AmigaOS DevContest kicks off!

[Elwood]

Brave AmigaOS coders stand up!

So you think AmigaOS is great? Then bring some great products to it!
This is your chance to contribute to AmigaOS and put your name into the hall of fame. You'll get popularity, recognition from the community and last but by no means least, you'll get the hardware to run your beloved new AmigaOS on.

This contest was made to help the platform by bringing cool products to it. Its here to help you to work for something and create the best program of all. This is why there are strict rules and there is a validation process in order to enter.
Only the best apps will be accepted because the Amiga community deserves the best software.

You are encouraged to form a group if you feel the need to. So you can "hire" coders and betatesters to shape up a great project.
Also consider that when your program is done, you may make it commercial or why not licence it to some Amiga company. Who knows?

What are you waiting for? Go code!

Click here to read more and to enter.

[Piru]

Edited by Admin: Trolling

[RWO]

You have a point about MUI beeing discriminated

I have an idea for a project, but I dont like to choose Reaction becorse MUI is just that easyer to code for.. so as I see it its only making it harder to complete :-/

[Rogue]

I consider myself AmigaOS coder (AmigaOS being 1.x, 2.x, 3.x here), aswell as MorphOS coder.

I don't want to sound pissy, but this discrimination of AmigaOS 4.0 doesn't sound sane to me.

[Piru]

@Rogue

Don't worry, you don't.

I'm sure some my programs work under AmigaOS4, too. I can't test though.

@Everyone

The rules of the contest limit the target system to AmigaOS4 only, using many AmigaOS4 only components. With requirement of Reaction and other OS4 components, it's close to impossible to develop the program on anything else but OS4. Since OS4 is only available for AmigaONE, the contest is pretty much limited to existing AmigaONE users.

Wouldn't it make much more sense to give more flexibility, and thus make it possible to develop the program on AmigaOS 3.x, AROS, MorphOS, WinUAE, Amithlon etc? Obviously the final competing entry would still need to be OS4 native binary, but with portable code that wouldn't be too hard.

I am sure the contest would be much more of a success with wider audience. Limiting to Amiga coders with AmigaONE just limits too much, IMO.

Finally, I believe giving the AmigaONE system to someone who doesn't already own one would be much more sensible in promoting the AmigaONE platform.

Just my .02 euros.

[FluffyMcDeath]

My main problem with MUI is that folks write code that depends on various MUI classes that you then have to hunt down and install and sometimes the ownership of those things move, the websites change, the class ceases development, etc. etc. The lack of centralized ownership makes maintenance and installing a pain in the arse.

If MUI 3rd party MUI classes were simply licensed by developers that need them so that they could be iuncluded in the distro then that would help the end user and hopefully get rid of the 68k ppc compatibility problems that come up but setting up my MUI apps was a hassle.

With Reaction at least you know that all the UI componants are already installed.

As to the matter of portability, if your functionality is too closely tied to your UI engine then you are always going to have problems. If you separate out your function from the presentation sufficiently then porting from MUI to Reaction to Carbon to Windows to whatever should be much easier. It'll probably help keep your code more understandable too.

[Glaucus]

The rules of the contest limit the target system to AmigaOS4 only, using many AmigaOS4 only components.

Yeah, so what's your point? It's their contest, it's their rules - you might as well complain that you can't submit a WIN32 app into the contest as well. :roll:

And as far as I can see, this is a nice idea, but more might be needed then simply giving away a free AmigaOne. I mean, any developer who makes an OS4 app probably already has one. I think it would be a good idea to give away money, as money can be a great incentive for people to invest their own time into a market that is otherwise not likely to give them a return.

  - Mike

[Batman]

@Piru

Since OS4 is only available for AmigaONE, the contest is pretty much limited to existing AmigaONE users [..] Finally, I believe giving the AmigaONE system to someone who doesn't already own one would be much more sensible in promoting the AmigaONE platform.

Wrong. It's open to Classic Amiga developer with OS3.9 and NDK and cross-compiler. OS4.0 is developed with the maximum source compatibility possible with OS3.9 in mind. :-D

IMHO this contest is aimed to encourage classic developer to (re)start using their 1200/4000 and producing nice code. And, the judges all have (AFAIK) an AmigaOne or Blizzard/Cyberstorm, so they can aid developer in the OS4-porting task.

With requirement of Reaction and other OS4 components, it's close to impossible to develop the program on anything else but OS4

That's the whole purpose of the contest: pushing up the platform again on the road. About Reaction,  you should be glad it's the only tool allowed..I still remember the troubles MorphOS had with its proprietary GUI toolkit not fully owned by the core team... :-)

Having stated all this, I think all your fears are plainly unfounded. :-)

[Batman]

My main problem with MUI is that folks write code that depends on various MUI classes that you then have to hunt down and install and sometimes the ownership of those things move, the websites change, the class ceases development, etc. etc. The lack of centralized ownership makes maintenance and installing a pain in the arse.

This is another reason because MUI wasn't chosen as default GUI toolkit for OS4, dear piru. :-)

[samo79]

I don't understand why you complain when anyone attempts to write an "non compatible AmigaOS4" application without MUI (and therefore tending to exclude the old AmigaOS) while none complains when the MOS developer do the same exact thing.

So maybe in the future, before saying *there is no application for OS4 that justify an AmigaOne*, remember that the only solution to advance the platform is to cut definitely with the past.

[Lando]

Wrong. It's open to Classic Amiga developer with OS3.9 and NDK and cross-compiler.

From the website:-

If your program is based on an OS3 program or an Open Source one, you can't just recompile the software for OS4.

How should I code?

Use OS4-specific features (hooks, reaction classes, vitualised memory...etc). It means you must use Reaction.
Use OS4 newlib runtime library

How exactly are you supposed to develop, test, and debug an application which only runs on OS4.0 on a OS3.9 system?  Simple answer: You can't.

Yes, you can compile an OS4 binary with the cross-compiler but that's not much use if you can't run it.

I've used cross-compilers every day for five years in my job but I've always had the target platform (PS1, PS2, GC, XBox etc) sitting next to me or under my desk as well.  

It's simply not possible to work without easy access to the platform you're developing for.

[Batman]

@lando

You develop on 3.9, then port and RELEASE on os4.0. In this way you can take part in the contest.

Then again, you forgot two simple things I stated before:

1) os3.9 and os4.0 APIs are quite similar. Os4.0 has some enhancements yes, but these doesn't broke retrocompatibility. It's somewhat like to port from linux 2.0 on i386 to linux 2.4 on i686.

2) many member of the grand jury of the contest have one (or more) A1 available and they're more than willing to help the contestants bugfixing their software before the deadline. So, the contestants do have that machine under the desk.

So, let me rephrase your statement: it is possible to work without easy access to the platform you're developing for. It's an Amiga, not your average PC.  :-D

[weirdami]

MUI always just slowed things down on my Amiga and every program I ever got that required MUI had an interface that had little to no interface design and I had to screw with the settings just to get it to work OR, I was required by the program itself to CHOOSE how I wanted things to look before I could use it. Lame.

[KennyR]

Suit yourselves - if people decide against MUI and broader Amiga platform support out of old prejudices, they're only limiting their options. It's counter productive, but hey, it's their choice.

[Slash]

You develop on 3.9, then port and RELEASE on os4.0. In this way you can take part in the contest.

Then again, you forgot two simple things I stated before:

1) os3.9 and os4.0 APIs are quite similar. Os4.0 has some enhancements yes, but these doesn't broke retrocompatibility. It's somewhat like to port from linux 2.0 on i386 to linux 2.4 on i686.

2) many member of the grand jury of the contest have one (or more) A1 available and they're more than willing to help the contestants bugfixing their software before the deadline. So, the contestants do have that machine under the desk.

So, let me rephrase your statement: it is possible to work without easy access to the platform you're developing for. It's an Amiga, not your average PC.

Sorry, but it's not quite that simple. Believe me, I tried, it didn't work, so I bought an A1. Now, I haven't been working as hard on my project as I could have been but the porting of my old 3.9 code to 4.0 code is still in progress after 3 weeks, I've only skimmed the surface of the specific OS4 features.

Compiling a binary for OS4 is one thing, as Lando states, but then what... you give it to someone to test, it crashes, they tell you what and where, send you the Reaper Log, you send a new executable back which is possibly fixed, doesn't work... the circle continues. It is possible, but it's a pain in the backside!

Just because the APIs are 'similar' doesn't mean its just a matter of typing MAKE on OS4 with your 3.9 source code, it simply won't work. You could stuff a lot of #ifdef __amigaos_4__ in there I suppose.

Besides, if it's got to use ReAction how do you test that with a 3.9 app (ClassAct is not a solution here)? And use the OS4 specific features you're meant to be using as stated in the rules, application.library, AmiDock etc etc. Anyway, I'm a big fan of MUI and as it's in a native OS4 form now, I don't see why it should be banned.

I'm ranting... I'm off :-P