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AuthorTopic: IBM Power PC 1GHz chip only runs properly at 933MHz  (Read 6291 times)

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Offline Damion

Re: IBM Power PC 1GHz chip only runs properly at 933MHz
« Reply #30 on: August 06, 2004, 08:49:57 PM »
KennyR have you thought about a 35W Athlon XP-M? It'll drop right in any Socket A
motherboard, is cheap, and Nexus makes a 19 db Athlon/Socket A cooler that should keep it very quiet. 19 db is quieter than most "silent" branded PSUs...so it would practically be inaudible.

Im pretty sure I've seen 35W mobiles @ 1.8 GHz, while that's not the "bleeding edge"
it's still decent, especially compared to that Cyrix.;-) And they're very overclockable -
you could easily hit over 2.0 GHz speeds with that Nexus cooler and some good case
ventilation. (Even at 1.8 GHz, I imagine the performance is at least equal to the GX.)
 

Offline KennyR

Re: IBM Power PC 1GHz chip only runs properly at 933MHz
« Reply #31 on: August 07, 2004, 12:07:31 AM »
Thanks -D-, I'll look into it. 1.8 GHz would do me fine, as long as I could get away with no tower fan. Now I need to research this CPU and see what boards and dealers support it.
 

Offline Waccoon

Re: IBM Power PC 1GHz chip only runs properly at 933MHz
« Reply #32 on: August 07, 2004, 05:09:15 AM »
CPUs with bugs are nothing new, but I find it hard to believe they could release a CPU only to find out later that certain instructions completely fail.

Does this bug reveal itself only when the instructions are used in certain combinations or with particulare operations?  That's forgivable.  If the instructions all-out fail under all conditions, that's a case of improper testing.

Quote
KennyR:  I can't say I blame them either: the heat of CPUs is fast reaching the point of the utterly ridiculous.

It's called supply and demand.  People want fast chips and they're willing to put up with the heat.  Give PPC a few years and you'll see the same thing.  The G3 that went in the early PowerMac towers was pretty damn hot, too.  It has a cooler the size of a large NIC card and a 120mm fan blowing right on it.  The only reason people say that Mac doesn't have "active" cooling is because the fan isn't technically attached to the heatsink.  :-)

I'm glad Intel canned the Tejas.  150+ watts is insane.

Still, ALL chips are approaching this cooling barrier.  People moan and groan about x86, but fail to realize that many graphics cards, and even some north/southbridge chips are running insanely hot.  I replaced the teeny cooler on my Radeon 9800 pro when I felt the board and nearly burned my fingers.  With a HUGE cooler on it (about the size of the whole card), it still runs around 30-40 degrees celcius, which is the same as my P4!

Funny to hear all the PPC fanatics herald the cool performance, then throw a Radeon in the case.   :lol:

Quote
SHADES:  Ewww. This is going to hurt IBM in sales and status. I hope they fix it.
Imagine if it was an Intel bug and not IBM. How many of us would be slamming the "I told u they were crap" line.

Yup.  Nobody is perfect.  Even NASA screws up.

Quote
KennyR:  ...and all desktop CPUs are FAR too hot and noisy.

I dunno.  My P4 is very quiet, and with the fan spinning at 60%, it never goes above 40 degrees no matter how much I torture it.  Idle temp is 32.

Keep in mind that most CPU coolers assume your case is crap.  If you get a good case with good airflow, you can throttle down the CPU fan a lot and still get decent cooling.  If you run a CPU fan at stock RPM... well, no wonder you're complaining about noise!

I have a genuine 2.4Ghz, by the way.  My dad has a 1.8 overclocked to 2.4, and it produces about the same heat and noise as mine.

Quote
1.8 GHz would do me fine

I work with el-cheapo computers all the time, and those with 3Ghz CPUs still feel like slugs if they have bad hard drives or cheap chipsets.  If you get a good mobo and drive, even a 1.8 will perform well.

Just make sure your mobo has CPU fan speed control.  It's the best way to cut noise.
 

Offline System

Re: IBM Power PC 1GHz chip only runs properly at 933MHz
« Reply #33 on: August 07, 2004, 09:50:33 AM »
Quote
People want fast chips and they're willing to put up with the heat. Give PPC a few years and you'll see the same thing


Take it from me, you damn well WON'T.

PowerPC has to live in embedded markets where there are tight controls on the heat produced by the chips - the G5 is a joke everywhere except supercomputing and Apple boxes (which are one and the same at the moment.. so..) because of it's incredible heat output.

From Freescale soon and when IBM gets their backsides in gear, you'll see multi-GHz PowerPC processors with more than reasonable (10-20W) power consumption for the featureset.

Maybe a little more than the 3W of the 750CXe or the 10W of the 7447A, but nowhere near 150.
 

Offline KennyR

Re: IBM Power PC 1GHz chip only runs properly at 933MHz
« Reply #34 on: August 07, 2004, 03:32:58 PM »
@Waccoon

Quote
Funny to hear all the PPC fanatics herald the cool performance, then throw a Radeon in the case.


Depends on your radeon. If you buy a gamer's radeon, then you're asking for it. But there are better ones. My 9000 has no fan at all: its passively cooled. Along with the fanless G3, and fanless case, it means my Pegasos is absolutely silent except for the PSU. Now, if only I could get a x86 system like that, even if it was seriously underpowered by modern standards! I'm not going to play Doom3 on it anyway. If its fast enough to play a divx it'll do for me.
 

Offline Hammer

Re: IBM Power PC 1GHz chip only runs properly at 933MHz
« Reply #35 on: August 08, 2004, 12:00:42 AM »
@http://www.chipworks.com/chipnews/2002_i02/interconnect_2.htm
Refer to
http://www.appliedmaterials.com/products/copper_interconnect_films.html
Applied Materials Inc's Low-K information/marketing material.
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Offline Hammer

Re: IBM Power PC 1GHz chip only runs properly at 933MHz
« Reply #36 on: August 08, 2004, 12:08:44 AM »
Quote
The VIA CPUs aren't much more powerful than my Cyrix (even at 800MHz!)

Note that both AMD's Geode GX/120x (from Cyrix GX core) and VIA’s C3(from Cyrix M3 core) is based from Cyrix technology.

**Geode NX(PGA Socket A) is based from K7 core (relative of 16W grade Barton uPGA Socket A).
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SSD: 512 GB Samsung 840
 

Offline Hammer

Re: IBM Power PC 1GHz chip only runs properly at 933MHz
« Reply #37 on: August 08, 2004, 12:19:33 AM »
Quote
Scary numbers from the slot CPU era:
http://grassomusic.de/english/amdk7.htm
(In editing for width, I note that Xoops takes poorly to links containing '?' options.)

Refer to
http://myplc.com/sony/docs/amd_processor_reference.html
for volt and amps values.

PS; The table doesn’t include the latest Sempr0n (Socket A), Barton 400FSB (Socket A), Geode NX (Socket A), Thornton (Socket A), 130nm CG stepping K8 and 90nm D0 stepping K8s,
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SSD: 512 GB Samsung 840
 

Offline minator

Re: IBM Power PC 1GHz chip only runs properly at 933MHz
« Reply #38 on: August 11, 2004, 01:37:29 AM »
Quote
and VIA’s C3(from Cyrix M3 core) is based from Cyrix


C3 is a Centaur processor, completely different from the Cyrix stuff which seems to have been pretty much abandoned years ago.

Cyrix were the last "true" CISC x86 CPUs.

All the VIA CPUs now are done by the group which used to be Centaur, they're still fairly autonomous today.
 

Offline Hammer

Re: IBM Power PC 1GHz chip only runs properly at 933MHz
« Reply #39 on: August 11, 2004, 03:23:21 AM »
@minator  

Refer to
http://news.com.com/2009-1040-251312.html?legacy=cnet
http://www.national.com/news/item/0,1735,329,00.html

VIA's early Cyrix III (Joshua, Jedi, Gobi) was based on native x86 Cayenne core. In was later dropped in 2000 in favor of Centaur's WinChip/C5/Samuel. After employing Samuel core, VIA was still using Cyrix III label but this was shorten to just 'C3'. The C3 that I’m referring to is the x86 Cayenne core.

National's Cyrix group(before the buyout by VIA in 1999)has Cyrix MIII (M3, Jalapeno core, Mojave),
It's was an out-of-order, decoupled design (translate x86 to uops) and it has 11 stages.

The usage of "and VIA’s C3(from Cyrix M3 core) is based from Cyrix" statement is for Kenny’s performance/power ratio.

KennyR’s statement about Cyrix PR200’s performance/power ratios can be easly reach by today’s VIA C3 MPU. Using Cyrix PR200 as an example of performance/power ratio reference would be considered to be very poor in the light of AMD's Geode NX/16Watt&35Watt grades K7-AXPs, Intel's Pentium M and VIA's C3(Nehemiah).
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Offline Hammer

Re: IBM Power PC 1GHz chip only runs properly at 933MHz
« Reply #40 on: August 11, 2004, 06:16:47 AM »
Quote
Depends on your radeon. If you buy a gamer's radeon, then you're asking for it. But there are better ones. My 9000 has no fan at all: its passively cooled. Along with the fanless G3, and fanless case, it means my Pegasos is absolutely silent except for the PSU. Now, if only I could get a x86 system like that, even if it was seriously underpowered by modern standards!

You have search for an X86 motherboard that can under-clock and under-volt. Most modern Taiwanese K7-XP boards can over-clock an Athlon XP(only with t-bred/barton cores) and same can be true if one wants to under-clocks them.
AmigaForever 2016 with AmigaOS 4.1 FE, AMIDuOS\'s Android 5.01, MS Windows 10 Pro X64
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RAM: 16 GB PC3-12800 (DDR3-1600)
GPU: AMD Radeon HD 8870M (OC) 2GB GDDR5 VRAM.
SSD: 512 GB Samsung 840
 

Offline minator

Re: IBM Power PC 1GHz chip only runs properly at 933MHz
« Reply #41 on: August 11, 2004, 01:32:13 PM »
Quote
VIA's early Cyrix III (Joshua, Jedi, Gobi) was based on native x86 Cayenne core. In was later dropped in 2000 in favor of Centaur's WinChip/C5/Samuel. After employing Samuel core, VIA was still using Cyrix III label but this was shorten to just 'C3'. The C3 that I’m referring to is the x86 Cayenne core.


I see, so they have 2 completely different CPUs with the same name, and people think the IT industry can be confusing...


I'm referring to the C3 "Ezra", 12 stage, single issue, in-order.