Amiga, Inc. and Bernd Meyer announce licensing of Amithlon 2.0

[redrumloa]

Sounds nice but I still fear it could be "torpedoed" by a 3rd party  

You blaming Hyperion for H&P's unethical practices?

[Kronos]

You blaming Hyperion for H&P's unethical practices?

Sorry red, but could it be that you just had one of your
"1 man, 1 bar and 50$"-nights  ;-)

I was not talking about the bad-mouthing that has been done by Ben
in the past, but about what could come in the near future.

Given this statement H&P are now a possible 3rd-party-trouble-source
when it comes to Amithlon.

[whabang]

What's this about 50$ for one person in a bar thing?

I could easily spend the double in a few hours without even getting drunk!

[redrumloa]

I could easily spend the double in a few hours without even getting drunk!

Be carefull, Kronos will tell you that Swedish people shouldn't be allowed to procreate.

[Kronos]

Be carefull, Kronos will tell you that Swedish people shouldn't be allowed to procreate

Nah, don't you know what insane taxes they put on "strong drinks"
in Scandinavia ?
Even I could diggest that much (if I'll concentrate ob that "Dom Perignon").

[redrumloa]

Nah, don't you know what insane taxes they put on "strong drinks"
in Scandinavia ?
Even I could diggest that much (if I'll concentrate ob that "Dom Perignon").

How much do you think a stiff drink costs here in the states at a respectable establishment? Oh that's right were all just rednecks drinking $1 beers in a can at a local hell hole. :roll:

[whabang]

Looking at Denmark across the sea ( 4.5 Km / 3 miles ). Ahh... the promised land in the west!
:-D :-D :-D

I could always make a nice lil' phone call and get five litres of pure booze for 40$. That is enough to make an elephant feel dizzy!
 :-P

Cheers! :pint:

[DaveP]

Kronos, why dont you just apologise to Red and be done with it. It sounds to me like you *know* you shouldnt have got so personal on the other thread and making a joke out of it doesnt seem to be working IMHO.

On topic I seriously doubt that Amithlon will need to be torpedoed because it will only support AOS3.9 and potentially 5.x. The intervening increments are PPC only.

Seeing conspiracy theories everywhere does nothing more than give people like cheesegrate an excuse to live.

Dave.

[bhoggett]

On topic I seriously doubt that Amithlon will need to be torpedoed because it will only support AOS3.9 and potentially 5.x. The intervening increments are PPC only.

Torpedoed? If it was going to be torpedoed, Amiga Inc weren't going to get a better chance than this, right? As they obviously have not done it, I don't think the subject is worth discussing any more.

(However, Kronos was suggesting H&P might try and torpedo it themselves, now that they can no longer profit from it directly)

As for the rest, I think Amithlon will go off at a tangent regarding its OS anyway. In the extremely unlikely event that OS5 should actually become more than utter vapour, it wouldn't require Amithlon anyway, and in truth AmigaOS itself is now permanently and irreversably committed to a PPC only future.

The only way that Amithlon will evolve is to slowly replace AmigaOS code with x86 equivalents, possibly by adapting AROS technology. Only time will tell if any of that will happen, but let's face it, no one's future is guaranteed in the Amiga scene.

[DaveP]

Well exactly. But Kronos did say:

I was not talking about the bad-mouthing that has been done by Ben
in the past, but about what could come in the near future.

Which suggests that at the back of his mind was Hyperion and not H+P as well as Bens "not on x86" stance.

Sure 5.x is utter vapour etc etc but then so is Amithlon s future plans. I dont see anything technologically that sayes that AmigaOS's future is irreversably tied to PPC. Perhaps you could elaborate further on that point.

Dave.

[bhoggett]

Which suggests that at the back of his mind was Hyperion and not H+P as well as Bens "not on x86" stance.

Well, I can't argue with what it sounds like, but having exchanged a few mails with kronos recently, I know he is far more concerned with what H&P might do than what Ben might do.

After all, the contract between Amiga and Bernie is signed, hardcopies have been exchanged, and I don't see what Ben Hermans would have to do with it. The contract is basically nothing more than a licensing deal. It doesn't give Amiga any say in the future direction of Amithlon at all.

Sure 5.x is utter vapour etc etc but then so is Amithlon s future plans.

Yes, but Amithlon itself is not vapour, whereas the whole entity described as OS5 is just that. There is a difference.

I dont see anything technologically that sayes that AmigaOS's future is irreversably tied to PPC. Perhaps you could elaborate further on that point.

Don't think in purely technology terms, think in practical ones. One of the reasons given why PPC is the right move now is that it will be able to stay compatible with all the PPC-only software already developed. How much more will that factor grow over a few years of a PPC-only AmigaOS? What will be the point to switching to a completely new OS, or supporting a completely different CPU base, when so many companies are being asked to invest in a PPC-only route?  The whole idea of committing to PPC for just a while is completely unworkable. You don't invest all that money and time in a temporary solution. The future of AmigaOS is now wholly dependent on the success of the PPC platform. The decision has been made. There will be no x86 get out clauses on this one. If the PPC hardware route proves a financial disaster, AmigaOS will go down with it. Nothing is surer.

[DaveP]

Amithlon exists
AmigaOS exists
Intent exists
The so called HAL layer in AOS4 exists

Amithlon 3.x does not exist
AOS5.x does not exist

How is one more vapour than the other? The technological foundations for a future exist in component form the work has not been done for either "future" directions that may or may not exist.

Therefore anything not released or near to release is vapourware. The foundations might NOT be vapourware ergo Amithlons future is as vapourous as AOS5.x.

QED.

As for the rest I see business imperatives that would make it more attractive NOT to develop for x86 ( well IA64 because if we have the timescales correct IA32 doesnt have a long term future ).

However, businesses and marketplaces do not stay the same - they shift quite quickly and while we might not be able to see an architecture agnostic future based on the Hogget Crystal Ball if nothing technlogically is done to technically exclude an agnostic future there is no practical reason ( yours included ) why given sufficient business imperative ( and thats what it should be based on ) there should not be an AOS that runs seamlessly on x86 in the future.

Ive seen too much in the market change in short periods of time to be as absolutist as you are on the issue.

Dave.

[bhoggett]

Dave, have I mentioned Amithlon 3.x?

Have I said what will happen on Amithlon?

OS5, OTOH, is being touted all over the place.

As for the absolutist view, I prefer to regard it as the realist view.  When presented with the most likely scenario against a possible but highly unlikely one, I'm afraid I'm not going to bet my house on the latter.

You, on the other hard, are free to do as you wish.

[DaveP]

Thats just my point both of those are what "might" happen,
roadmaps might be published for one or another ( 3.x was hypothetical btw )
but it makes them no more or no less vapourware until someone or some people
make serious inroads into them as a product.

I wouldnt bet my house on it and I wouldnt bet my house on it
not coming to fruition.

Frankly I dont care because AmigaOS is currently smaller than a
proverbial minnow and its direction is totally up to the existing
marketplace and any new marketplace that can be defined.

I also want to see AOS as something I can put on an LPAR on a
z800 box but until its happening Im not going to sit here and cry about
it.

Taking the PPC route does not prohibit ( or "rule out" ) any other
hardware platforms being adopted in the future - it just means
they have been ruled out for now.

Big deal.

Dave.

[Kronos]

On topic I seriously doubt that Amithlon will need to be torpedoed because it will only support AOS3.9 and potentially 5.x. The intervening increments are PPC only

From my 1st posting:

Given this statement H&P are now a possible 3rd-party-trouble-source

I don't think it will end with "nice" messages like this:

Drty Harry XXI

But I'm also sure that Ben will restart his campaign in the very minute
he recognzes that people who were waiting for OS are getting the
new Amithlon and are so pleased with it that they won't buy an A1
afterwards.

why dont you just apologise to Red

 :-o  :-o  :-o

I still think it was easy to see that this was intendet as a "nice" pun,
and I also got the feeling that Red did see it as just that ( I can take
a few punches myself). However this is for Red to decide.
@Red: Just drop a word and I will slow down a bit...
Well lets say I'll try .. ;-)

[DaveP]

Well, I agree with Hyperion that there is no realistic business case for AmigaOS to exist in the short on x86 with a future until the Linux/Windows situation has played its way out and the applications software on AOS starts to come together.

Starting where only MacOS(consumer), Linux(not exactly popular) and AIX (high end) are the competition is a good thing in my opinion.

Depending on what happens with the hardware platforms and the operating systems over the coming year this is bound to be even more or less of the case.