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Offline SpeewaveTopic starter

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New to amigas...
« on: September 22, 2010, 01:41:54 AM »
Someone i know is looking to give up his Amiga 2000... he might give it to me (since im a fan of retro stuff), with a couple games\software... not sure of what model it is.. (A\B\C\HD) or what he has in it (#Floppies or Extentions)
 
Anyway... i don't know much about them, (Hardware Wise)... Just wondering if you can answer some questions...
 
I'm just going to use it as some thing to just goof around with... My PC can do what ever the Amiga Did and More..
 
(FYI: I Am a Completely new to amigas.. i'm Only 16, and we didn't have a Computer untill my Brothers PC in '96, so if something sounds incredibly stupid or impossible... its just cause whatever i know... Its From Googling Amiga's)
==============
  • Can Amiga's Accept HD Floppies... (even if they dont read all of the 1.44MBs)
  • Do i NEED a Commodore Monitor... I was planning on hooking it up my TV and Speaker system...
  • Is there any DIY or Cheap Sound Input Cards... Saw something on youtube.. but the guy didn't make a schematic, so i didn't know if there's one out here..
  • I Might Do either Game Programming or just basic things.. is there any sites with tutorials on doing this?
  • Also, Can i Copy Software\Data From PC to my Amiga? (Things such as Demos\Trackers\MOD Music... i guess it partially refers back to Question #1
========
Also:
  • Whats a good Cheap IDE Card for it? (Debating on getting one if i need it for CD or a HDD?
  • If i find an HDD Drive \ IDE Card... How Big can Amiga Handle?
============
 
Thanks in advance...
 

Offline SpeewaveTopic starter

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Re: New to amigas...
« Reply #1 on: September 22, 2010, 01:44:20 AM »
Oh... 1 More Question... How Backwards Compatable are Games\Software... like if i found software made for an earlier Amiga... would it work on the 2000?
 

Offline marcfrick2112

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Re: New to amigas...
« Reply #2 on: September 22, 2010, 03:16:22 AM »
Too many questions all at one, my head hurts......:hammer:

So, I'll try to answer your last question.... Backwards comp. of games can be hit or miss, unless you have WHDLoad (Google it) I highly recommend getting and registering WHDLoad, pretty much any game/demo, new or old , will work, assuming your miggy has enough RAM, etc...... YMMV, or course.
    As for apps., the vast majority are system-friendly. You may find an older app that doesn't like a certain program, or in my case, hack..... Both MakePath and TerraForm (??) add-ons for Vista won't work properly if Magic Menu is running?... :confused:

You can always try programs like Degrader, etc. to help with comp. ....
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Offline AmigaEd

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Re: New to amigas...
« Reply #3 on: September 22, 2010, 03:21:01 AM »
Welcome, Nice to meet you. You're in for a different experience with the Amiga!

Quote from: Speewave;580602
My PC can do what ever the Amiga Did and More..


Just for future reference, the above statement isn't a great way to win friends here... Some people take their Amigas very seriously and for good reason.

Quote from: Speewave;580602

  • Can Amiga's Accept HD Floppies... (even if they dont read all of the 1.44MBs)
  • Do i NEED a Commodore Monitor... I was planning on hooking it up my TV and Speaker system...
  • Is there any DIY or Cheap Sound Input Cards... Saw something on youtube.. but the guy didn't make a schematic, so i didn't know if there's one out here..
  • I Might Do either Game Programming or just basic things.. is there any sites with tutorials on doing this?
  • Also, Can i Copy Software\Data From PC to my Amiga? (Things such as Demos\Trackers\MOD Music... i guess it partially refers back to Question #1
========
Also:
  • Whats a good Cheap IDE Card for it? (Debating on getting one if i need it for CD or a HDD?
  • If i find an HDD Drive \ IDE Card... How Big can Amiga Handle?
============
 
Thanks in advance...


I think I'll start with Question #5 - Yes, you can transfer software and data between your PC and Amiga. There are several ways to go about this and the best way usually depends on how much memory you have in your Amiga.

Anyway, Checkout the following (in no particular order)...

ADF Sender Terminal (for transfer of Disk Image files between Amiga and PC)
http://adfsender.stoeggl.com/

Amiga Explorer (for transfer of Disk Image files between Amiga and PC)
http://www.amigaforever.com/ae/

CrossDos (for direct reading of PC disks on the Amiga)
http://www.l8r.net/technical/t-crossdos.shtml

Question #1 - I think you will find that the drive on the Amiga 2000 will not read High Density  floppies formatted as HD. (someone please correct me on this if I'm wrong.) Of course you could cover up the hole in the corner of the HD disk with tape (This is the hole in the corner opposite of the write protect hole). You can now format the HD disks as DS/DD disks.

Question #2 - You could most likely hook up the composite output from the Amiga to a TV but my experience has been that it looks pretty terrible. I find it's hard to beat a good Commodore monitor. For newer alternatives, I know some of the users on here have had some good luck with RGB to S-Video adapters and some of the new LCD TVs. Some TVs have been reported to not work so you might want to search for other threads on this topic.

Here is one suggestion of an adapter...

http://www.amigamaniac.com/RGB_to_PAL_NTSC_adapter.html

Hope this helps.

Regards,
AmigaEd
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Offline ElPolloDiabl

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Re: New to amigas...
« Reply #4 on: September 22, 2010, 03:27:15 AM »
It has a composite output. So if your tv has that you are fine.
To read HD floppies you will need an Amiga HD floppy drive or a mod and PC floppy drive.
You can find SCSI cards cheap for the A2000 just get a cheap SCSI drive as well you shouldn't need more than 1 GB. It can handle up to 4GB partitions.
Check Blitzbasic forums or purebasic forums, there are also some 68k assembler tutorials floating around.
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Offline Fingers

Re: New to amigas...
« Reply #5 on: September 22, 2010, 04:09:54 AM »
A2000 composite output is only in Black & White ;) , so if you want to connect to TV, grab an A520, or even a framegrabber with RCA output ( for example, DCTV displays better than A520 on the composite line).

Best IDE controller for the A2000 is the Buddha.

Copying data over from your PC can be done in a number of ways, some include;
Serial Cable using software like Amiga Explorer.
CD drive (connected to Buddha IDE controller)
EXTREMELY small files can be transferred on 720k PC formatted floppies using CrossDOS (included in 2.04 & above?).

Windows filesystem destroys Amiga files, so they must be compressed before being sent to the PC.

PZ.
 

Offline Fingers

Re: New to amigas...
« Reply #6 on: September 22, 2010, 04:22:12 AM »
Quote from: ElPolloDiabl;580612
It has a composite output. So if your tv has that you are fine.


A2000 on-board composite output is Black & White only ;)

PZ.
 

Offline amigakid

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Re: New to amigas...
« Reply #7 on: September 22, 2010, 06:33:05 AM »
Well first off welcome.  The world of Amiga is very fun, just remember though that the Amiga 2000 is over 20 yrs old, but it is still fun.  You can hook it up to a tv, but it is B/W only.  Best to get a monitor.  Install a HDD if you have one.  You can use an 11.44 MB floppy drive, although I can't remember if you can on an Amiga 2000 (been 10 yrs since i last fired mine up), but on my Amiga 4000 i have one.  Copying from PC to Amiga can be done in a number of ways.  One is straight formatting as DOS disk and copying it and using a program such as cross dos.  Another is by using a null modem cross serial connection.  Have fun and good luck.  Also on this site is a great place to ask questions and meet people that use Amigas.
 

Offline fishy_fiz

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Re: New to amigas...
« Reply #8 on: September 22, 2010, 06:59:44 AM »
That's actually not an easy list to answer in point form, there's too many "if's/ands/buts", so I'll give a brief rundown of Amiga hardware and hopefully you'll get the information you need.

The following is written around what's regarded as "classic" amiga's (the one's made by commodore (a500/a600/a1000/a2000/a3000/a4000/etc.). The machine equipped with motorola 680x0 cpu's. There's technically probably a few inaccuracies(like disregarding os4), but for the original posters questions its the info he wants (hopefully)

Firstly Amiga computers are based around 3 chipset models, ocs, ecs, and aga. OCS and ECS are very similar with the same 4096 color palette and onscreen color restrictions remaining the same. The main 2 differences are that ECS can have 2 meg chipram (the ram amigas use for gfx and sound), whereas ocs can only address one, and ecs has an additional screen resolution. AGA adds further resolutions, has 16.777216 million colors, and can display more colors onscreen that ocs/ecs, as well as other assorted extras.
The other thing that's probably most important when it comes to amiga hardware is the OS/kickstart rom version. With Amiga's as well as installing the operating system on to a harddrive (or floppies), there's what's known as the kickstart roms, which are physical chips that slot into the motherboard. These chips, as well as dealing with low level hardware also contain essentially what is the "core" of the amiga operating system. These chips dictate to the same degree as the chipsets what software can and cant be used/backwards compatibility, and so on. As such it's entirely possible to run the latest version of amiga os on even the oldest amiga model if its Kickstart has been upgraded.
In addition to this its also possible to upgrade things like ram and cpu to varying degrees depending on the amiga model in use. The "box" amigas can also take additional cards like graphics or sound cards, which will speed up use and/or give a better quality. On top of this there's also lots of upgrades to add things like pci busboards (ergo pci graphics/sound/etc cards) and usb connections.
One final thing that's probably worth mentioning is that a good portion of the amigas software library (games that run from floppy disks mainly) are reliant on a particular custom chipset. OCS/ECS isnt often a problem in this regard, but there's a not unnoticable portion of games written for ocs/ecs that wont work on an AGA machine. To get around this there's WHDLoad, a program written both to make games installable to harddrive (games that "lock out" the OS and use the chipset directly typically wont install to harddrive) and to help with compatibility. AGA games require an AGA machine though, WHDload or not. Software that is written to use the OS will most of the time install to harddrive easily and work on most amiga models (given enough ram and fast enough cpu).
Near as I can tell this is where I write something under the guise of being innocuous, but really its a pot shot at another persons/peoples choice of Amiga based systems. Unfortunately only I cant see how transparent and petty it makes me look.
 

Offline kolla

Re: New to amigas...
« Reply #9 on: September 22, 2010, 07:29:48 AM »
Quote from: AmigaEd;580611
Just for future reference, the above statement isn't a great way to win friends here...

Depends what kind of friends you want... :)
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Offline KimmoK

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Re: New to amigas...
« Reply #10 on: September 22, 2010, 11:03:31 AM »
@Speewave
"My PC can do what ever the Amiga Did and More.."

25 years later? Perhaps.

But on Amiga you can do some things in a nicer or different way.
- jump from application to another in 1/600 of a second
- backup & restore whole system with simple copy
- understand the OS guts & doings very quickly
etc..
 
1: A2000 has only double density drive. HD floppies tend to be a little unreliable on DD drives. For data transfers I recommend networking your Amiga or to try sernet / parnet to a PC & use PCs mass media devices from your Amiga.
2: depends on your TVs capability. Some TVs can be connected with RGBtoSCART cables, some via video cables (requires TV modulator to your miggy) or via RGB to VGA adapter.
3: There are alot of those.
5: see 1.
6: I have buddha flash -ide adapter on A4000. It's ok. I might move it to my A2000 one day. Some IDE controllers have also A1200 compatible clock port, with that one might be able to use USB devices. But see also 1 & parnet & sernet & massmedia....
7: AmigaOS is like rubber. With correct drivers & filesystems also A2000 can use almost any size of HDD. I find under 2Gig hard drives to be the most troublefree on old Amigas. (I've used up to 30GB on my old classics)

2GB flash drive might be nice idea for old Amiga ... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QoBF5Gtmv2Y
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Offline persia

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Re: New to amigas...
« Reply #11 on: September 22, 2010, 02:41:08 PM »
2011 the year Amiga *became* PC...
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Offline x303

Re: New to amigas...
« Reply #12 on: September 22, 2010, 04:15:02 PM »
If you wanna use hd fd's, you want one of these: http://www.amiga-hardware.com/showhardware.cgi?HARDID=773
I have one (in red) and it never let me down.
 

Offline Super TWiT

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Re: New to amigas...
« Reply #13 on: September 22, 2010, 05:22:40 PM »
Quote from: Speewave;580602

  • Can Amiga's Accept HD Floppies... (even if they dont read all of the 1.44MBs)
  • I've only ever used HD floppies with my amiga and its worked perfectly all the time. I have the stock floppy drive.  All that happens is that the amiga sees it as a low-density disk.  It does have a greater chance of data corruption (marginal), but that's why I make sure to keep adf backups of disks on my pc, so that if something does happen to the disk, I can just restore it.  A great piece of software to transfer data between your pc and your amiga is Amiga Explorer.  Your amiga shows up like a regular device in windows explorer.  You use a null modem cable between the serial port on your pc and the serial port on your amiga.  It works fantastically.  You do need to use a null modem serial cable that has (or can be adapted) to db25 as the amiga uses a 25 pin serial port.  Many cables claim to be null modem but are actually wired not completely to spec.  This cable here will solve all your needs.  If you don't have a serial port, a common usb serial adapter will work fine.
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Offline Super TWiT

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Re: New to amigas...
« Reply #14 on: September 22, 2010, 05:43:55 PM »
Quote from: Speewave;580602

  • Can Amiga's Accept HD Floppies... (even if they dont read all of the 1.44MBs)
I've only ever used HD floppies with my amiga and its worked perfectly all the time. I have the stock floppy drive.  All that happens is that the amiga sees it as a low-density disk.  It does have a greater chance of data corruption (marginal), but that's why I make sure to keep adf backups of disks on my pc, so that if something does happen to the disk, I can just restore it.  I think the people that have had trouble either had a dirty or misaligned floppy drive, or bad quality disks.  See this thread for more info.  A great piece of software to transfer data between your pc and your amiga is Amiga Explorer.  Your amiga shows up like a regular device in windows.  You use a null modem cable between the serial port on your pc and the serial port on your amiga.  It works fantastically.  You do need to use a null modem serial cable that has (or can be adapted) to db25 as the amiga uses a 25 pin serial port.  Many cables claim to be null modem but are actually wired not completely to spec, so they won't work with the amiga.  This cable here will solve all your needs. It not only works, but converts between db9 (standard for modern machines) and db25.  If you don't have a serial port, a common usb serial adapter will work fine. Amiga explorer even allows you to dump the rom image from your amiga so you can easily (and legally) use it with an emulator such as winuae.

As for the monitor situation, if you want color output on your tv just get an a520 adapter. That's what I do so that I don't have to find space for a bulky monitor.  (Although the commodore monitors are really nice and will double as a TV since they have composite inputs)  Anyway, this adapter plugs into the monitor port, and outputs a standard color composite signal.  They show up on ebay all the time.  Now, the disadvantage to this option is that your amiga won't switch between pal & ntsc, but will be locked to whatever standard your tv is (and what standard the adapter is).  There are software tricks to convert pal games to ntsc, but these don't work that well.
« Last Edit: September 22, 2010, 06:04:04 PM by Super TWiT »
Once there was a man and a boy in the woods.
 
Boy: I\'m scared...
 
Man: Hah! What have you got to be afraid of? I\'m the one that\'s going to be coming back alone!