit audio, fast ethernet and a whole bunch of other features that would be slower on a PPC-powered classic Amiga.

[Franko]

Is there an accelerator?
Let's just say that the facts to date are that dealers would like that as a product option.

#6

Hmm... now that is interesting... go on spill the beans...

[ognix]

I won't register for voting, but the PPC way is dead...
I understand that Hyperion/Ben Hermans does not agree, since the amount of work behind Amiga OS4 (beside problems, whatsover it has), but it will lead to death IMHO.

Happy for AROS on 68k (so an OS upgrade for "classic" Amigas could be done, sooner or later) and for AROS x86, so to have cheap updated hardware almost off-the-shelf.
Beside this, even WinUAE with AROS 68k will be an upgrade option (in case AROS x86 is not mature enough).

[number6]

Hmm... now that is interesting... go on spill the beans...

As luck would have it, AW seems to be down again atm.
I was going to point to some links, to show the statement made by Amigakit, at the very least.

If you read the thread from years ago (link given within the thread I pointed to earlier) you can see the phenomenal # of responses.
With each passing year, perhaps interest seems to decrease.
Or perhaps it is just because it has become so difficult to believe in anything?
I still believe the most horrid/misleading statement ever made was "classic is dead", especially when you consider -when- that statement was made.
Whether anyone makes an effort as regards the subject is totally unknown at this point. Relating the history would be pointless, because I can only deal with the human resources that remain at any given point.
Sorry, if that is vague, but that is as much as can be said without leaving you with any false impression or illusion of promise.

#6

[Fransexy_]

I won't register for voting, but the PPC way is dead...
I understand that Hyperion/Ben Hermans does not agree, since the amount of work behind Amiga OS4 (beside problems, whatsover it has), but it will lead to death IMHO.

Happy for AROS on 68k (so an OS upgrade for "classic" Amigas could be done, sooner or later) and for AROS x86, so to have cheap updated hardware almost off-the-shelf.
Beside this, even WinUAE with AROS 68k will be an upgrade option (in case AROS x86 is not mature enough).

You said PowerPC is dead and then you say you are happy with an Aros on a processor that is not even produced anymore (68k).Contradictory response yours

[Heiroglyph]

A fast 68k card with either an FPGA or a different CPU with a 68k emulator in ROM would pique my interest, but not a PPC.

Unless the PPC can masquerade as a 68K fast enough to beat my 060/66 that is.

[klx300r]

I was going to vote yes but that would mean logging in and that site's just too OS4.x biased to me (if I logged in I might upset a few of the nerds over there...

some of those 'nerds' are among us:nervous:

[HammerD]

@thread

It's nice to read all the opinions and experiences in this thread, quite a variety

I will apply some statistical analysis to the results once the poll runs it's course at the end of the month.  A stats professor at my University has written an excel spreadsheet for me that will do this.

He said to me if you estimate a total population size of 2000, 5000, or 10000 possible users, the poll has a plus or minus accuracy rate of 9.5%.

Extrapolating those numbers out based on the population estimate could give you an estimate of possible sales.

For example, currently the poll has 38% of respondents saying "Yes!".

38% of various estimated population sizes is:

For 2000 Users: 760
For 5000 Users: 1900
For 10000 Users: 3800

The variance is plus or minus 9.5% as I stated.

At least that is how I interpret what the Professor has said to me.  But once the poll is finished I will ask him exactly how to interpret the results and I can even post the spreadsheet here.  I'm by no means a stats expert so I could be totally wrong.

[Franko]

some of those 'nerds' are among us:nervous:

I'd noticed that... :sealed:

But then some over their are more nerdier than your average nerds. I mean there was a thread that ran for about 2 gizzillion pages, where the discussion was about how many pounds of thrust it would require to push an asteroid off a collision course with earth !!!

Still, at least it cured my insomnia... :roflmao:

(It's also a good advert for euthanasia... :roflmao: )

[ognix]

You said PowerPC is dead and then you say you are happy with an Aros on a processor that is not even produced anymore (68k).Contradictory response yours

I admit, but what matters to me is that the number of PPC Amigas is far less than the "classic" 68k ones right now.

And we, all amigans, have already a 68k processor (in a physical form or "emulated in software"), so we'll benefit for an updated "classic OS" on our old machines (and emulators).
This means you haven't to spend much money (also nothing) for improvements.

On the other end, following the PPC way, you have to buy new hardware, already proven to be very expensive (for the average pockets, at least), for a processor family whose life expectancy is far for being clear nor long (I know IBM is going on with it, but for how long?).

So the option of a FPGA-based processor (could be done forever if we have access to complex programmable logic) or backwards compatibility through software emulation on common hardware, is the most comfortable, cheap, valuable, long life way to go (in my opinion, of course).

[fitzsteve]

@Franko (sorry I must have missed your mediator post)

I'm running a Blizzard 060/PPC and Mediator setup and I must say its awesome!

I've got a Soundblaster 128 and a Voodoo 5 5500 hooked up to it.  With the update patch OS4 runs with this setup right out of the box in RTG.

I'm personally looking forward to OS4.1 as I'm sure there will be a lot more options for it software wise as OS4 is a little thin on the ground.

I also use Amigasys4AGA and Classic Workbench P96 along with my RTG setup and they both look and run great.

I also have a stock OS3.9 setup running off the Blizzard SCSI which is nice and fast plus WarpOS/Warp3D all setup and working with the Voodoo 5.

I'm glad I got my PPC, I know it cost me an arm and a leg but I feel part of a very exclusive club and surprisingly I'm not at all worried about using it, I switch the machine on and use it daily.

Steve.

[wawrzon]

there were so many polls and discussions about the subject in the past. jens rejected that, because of the amount of development work and costs, i think this really says it all as this is currently the only person/company in the scene that actually delivers.
as for techical side ppc might still be an easier option these days since there is warpos (and os4 for that matter) that could take advantage of that. but i would prefer a completely new solution, maybe 68k emulation layer on an arm, jit lag makes me uneasy though. nothing is an responsive as true 68k.

[Franko]

@Franko (sorry I must have missed your mediator post)

I'm running a Blizzard 060/PPC and Mediator setup and I must say its awesome!

I've got a Soundblaster 128 and a Voodoo 5 5500 hooked up to it.  With the update patch OS4 runs with this setup right out of the box in RTG.

I'm personally looking forward to OS4.1 as I'm sure there will be a lot more options for it software wise as OS4 is a little thin on the ground.

I also use Amigasys4AGA and Classic Workbench P96 along with my RTG setup and they both look and run great.

I also have a stock OS3.9 setup running off the Blizzard SCSI which is nice and fast plus WarpOS/Warp3D all setup and working with the Voodoo 5.

I'm glad I got my PPC, I know it cost me an arm and a leg but I feel part of a very exclusive club and surprisingly I'm not at all worried about using it, I switch the machine on and use it daily.

Steve.

Cheers for that info Steve...

I've always been curious about the mediator board and that's the kind of answers I was hoping for. Amigakit say they have a new version arriving soon so I reckon I'll go with that.

Finally looks like I'll have a good use for my trusty old BPPC board at last and be able to give up trying to find a BVision for it...

Cheers :drink:

Franko

[fitzsteve]

Cheers for that info Steve...

I've always been curious about the mediator board and that's the kind of answers I was hoping for. Amigakit say they have a new version arriving soon so I reckon I'll go with that.

Finally looks like I'll have a good use for my trusty old BPPC board at last and be able to give up trying to find a BVision for it...

Cheers :drink:

Franko

Hey no problem Franko, also Elbox have updated their drivers with a new MMCD so better support for varioius Network Cards, TV Cards, in addition to the Sound and Graphics.  They also do a USB card but I'm led to beleive you're better off with a Subway.

Anyway the mediator was the best move I made for my A1200 after I towered it, I tried a MicroNik Zorro Busboard and I had nothing but a nightmare.  The Mediator (aside from Warp3D) was pretty straight forward to setup.

Steve.

[orb85750]

@thread

It's nice to read all the opinions and experiences in this thread, quite a variety

I will apply some statistical analysis to the results once the poll runs it's course at the end of the month.  A stats professor at my University has written an excel spreadsheet for me that will do this.

He said to me if you estimate a total population size of 2000, 5000, or 10000 possible users, the poll has a plus or minus accuracy rate of 9.5%.

Extrapolating those numbers out based on the population estimate could give you an estimate of possible sales.

For example, currently the poll has 38% of respondents saying "Yes!".

38% of various estimated population sizes is:

For 2000 Users: 760
For 5000 Users: 1900
For 10000 Users: 3800

The variance is plus or minus 9.5% as I stated.

At least that is how I interpret what the Professor has said to me.  But once the poll is finished I will ask him exactly how to interpret the results and I can even post the spreadsheet here.  I'm by no means a stats expert so I could be totally wrong.

I don't think that is correct. The so-called standard error is the square root of [p*(1-p)/n],
where p is the probability (0.38) and n is the sample size.  Using the standard error gives only a 68% confidence of the result.  For a 95% confidence, you use ~twice the standard error.  I have no idea how many have participated in the poll, but let's say it is 100 (for example).  Then the standard error is about 5%.  So at the 68% confidence level, that would be 38% +/- 5% and at the 95% confidence level, that would be 38% +/- 10%. BUT THE REAL PROBLEM IS you're assuming that the AW website is a good representation of Amiga users.  If it is tilted toward OS4 fans, then extrapolating these results to all Amiga users is not a good idea.

[Franko]

I don't think that is correct. The so-called standard error is the square root of [p*(1-p)/n],
where p is the probability (0.38) and n is the sample size.  Using the standard error gives only a 68% confidence of the result.  For a 95% confidence, you use ~twice the standard error.  I have no idea how many have participated in the poll, but let's say it is 100 (for example).  Then the standard error is about 5%.  So at the 68% confidence level, that would be 38% +/- 5% and at the 95% confidence level, that would be 38% +/- 10%. BUT THE REAL PROBLEM IS you're assuming that the AW website is a good representation of Amiga users.  If it is tilted toward OS4 fans, then extrapolating these results to all Amiga users is not a good idea.

You wouldn't be one of those nice Amigaworld.net erm.. chappies I mentioned earlier... :roflmao: