AmigaDE for Pegasos PPC website

[bbrv]

We appreciate all the comments on this thread, the good and the bad.  We do these kinds of things to understand the market better.  In some posts good ideas are presented, in others we understand opinions and bias we would not otherwise encounter and last but not least we understand the depth of the ignorance so often associated with the understanding of a controversial situation such as this.

The bottom line is we do not know if AmigaDE is worth the license fee that we will pay to integrate it into a product offering we make.  Perhaps, with Tao involved it might be.  We will see.  For the record, the Amiga Trademarks are not important to us.   The Development and User Community and the hundreds applications still useful are.  These are not owned by Amiga Inc.  Finally, the lawsuit's damages are capped at -ZERO- in the situation as it exists today.  This will not be the reason Amiga Inc. go into bankruptcy.  They are not paying lawyers, so they have no expense on the account of this matter and even less if a Judgment is granted.  The result?  Amiga Inc. begins to generate revenue from Genesi IF we do something with it.  And, that, will depend on the Developers out there that are interested.

R&B  :-)

[Hammer]

The bottom line is we do not know if AmigaDE is worth the license fee that we will pay to integrate it into a product offering we make.

Could you port the open sourced MONO (DOTNET) framework instead for MorphOS?  

[bbrv]

Hi Hammer, tell us how.  That is one of the reasons for having this discussion here to bring out not only the ideas, but the specifics.  It is an international brainstorming session that if done successfully can yield enough information to create a Marketing Requirements Document that in turn can be sourced to a technology team and a level of risk vs. reward can be assessed.  Will it make business sense?  Let's figure it out right here, right now.

R&B  :-)

[Hammer]

bbrv wrote:
Hi Hammer, tell us how.  That is one of the reasons for having this discussion here to bring out not only the ideas, but the specifics.  It is an international brainstorming session that if done successfully can yield enough information to create a Marketing Requirements Document that in turn can be sourced to a technology team and a level of risk vs. reward can be assessed.  Will it make business sense?  Let's figure it out right here, right now.

R&B  :-)

By leveraging dotNET(via open source MONO) ecosystem; MorphOS can assimilate the future (and/or current) dotNET developments, applications and games.  

PS; MONO is supported by Novell…

Reference;
http://www.go-mono.com/screenshots.html
http://www.go-mono.com/faq.html#compatibility
http://www.vertigosoftware.com/Quake2.htm
http://www.ikvm.net/
**JAVA VM for dotNET. This in turn runs IBM's Open Source IDE i.e. Eclipse.

[Ohno]

[...] and the hundreds applications still useful are. These are not owned by Amiga Inc.

No, but Amiga Inc. has first distribution-right because of the signed SDA's. Bundling those usefull apps would still require you to go through Amiga Inc, although all AmigaDE users should be able to download most games/apps by then.
Personally, being a DE-Developer myself, I'd love to see the platform running on as many systems as possible.
And I think Amiga Inc. thinks that way as well. It's just a matter of priorities. I also think they're targetting the biggest markets first and they have to focus all their resources on  getting into these markets. Millions of cell-phones/PDA's still looks like a bigger market to them than a couple of thousands of Pegs I'd say.

Regards,

Onno

[Hammer]

Rodney wrote:

Waccoon wrote:
I don't see any benefit to anybody since DE has not really been demonstrated.  Most people are at a loss as to what DE really is and is supposed to do.  Being dead quiet for nearly four years after "buying" the Amiga name tends to do that.  Personally, I feel Amiga has been dead for two years and won't release anything.  If that's not true, they sure haven't been trying hard to convince us otherwise.

Why use DE and Ami2D when you can use PTL natively on practically any OS?

Well its not big atm, but remember Amiga Incs long term plan is to get AmigaOS running through the DE, which is a grand idea. Much like the .net strategy without all the webservices crap.

That web services crap is for MIS (Managed Information Systems) i.e. related to eBusiness based solutions. Secondly, dotNET framework  compatible MONO is open sourced.

[mantisspider]

With all the problems Amiga Inc are facing  (okay being on the brink of dying lots of times before but they are still here) with all the debts, lawsuits by employees and problems they bring on themselves and problems that are thrust apon them without fault of their own... just how long will they be around.

It seems that even with the sales of the AmigaOne it may be too late to save Amiga Inc (although Hyperion and Eyetech will carry on regardless with the AmigaOne no matter what happens to AmigaInc) the important discussions should be with TAO.

Amiga Inc & Genesi will have their discussions resolved in due time from the case in progress. No real point writing post after post about whether Genesi have a right to DE or not, as its not a matter of our opinion but rather to the correct authorities to decide.

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What we should talk about is what applications should be developed for AmigaDE.
This thread from Page 3 onwards is actually quite good discussing the potential of AmigaDE and people opinions on AmigaDE rather than another AmigaInc Vs Genesi flame war.

i would say for a moderator to move page 1 and 2 somewhere else but Glaucus will start to swear again (is that eddie the eagle edwards driving a taxi in the avatar? I swear it is)

[Rodney]

Hammer wrote:
That web services crap is for MIS (Managed Information Systems) i.e. related to eBusiness based solutions. Secondly, dotNET framework  compatible MONO is open sourced.

Ahhh, yer i know mono is open source, did i even say it wasnt? And doesnt .Net facilitate the development of webservices? That is, .NEt helps you build XML Web services, right?

[bhoggett]

@Rodney

also i think it was Gary C that said it... I also thought that intent ran on PPC. I was told this about a year ago i think by someone at Amiga Inc... maybe fleecy? Cant remember.

intent can run on PPC, but there is no licensed version for PPC at this time. In other words, it's merely theoretical from a developer's point of view.

Well its not big atm, but remember Amiga Incs long term plan is to get AmigaOS running through the DE, which is a grand idea. Much like the .net strategy without all the webservices crap.

No, that was the idea, before it became clear that intent does not have the infrastructure to host a full desktop OS. Amiga Inc formulated their plans without doing their homework, which was to set the tone for their tenure of mismanagement.

Hosting desktop operating systems was never TAO's priority, and still isn't. You're not going to see a future AmigaOS built on top of intent in your lifetime.

Furthermore, the "AmigaDE" component is virtually insignificant, and offers nothing that alternative solutions don't offer. What was exciting three years ago is no longer unique.

The most valuable part of AmigaDE is the "Amiga" brand.

[bbrv]

Hi Hammer, OK good thinking!  But, are you absolutely sure that MONO can tie into all of this?  That is an XSLENT idea!  :-D

We have been on the Eclipse mailing list for two years and are waiting for the final build.

The XML route is certainly interesting.

R&B  :-)

[cockney_dave]

Oh dear, looks like another hopeless attempt by Genesi to undermine Amiga Incs work and flog a couple of Pegasos boards.

The website is in clear copyright/IP breach, contains no mention of the people who actually made the product and is highly misleading/suggests AmigaDE is a Genesi product.

 :-x

[bhoggett]

@Hammer

The bottom line is we do not know if AmigaDE is worth the license fee that we will pay to integrate it into a product offering we make.

Could you port the open sourced MONO (DOTNET) framework instead for MorphOS?  

Indeed, looking to adopt MONO would be a far more adventurous move. The only drawback I see with MONO is that it is basically an open-source "copy" of .NET, which mean the direction is dictated by Microsoft.

However .NET (and by implication MONO) is a far more mature and encompassing technology than that employed in AmigaDE.

[bhoggett]

@cockney_dave

Oh dear, looks like another hopeless attempt by Genesi to undermine Amiga Incs work...

What work?

[Coder]

@bhoggett

The difference between now and one year ago is the same as the difference between now and two years ago, and not a significant improvement over that from three years ago.

True, very true. If it would have taken of it certainly would have to be by now. I signed up on the Genesi site just to keep track of what is going on. I invested some money in the DE thing and maybe it would return something.

Coder

[bbrv]

OK, another good point by Bill H...

Found this OLD DISCUSSION ABOUT DE.  There are a few interesting comments there.

The point is why couldn't MONO head off in its own direction.  BTW, did you notice that the contact information goes to a ximian email address!  :-o

...and consequently Novell (and IBM) are involved. PowerPC is to be fully supported.  It is partially today.

This could be interesting...;-)

R&B  :-)

P.S. This is not a shameless attempt!  We want to pay a license fee under a contract signed and agreed to by Amiga Inc.!  The issue is we do not agree on the terms of the contract and now the Court will decide.  It seems to us that if we make this step then some of the objections HERE might be met and this might all tie together in a nice neat package...;-)

[dammy]

by mantisspider on 2003/11/30 7:33:27

It seems that even with the sales of the AmigaOne it may be too late to save Amiga Inc (although Hyperion and Eyetech will carry on regardless with the AmigaOne no matter what happens to AmigaInc) the important discussions should be with TAO.

No, that's not correct.  Once Amiga Inc goes into bankruptsy, Hyperion/Eyetech will have to make a new seperate bid for the Amiga trademark to continue to hock the teron mobos as AmigaOne.  If someone out bids them, they can no longer use Amiga Inc logo or trademarks (if Amiga Inc owns the latter, don't think it's been cleared up yet by the US Government on trademark ownership).  Yes, Hyperion/Eyetech can continue on selling their wares, but would not be able to use anything related to Amiga Inc's old IP.  

Dammy