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Author Topic: IDE PCI controller card with Mediator- anyone tried?  (Read 2620 times)

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Offline voytechTopic starter

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IDE PCI controller card with Mediator- anyone tried?
« on: December 01, 2003, 01:36:44 AM »
Im just wondering if it's possible to stick an IDE controller card into Mediator? I mean, would it work (are there any drivers for IDE controllers). Wouldn't hdd hooked to that controller be much faster than in 1200s internal IDE??
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Offline Karlos

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Re: IDE PCI controller card with Mediator- anyone tried?
« Reply #1 on: December 01, 2003, 01:44:40 AM »
Digital data stored on a grammophone would be faster than the A1200's bare IDE ;-)
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Offline voytechTopic starter

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Re: IDE PCI controller card with Mediator- anyone tried?
« Reply #2 on: December 01, 2003, 01:50:08 AM »
Quote

Karlos wrote:
Digital data stored on a grammophone would be faster than the A1200's bare IDE ;-)


true!  ;-)
but whatabout that ide pci card..
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Offline Karlos

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Re: IDE PCI controller card with Mediator- anyone tried?
« Reply #3 on: December 01, 2003, 01:52:19 AM »
I've no IDEa...

/sorry
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Offline Venkman

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Re: IDE PCI controller card with Mediator- anyone tried?
« Reply #4 on: December 01, 2003, 01:53:48 AM »


:roll:
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Offline patrik

Re: IDE PCI controller card with Mediator- anyone tried?
« Reply #5 on: December 01, 2003, 02:52:06 AM »
@voytech:

It is possible to stick an IDE controller card into the mediator, but as there are not drivers for such cards it wouldnt be usable for anything more than looking at it with a PCI-busscan program :).

Moreover it would be faster than the A1200s internal IDE, but and this is a _BUT_... PCI-cards located on the Mediator1200 will maybe be able to transfer data by themselvers (DMA) to the first 16MB (only 24-bits of addressing on the A1200 expansion connector) of the A1200 address-space... and that is presuming that the Mediator 1200 allows these kind of transfers at all. Presuming that the Mediator 1200 does allow DMA transfers to memory in the first 16MB of the A1200 address-space, the PCI-card willl in most cases only be able to access chipram. This is because most accelerators, except a few old ones only supporting 8MB fastram and pure ram expansions, have their fastram mapped in higher regions of the address-space to be able to have a continuous mapping of the fastram.

This boils down to these performance possibilities:

If the Mediator 1200 supports DMA-transfers to the A1200 address-space it will in most cases only find chipram. The DMA-transfers will be usable, but quite slow. I suppose around 6MB/Sec would be absolute maximum if very lucky, but atleast they wont strain the CPU a bit. The only problem would be if the AGA-chipset was used for graphics at the same time, then the transfers would be much slower and the graphic-operations would slow to a crawl, plus the buffers for the harddrives connected would have to be in chipram, leading to the cpu having to do filesystem work in chipram which would be slow. If a graphic-card is used this will work a bit better as the usable chipram-bandwidth increases a lot if the AGA-chipset isnt drawing anything on a screen.

If the Mediator 1200 doesnt have support to let PCI-cards do transfers to/from the first 16MB of the A1200 address-space all datashuffling to/from the card will be CPU-driven and in a sense it will put this solution on the same level as the builtin IDE of the A1200 as transfers will be very CPU-demanding. Ofcourse it will be faster, it will be as fast as the Mediator 1200 and accelerator have the possibility to communicate which should be around 8MB/Sec.

Though if there exist a SCSI-controller on your accelerator I would highly recommend using it instead as these often make use of DMA transfers, offer better performance and doesnt load the A1200 localbus.

With a Mediator 3000/4000, having a PCI IDE-card would be much better as those Mediator models definately give the PCI-cards the possibility of doing DMA transfers to/from all of the Amigas address-space which would give reasonably fast transfers with no CPU usage.

Is it possible to get programming documentation for the Mediators from Elbox?


/Patrik
 

Offline voytechTopic starter

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Re: IDE PCI controller card with Mediator- anyone tried?
« Reply #6 on: December 01, 2003, 03:05:38 AM »
Quote

patrik wrote:
Is it possible to get programming documentation for the Mediators from Elbox?


I don't think so..(but might be wrong) Someone verify?
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Offline Karlos

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Re: IDE PCI controller card with Mediator- anyone tried?
« Reply #7 on: December 01, 2003, 03:21:36 AM »
Theres this whole odd thing going on with mediator and drivers and stuff right now...

Maybe the prometheus? IIRC it supports open PCI?

Patrik would know...

Thinking about it, he knows waaay too much....

/me looks around with theatrical slyness..

Seriously though, I don't doubt its possible to get better transfer rates over PCI than the 1200 IDE but it would likely be very CPU hogging all the same.

If you want low CPU overhead DMA transfers on A1200, SCSI is still the best way to go (and add a few IDE drives with a bridge) for now, IMHO. 10Mb/s sustained transfer is feasable if phase 5 SCSI controllers live up to their specs.
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Offline patrik

Re: IDE PCI controller card with Mediator- anyone tried?
« Reply #8 on: December 01, 2003, 03:44:36 AM »
Quote

Theres this whole odd thing going on with mediator and drivers and stuff right now...


Fun, isnt it? :)

Quote

Maybe the prometheus? IIRC it supports open PCI?


Havent seen any OpenPCI drivers for any IDE-controllers yet. Though it would definately make sense to write one. Something which doesnt make it less revarding to write one is that many PCI IDE-controllers are quite generic to some extent, so if one a driver was made for one type of IDE-controller.. or maybe I should say chipset as there are numerous IDE-controllers based on exactly the same chipset.. anyhow, then it shouldnt be too much trouble making another driver based on the current which supports another chipset and another and..... you get my point I hope ;).

Quote

Patrik would know...

Thinking about it, he knows waaay too much....

/me looks around with theatrical slyness..

Moha ;)


/Patrik
 

Offline Karlos

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Re: IDE PCI controller card with Mediator- anyone tried?
« Reply #9 on: December 01, 2003, 03:52:16 AM »
Or you could split a driver in two. A generic pciide.device that serves as the standard AmigaOS interface.
This in turn would delegate the low level control to a chipset/card specific subdriver. A bit like the AHI design...
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Offline patrik

Re: IDE PCI controller card with Mediator- anyone tried?
« Reply #10 on: December 01, 2003, 03:58:38 AM »
@Karlos:

That would indeed be a very good idea... as long as it is done in an efficient manner ofcourse... some thinking and planning would be required before the coding takes place :D.

By experience I have learned that that is a good approach when coding ;).


/Patrik
 

Offline voytechTopic starter

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Re: IDE PCI controller card with Mediator- anyone tried?
« Reply #11 on: December 01, 2003, 04:09:26 AM »
Ok, and what bout with linux drivers for such controllers??
Wouldn't it be much easier to write new one based on the linux drivers (IE cnet.device)?
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Offline patrik

Re: IDE PCI controller card with Mediator- anyone tried?
« Reply #12 on: December 01, 2003, 05:11:49 AM »
@voytech:

A lot could be learned by analysing the Linux-driver for the chipset in question.

Feel like accepting the challenge of writing a driver? :) I am positive a lot of people would appreciate the possibility to use a PCI IDE-interface.


/Patrik