Midgets Go to War: Genesi sues Amiga Inc.

[MarkTime]

This may be a little off topic, and if it is, I apologize but I think its interesting maybe you do too.

Here is a nice recipe for pineapple upside down cake:

1/3 c. butter2/3 c. sugar1 1/2 c. flour1/3 tsp. salt2 eggs, separated2/3 c. water3 tsp. baking powder1 tsp. vanilla
Cream butter, add sugar, beaten egg yolks and vanilla. Add dry ingredients alternately with milk. Lastly add stiffly beaten egg whites. In the pan you will bake the cake in (I use large round skillet) melt 1/2 cup butter and 3/4 cup brown sugar. When melted and syrupy add slices of pineapple with maraschino cherries in the middle. Pour on batter. Bake at 325 degrees for about 35 minutes or until springs back to touch. When done take from oven, turn upside down on serving plate. Serve with whipped cream.

[DaveP]

@lempkee

I dont see that at all. I think perhaps you have
read the comments incorrectly.

[System]

@amigaguy

Guess you've never heard of Lindows.  Microsoft lost against them on very much the case you describe

http://lindows.com/

[AmigaHeretic]

From what I've heard WINE isn't close to being 'Windows Compatible'

Even at Lindows.com they pretty much say it's along way from being Windows compatible.

All quotes form Lindows.com:

"Question: What Microsoft® Windows applications will LindowsOS™ run?
Answer:The quick answer is that LindowsOS™ will not run Microsoft Windows applications at a level of quality we're satisfied with. "

or

"Can LindowsOS run software written for Microsoft® Windows?

Currently, LindowsOS users can Click-N-Run the Microsoft Windows Compatibility Program that allows LindowsOS to somewhat run a limited number of MS Windows compatible software programs."

or

"How well does WINE work in running MS Windows compatible programs?

Even with dozens of developers having contributed thousands of hours and lines of code to WINE, the challenge to run MS Windows compatible programs on Linux is a very big one, and it could be some time yet before WINE is advanced enough to reliably run the most popular MS Windows programs.  WINE continues to make slow progress in running a select group of MS Windows programs, with varying degrees of success as to how well each program will run.  Sometimes programs will "run," but have display problems, can't print, won't work with sound, crash, hang your system, and so on."

There are laws in the U.S.  (or that's what I've heard anyway) to protect people from having there software ripped off .  At least I think it would be pretty unfair for someone to rip off Mac OS and then force Apple to close it doors, but then again I have morals unlike some.

AmigaGuy

[Frodon]

Hello,

"There are laws in the U.S.  (or that's what I've heard anyway) to protect people from having there software ripped off .  At least I think it would be pretty unfair for someone to rip off Mac OS and then force Apple to close it doors, but then again I have morals unlike some."

You clearly misunderstood the case here.
Thendic have a contract about the AmigaDE that allow us to ask a port of the AmigaDE for their products (AFAIK).

According to what I understood, Thendic had asked a port to Amiga Inc for the Pegasos/MorphOS not so far away in the time. I can believe that as I remember Bill Buck to ask people opinion about a MorphOS port of AmigaDE in public (here and/or on ANN).
But it seems that Amiga Inc have refused and so breach the contract they signed with Thendic. That's why they sue them to have this contract respected.

This is justice, nothing more. Business justice yes, but justice anyway.

Regards

[pixie]

> But it seems that Amiga Inc have refused and so breach the
>  contract they signed with Thendic. That's why they sue them
>  to have this contract respected.

If contract is like BH said, they have no chance, if it's only for WinCE how on hell can they impel Amiga to let them port it or make Amiga to port it to MorphOS!???

[AmigaHeretic]

@Frodon

I understand what you are saying and what the topic is about and I agree with you if Ainc did breach their contract.  I was just replying to the off topic thread in here about the questionable legality if MorphOS.

AmigaGuy

[downix]

Poster: amigaguy Date: 2003/2/5 12:36:38

I guess you have to ask yourself, do you think that if Genesi had made an 'Operating System' (Morph XP) that looked and worked exactly like Windows XP and ran all Windows software or an 'Operating System' (Morph Mac) that looked and worked exactly like Mac OS and ran all Mac OS software that a court of law wouldn't think this was infringing on the rights of Microsoft or Apple? I think a court might even side with Microsoft on that. Just because Amiga Inc. is a lot smaller and most people have never heard of Amiga OS doesn't make it anymore legal to do the above. I think there is a reason no other company makes a ?Windows Compatible? OS.

I?m sure some company would love to sell a product for half the price of Windows XP that looks and feels exactly like Windows and runs the entire existing catalog of Microsoft Windows software, but I think they know they would probably have no legal ground to stand on.

Just my take (no I?m not a lawyer)

Amiga Guy

 I am afraid that your thinking is not exactly correct.

In fact, there are other Windows API compatable OS's out there.  There is even a semi-done Mac OS X compatable OS out there.  

Even the Wine project has the clearly stated goal of being a Win32 API replacement.

These projects trying for Windows or Mac API's have one problem, lack of decent and complete documentation on the API's in question.  One MCSE told me once "Windows undocumented API functions could filla  book larger than it's documented ones."

This is not the case of AmigaOS, however.  Commodore supplied very thurough documentation on every major release of the AmigaOS, detailing the API's in every detail.  I own two copies of these documents, purchased on eBay.  This means less guesswork about the API's and more getting down to getting things done.

AROS and MorphOS both utilized these public documents published with Commodore's blessing.  Commodore didn't care, they were protected by patents.

Amiga, Inc doesn't own these patents, however.  Thus, their protection is non-existant, only at the whim of Gateway.

[Madgun68]

According to what I understood, Thendic had asked a port to Amiga Inc for the Pegasos/MorphOS not so far away in the time. I can believe that as I remember Bill Buck to ask people opinion about a MorphOS port of AmigaDE in public (here and/or on ANN).
But it seems that Amiga Inc have refused and so breach the contract they signed with Thendic. That's why they sue them to have this contract respected.

After listening to some of the plans laid out for Morphos, I wonder why anyone would even bother with AmigaDE..  

This is justice, nothing more. Business justice yes, but justice anyway.

Starting to sound like revenge to me.

[AmigaHeretic]

@downix

AROS and MorphOS both utilized these public documents published with Commodore's blessing. Commodore didn't care, they were protected by patents.

Amiga, Inc doesn't own these patents, however. Thus, their protection is non-existant, only at the whim of Gateway.

If patents are still held then MorphOS may indeed be illegal whether legal action is taken or not.  

AmigaGuy

[BouncingAyatollah]

downix said:

If patents are still held then MorphOS may indeed be illegal whether legal action is taken or not.

This is the point. I remember a thread on Moo Bunny ages ago where Ralph Schmidt himself was saying that IP re: AmigaOS source code had been ruled by "that German judge" as being , I guess not technically Amiga's. Unfortunately the thread must have gone beyond Moo Bunny's archive limit as it was available a few weeks back and I can't find reference to it now.

Ralph wouldn't have said that if they didn't use the source code, he would have said "we didn't use the source code" :-)
Similarly bbrv has stated MorphOS being delayed, again there would be no delay if there were no issue.

Point being - the legality MAY have to be resolved, and I guess we'll find out in due time. Crying "it is 100% legal!" or "it is illegal!" when you don't actually know is pointless, if need be we'll find out.

Same with the "breach of contract" issue.

What is worrying is (as I have been saying could happen for many weeks now) that we have obviously entered the stage where litigation is flying. More delays and bitterness on all sides? Ho ho ho!

[AmiGR]

AFAIK, Amiga Inc can very well not port their software but they HAVE to answer within a time
period. They exceeded that period ignoring them.
That's a breach of the contract, as this is written
in it.
That's what I understood.

[Fats]

This is not the case of AmigaOS, however. Commodore supplied very thurough documentation on every major release of the AmigaOS, detailing the API's in every detail. I own two copies of these documents, purchased on eBay. This means less guesswork about the API's and more getting down to getting things done.

AROS and MorphOS both utilized these public documents published with Commodore's blessing. Commodore didn't care, they were protected by patents.

The one thing people seem to forget is that people at Phase5 had access to the Amiga source code and they are working now on the MorphOS source code. This fact puts more the burden on the MorphOS developers to proof they did take precautions that no Amiga source code was used for the competitive product they are developing.

[ksk]

I think the persian gulf is COOLER place to be than the Amiga community nowdays...

[System]

Check this out

Note the date of the patent...
Any comments or remarks?

?

[downix]

Note the date of the patent...

This is not the patent discussed, however.  But it is a very interesting patent, one of the last ones ever created with the Amiga name on it.

Pity it doesn't cover any of the technologies being discussed here, such as right-mouse-button clicks.  I thought this had evolved into a "What does MorphOS do illegally" arguement, which this patent doesn't even touch.

But, it is a very interesting patent, and showed a very advanced concept of computer architecture that would have made AmigaObjects the pride of Gateway.