Formatting USB sticks (Deneb / OS4 classic)

[HammerD]

Hi all...I have an A4000/CS PPC/Mediator with a Deneb card.

I have the Deneb working fine under OS 3.9/BB2.  Poseidon and Deneb work fine.  I can format USB memory sticks, put on RDB's, format as SFS etc...works ok.  Using HDToolbox from OS 3.9.

My problem....After formatting and copying some files to the USB stick under OS 3.9, then rebooting into OS 4.0 classic, the partitions are unreadable.  They show up on the OS4 workbench as uninitialized.

When I try to format them it makes it all the way to the end then it says "not a valid dos disk".  Does anyone know why?  I tried full and quick format.

Also, does anyone know of a hard disk prep tool that works on OS4 that allows you to use the usbscsi.device? The OS4 built-in tools (mediatoolbox) doesn't support usbscsi.device.

Finally...has anyone successfully:

1) Seen your USB volumes show up in early startup? (with poseidon in flashrom), so you can boot from them?

2) successfully booted OS4 Classic from a USB flash drive connected to the Deneb?

thanks!

[wawrzon]

what format are you using? maybe its just that you re missing the appropriate filesystem in ur L:
if this is fat then im pretty sure fat95 isnt there..

im running here os3.9 and 4.0 on an a4k with a  deneb and no probs with neither kind of flash sticks up till now under neither version. its only that luciferin is not going to work under 4.0. i havnt also tried to have anything os4 related into flash so no early startup visible usb drives for os4, sorry theflash is occupied by my 68k custom kick and it isnt gonna change in foreseeable future.

[HammerD]

what format are you using? maybe its just that you re missing the appropriate filesystem in ur L:
if this is fat then im pretty sure fat95 isnt there..

im running here os3.9 and 4.0 on an a4k with a  deneb and no probs with neither kind of flash sticks up till now under neither version. its only that luciferin is not going to work under 4.0. i havnt also tried to have anything os4 related into flash so no early startup visible usb drives for os4, sorry theflash is occupied by my 68k custom kick and it isnt gonna change in foreseeable future.

Luciferin is working on OS4 but you have to add it to the blacklist (compatibility prefs).

For the filesystems on the usb stick, they were formatted and prepped under OS 3.9 using the latest 68K smartfilesystem.  That is also on the RDB on the usb stick.

The three partitions show up on the workbench as uninitialized.  doing a format from the shell or workbench menus on the uninitialized volumes leads to a "not a valid dos disk" at the very end of the quick or normal format.

Mediatoolbox does not support usbscsi.device so you cannot prep a usb stick under OS4 connected to a Deneb.

[wawrzon]

i must admit im not sure if i ever tried to format usb under os4, even though as far as i recall the os4 mediatoolbox does allow me to access usbscsi.

maybe rdb is not getting read correctly, wouldnt it be safer to have sfsfilesystem in l: im not sure but i suspect sfs has both 68k and ppc filesystem versions? just checked i even run slightly different version under both system. definitely it has to be some minor issue.

[HammerD]

i must admit im not sure if i ever tried to format usb under os4, even though as far as i recall the os4 mediatoolbox does allow me to access usbscsi.

maybe rdb is not getting read correctly, wouldnt it be safer to have sfsfilesystem in l: im not sure but i suspect sfs has both 68k and ppc filesystem versions? just checked i even run slightly different version under both system. definitely it has to be some minor issue.

I tried last night with two different versions of SFS (68k) version 1.279 and 1.277.  Tried putting SmartfileSystem on the RDB and also NOT putting it there.  

Under OS3 everything works fine, the partition is visible, I can read/write files to it no problem.

OS4 they come up as uninitialized and I am unable to format still...I put the 68K SFS in L: on OS4 but still no luck formatting.

[wawrzon]

look really weird. i have used the same sfs versions. i eradicated most of the sfs partitions i had because of other more serious problems i had with them so im not sure what could i check further. i believe though i have still a backup ssd with some sfs partitions on it. i shall try to attach it later under both systems, but i do not recall any such probs with that anyway..

by the way how about to head to http://www.a1k.org with your questions? chris hodges the programmer of poseidon is there a frequent guest, but he could be contacted via mail anyway. also michael boehmer, the hardware designer and producent of debneb visits there. is is a german forum but it has international section.

[HammerD]

look really weird. i have used the same sfs versions. i eradicated most of the sfs partitions i had because of other more serious problems i had with them so im not sure what could i check further. i believe though i have still a backup ssd with some sfs partitions on it. i shall try to attach it later under both systems, but i do not recall any such probs with that anyway..

by the way how about to head to http://www.a1k.org with your questions? chris hodges the programmer of poseidon is there a frequent guest, but he could be contacted via mail anyway. also michael boehmer, the hardware designer and producent of debneb visits there. is is a german forum but it has international section.

I maybe will post on the international section of a1k.org.  Failing that I can bug Chris  But I try to avoid that.

[platon42]

I maybe will post on the international section of a1k.org.  Failing that I can bug Chris  But I try to avoid that.

The latter would help much. I'm afraid I don't know much about OS4 and other that you shouldn't use the DMA-Device under OS4.0, I can't think about anything. Did you try SFSformat instead of the normal "format"? Also, I only have OS3.1, not 3.5 or 3.9. The format program of OS 3.1 is buggy -- never try to do a full format (always use QUICK), especially not on media larger than 4 GB.

Have you tried comparing the volume definition with Scout under OS 3.x and OS 4?

[HammerD]

The latter would help much. I'm afraid I don't know much about OS4 and other that you shouldn't use the DMA-Device under OS4.0, I can't think about anything. Did you try SFSformat instead of the normal "format"? Also, I only have OS3.1, not 3.5 or 3.9. The format program of OS 3.1 is buggy -- never try to do a full format (always use QUICK), especially not on media larger than 4 GB.

Have you tried comparing the volume definition with Scout under OS 3.x and OS 4?

HI Chris, they look the same...but anyway, I just tried with FFS and it works..I can now see the formatted partitions on OS4 and OS3.  Must be something with SFS...

On another note...how do I get the usb volumes to show up in early startup?  I have Poseidon USB stack in the deneb flashrom but I don't see any volumes from the USB show up in early startup....I want to try to boot from them.

thanks!

[wawrzon]

in this short thread chris explains what has to be done, just ignore my posts.. http://www.amiga.org/forums/showthread.php?t=49677&highlight=deneb+boot

[HammerD]

BIG EDIT:

Disregard below.. The USB partitions are now showing up in early startup I think it's very tricky when you press both mouse buttons to get into the early startup...you have to do it at the exact right time...but anyway I am booting from USB now

Faster than internal IDE :-)

in this short thread chris explains what has to be done, just ignore my posts.. http://www.amiga.org/forums/showthread.php?t=49677&highlight=deneb+boot

Thanks for the tip. I read the thread.  Ok so I have confirmed my USB mouse is working in the boot menu.  Still can't see my connected USB flash disk in early startup, though, so I can't boot from it.  I have this setup in the Deneb flashrom:

-all of poseidon 4.3 (from quick setup menu)
-TLSFMem
-romupdate.idtag
-exec.library
-morelibspace (for AFA_OS)
-FileSystem.resource
-denebdmausb.device
-input.device
-bootmenu
-NoClick
-NewAlert
-FastFileSystem (version 45.15)
-icon.library
-workbench.library
-shell
-Shell-Seg
-Ram-Handler
-console.device
-scsi.device

I have my USB stick formatted with FFS, which is also in the RDB.   I have one partition marked bootable with priority -3 and my workbench copoied to it.  (on purpose it is set at -3).

I notice when I am powering on my usb hub (which is working reliably, btw), it does not power on until right after the "green" status screen of the Deneb goes away.  Then if I quickly press both mouse buttons (on usb mouse) I can get into the early startup menu.  I can use the USB mouse, works great!   But I don't see my USB Flash disk that is connected and powered on via the USB hub.  I only see the volumes of my IDE hard disk.

Anything else I need to do?

All the ROMUpdates in the Denen Flashrom are from BoingBag 2 or newer.

In Luciferin I have "Bootloader" option set to Re-install on every boot", "left mouse button" and "Status as Colour".
(Yes Colour is spelt correctly the Canadian way! LOL)

[platon42]

BIG EDIT:

Disregard below.. The USB partitions are now showing up in early startup I think it's very tricky when you press both mouse buttons to get into the early startup...you have to do it at the exact right time...but anyway I am booting from USB now

[...]
I notice when I am powering on my usb hub (which is working reliably, btw), it does not power on until right after the "green" status screen of the Deneb goes away.  Then if I quickly press both mouse buttons (on usb mouse) I can get into the early startup menu.  I can use the USB mouse, works great!

It's only tricky with wireless mice and keyboards. This is due to them only sending changes in events -- and if the receiver is not yet powered up, it will lose the event data -- only on next change this data is updated. Today, I spent about 50 attempts to get to the Mac OS OpenFirmware/CD Booting/Bootmenu with my wireless keyboard before I gave up and bought a wired keyboard for 8 EUR.

Thanks for the tip. I read the thread.  Ok so I have confirmed my USB mouse is working in the boot menu.  Still can't see my connected USB flash disk in early startup, though, so I can't boot from it.  I have this setup in the Deneb flashrom:

Please confirm this for your usb flash disk, too:
2. To be able to boot a USB drive, you need to make sure that
a) The partition you want to boot off is set to "bootable" in HDToolBox
b) The BootPrio is set to a value higher than your internal drive
c) The Filesystem used is installed in the RDB (Fat95 normally doesn't work)
d) If it is a slow drive that needs some time to get ready, increase the boot delay in Trident
e) massstorage.class prefs for that drive are set to automounting (default)

-TLSFMem
-scsi.device

I hope you patched your scsi.device as described in the readme of TLSFMem.

I have my USB stick formatted with FFS, which is also in the RDB.   I have one partition marked bootable with priority -3 and my workbench copoied to it.  (on purpose it is set at -3).

But I don't see my USB Flash disk that is connected and powered on via the USB hub.  I only see the volumes of my IDE hard disk.

Anything else I need to do?

Try increasing the boot delay some more (and reflash the PsdStackloader of course!). Try changing the order in which IDE and hub/flash stick are connected to the Deneb. If this doesn't help, send in the PsdErrorlog to give an insight on what's going on.

(Yes Colour is spelt correctly the Canadian way! LOL)

Well, it's British english and as my father is from the Commonwealth, I feel more obligated to the British spelling than to the American :-P