Executive Update - Amiga Status Announcement

[Chathurawind]

This  is like Apple now...

[Seehund]

jd997uk,

If people are complaining about the existence of QA and certifications, then fine, maybe they are eejit trolls. Certification is A Good Thing, but not when it's compulsory and works against the user.

However, most of the more sane people complaining do so because of the exclusive and compulsory bonding of AmigaOS to approved hardware and dealers.

I want to buy any hardware I want from whomever I want with or without whatever OS I want whenever I want.

It's interesting to see the A1-G3SE board being approved, when what eventually will be offered is a completely different product from what was originally offered and officially "Amiga One" certified. There still are no final consumer/production A1G3-SE boards in existence (not offered by Eyetech and labelled A1-G3SE anyways), yet they are listed as certified hardware.
Amiga Inc. are also "in negotiation" with possible manufacturers of other hypothetical hardware (Elbox, Matay, Merlancia) which may or may not ever have been in the same room as a beta copy of AmigaOS4.
But where is the Pegasos? Oh yes, that's right,  you have to bundle every single motherboard/computer you sell with a copy of AmigaOS4!
Hardware manufacturer "X" might once have been looking forward to get a "Amiga Certified" sticker on their "Y" PPC rack server ("great, we just got an expanded market, hello Amigans"), but now that sticker is something to avoid because they wouldn't want to bundle AmigaOS and raise the price by $100. That is unless they decide to produce a separate, smaller and more expensive batch of "Amiga Compatible" hardware. Are you already owning and using PPC hardware which could be AmigaOS compatible? Tough luck, you've got to wait until it's certified by Amiga Inc. and then you've got to buy a second machine with the OS bundled.

And some people complain over that it's hard to find a PC without a Microsoft OS bundled... At least they still have the choice to build their own computers.

The AmigaOS BIOS extension idea is idiotic to begin with, and it sinks to comatose levels with this compulsory OS/hardware bundling.

Hey, Amiga Inc. The 1980's and Apple are on the phone. They want their marketing ideas back.

[Chathurawind]

This bundling crap is nonsense. When was it ever that you couldn't buy an AmigaOS without hardware? I know for a fact that flavors of OS3.0/3.1 sold bundled with ROMs for A500-2000's and 1200/4000's... Only selling the OS with hardware is going to kill it. Everytime we upgrade we are going to have to buy a new license?  :-? So I buy a first gen A1, along with OS4...then I want to upgrade, I can't take my ROM from the first gen to the second and use my OS CD's again? What a load. Way to go Amiga, lock into proprietary hardware again. :-(

[jd997uk]

I think there is no agreement with bplan and that's why it is not listed.

The message here is that as you say, you will need an official Amiga ROM to run OS4. So, for the A1G3SE, it'll have it's BIOS 'flashed' with extensions to enable it, and I suppose for Cyberstorm/Blizzard PPC owners, the OS will need the 3.1 ROMs to boot. No big deal really, although many will make a big issue out of it.
BPlan, at this time do not appear to have contacted Amiga Inc with any regard as to running OS4 on the Pegasos. Fair enough, that's their perogative.
All that Amiga Inc have done is to re-iterate their statement that ONLY Amiga approved HW can legally run Amiga OS, whether natively, or through emulation. Anyone out ther who's going to buy a Pegasos might want to ask BPlan the question on OS4 compatability. If enough people ask, they might actually approach Amiga Inc and enter into an agreement - who knows?

-john

ps. do not take this as an anti BPlan/MorphOS rant, I've no reason to have any issues against either of them. But it *appears* that they are a single entity (ie they are joined at the hip), so, since the HW has it's own OS, there would not be a reason for BPlan to bother entering an agreement with Amiga Inc for an official OS4 port.

[jd997uk]

This bundling crap is nonsense. When was it ever that you couldn't buy an AmigaOS without hardware? I know for a fact that flavors of OS3.0/3.1 sold bundled with ROMs for A500-2000's and 1200/4000's... Only selling the OS with hardware is going to kill it. Everytime we upgrade we are going to have to buy a new license?  So I buy a first gen A1, along with OS4...then I want to upgrade, I can't take my ROM from the first gen to the second and use my OS CD's again? What a load. Way to go Amiga, lock into proprietary hardware again.

Eh? What bundling ? If you want to buy an A1G3SE without OS4, go ahead. All that's going to happen is that any officially endorsed product will be *enabled* to run OS4.x
So if you upgrade to (say) a G4 board that has been endorsed, there's no reason for the OS not to work.
Sheesh, some people.

-john

[Kronos]

If you want to buy an A1G3SE without OS4, go ahead. All that's going to happen is that any officially endorsed product will be *enabled* to run OS4.x

Every HW with the "enable AOS4 ROM" will have to be bundled with
AOS4 and a licence is to be paid.

If Joe-MOS buys a Pegasos this summer he doesn't want to pay AInc.
If  by the end of the year he decides that AOS4 is the better choice he
won't be able to buy it for his Pegasos.

So yes AInc is going the Apple road.
BPlan/MOS seem to go it too.

This way the community will be splitted and its very likely both sides
will fail.

[Chathurawind]

Perhaps AMIGA Inc should explain:

What if a user want to buy AMIGA ONE motherboard just for running Linux, without buying AMIGA OS and AMIGA ROM?  Is this possible?

If the user want to try AMIGA OS later, can the user buy the latest version of AMIGA OS (with AMIGA ROM)?

[Ivan]

Oddly enough i bought AmigaOS 3.1 with, believe
it or not, a ROM CHIP!!! Yes! Really a ROM! It
plugged right in! I couldnt believe it!

Here comes the pirates flames.. Awe i can't pirate
a copy of OS4 from some anon ftp for my system and
have it run anymore. Damn, them greedy bastards.
It almost sounds like Brecht over at Ann.lu...
WHAT? FIRST NO 486 OS AND NOW I HAVE TO BUY IT!?
NO WAY!! THATS SO UNFAIR!!!

I only have one thing to say, suffer. And please
suffer in public with many flames and a great deal
of whineing so i can enjoy it all the more.

Everyone who owns PPC Amiga's are going to have OS4.
Anyone who buys a AmigaOne or future incarnations
will have OS4 and be able to run future versions of
the OS. The only ones i see here not gaining
anything is the bPlan group who sadly are being
held back by Ralph Schmidt who won't allow OS4 on
Pegasos because he wants to own and control the
whole show. Hard luck.

Sorry for the Pegasos system. Really. I kind of
liked it and it was on my "might buy one" list. No
longer. AmigaOne is the system i'm buying period.
It seems they blew it by not coming to terms with
Ainc.

Oh btw, this dosnt stop Ainc from bundling a CD
with a ROM to run OS4 that future Pegasos owners
can't purchase. But, you WILL have to pay for the
OS. Tough life aint it? No OS4 without buying it.
My heart bleeds. (no it really dosen't)

[KennyR]

AInc are becoming a real business and not just some little pseudo-amateur setup. First they eliminate the threat that XL posed, now they're doing the same to the pegasos. Well, thats just the way big business works. You have to be ruthless.

In my opinion, this move has just killed the pegasos project. There were many who liked the look of the pegasos hardware but wanted OS4 who will now have to buy A1 or Shark hardware. As for the actual future of the PegasOS (OS) - ah, well figure it out yourself. There aren't enough existing Amiga users to support the current market, so I don't see how less than a third of this market could survive on its own. Looks like there is a reason for RS's vicious paranoia after all.

Remember, this is my opinion and not the truth. Feel free to believe it or not, or try to convince me otherwise with good evidence. Flames from anonymous users will simply be ignored. Or made fun of. Preferably the latter. ;-)

[Kronos]

Hi Ivan

Its not about buying AOS4 but about paying a licence on HW that has nothing
to do with AInc. The price for a full AOS4 on CSPPC is ~100Euro according
to Vesalia. That price would be fair for the Pegasos-version.

AInc didn't help developing the Pegasos and they didn't help the
Taiwanese developing the TeronCX/Agimmesomenumbers.

Eyetech decided to sell their product under the AOne name and therefore
have to pay $xxx to AInc.

BPlan decided to sell their board mainly to industrial costumers and a few
Amiga-fans. They don't want/need the AOne-name so why should they pay?

[Kronos]

so I don't see how less than a third of this market could survive on its own

So you really think it would be more than 33% of the current user-base
 that gone buy a A1/AOS4 ?

I think you are in for a suprise.

[Chathurawind]

Yes, you will be able to buy a linux-only (actually non Amiga OS) board, and subsequently buy the OS4+ROM upgrade package.

The upgraded ROM will still have all its open firmware code intact so you will still be able to run Linux etc

Alan

Eyetech

[Rodney]

This, to me, is a very straight forward press release. If you want to have Amiga approval, you have to apply for it.
Typical really, that in 'our' community, it has to be turned into such a big issue. One minute, Amiga isn't (allegedly) interested in the desktop any more, then, as soon as they try to protect it via a minimal amount of quality control, all the ejit trolls come marching outa their caves claiming all sorts of nonsense, PAH! (if you don't know what I'm on about, go and look at the thread over at ann.lu - actually, second thoughts, don't bother).
Anyone with at least half a brain, would see that ANY company, in ANY industry, has to maintain a quality control system, whether it's through 1st party (their own), or 3rd party (anyone associated) products. Anyone in the UK or Europe who's had to suffer the ISO9002 stuff, would KNOW what approval systems are all about. This is a walk in the park in comparison.
There's no hidden agenda here, if you go to Amiga with a solid business plan, an approveable product, it ain't gonna be hard to get an 'Amiga Approved' stamped on your resume. All this is mainly about protecting YOU, the consumer.
After all, what would you prefer: buying a product from an established RELIABLE company, or an 'allegedly' compatable product, from some back street merchant? The choice is yours.

-john

I also feel this is a good idea. When AmigaOS comes out with some server type OS or one that is aim at the corporate enterprise, quality assurance is going to be a big thing. Companies are going to want the performance of their systems garenteed, and i think they are now waking up to this. Or, atleast they will when they realise they can get these garrentees with AmigaOS.

This isnt going to restrict the distribtution of AmigaOS. Although It seems to me that it may now, be hard to run AmigaOS on the same hardware that Macs run on, being they both need ROMs now, right? And if other Operating Systems take a similar approach it may make it hard to duel boot!

MS are big on trying to keep buggers from copying their stuff, i would not be surprised if MS was to do soemthing like this. Im surprised they havnt already!

Anyway, i dont believe its all doom and gloom. Its still cheap hardware and the hardware is still very well documented and understood. This also wont stop the porting of other OSes to the hardware.

[Rodney]

Perhaps AMIGA Inc should explain:

What if a user want to buy AMIGA ONE motherboard just for running Linux, without buying AMIGA OS and AMIGA ROM? Is this possible?

If the user want to try AMIGA OS later, can the user buy the latest version of AMIGA OS (with AMIGA ROM)?

Eyetech are an entirly different entity to Amiga Inc. The AmigaOne is not Amiga Inc's board. It is Eyetechs board. They sell it to anyone , however they want!!!

If you want a board that doesnt run OS4, then get a board!!! Eyetech just wont fit it with the AmigaROM! This just means you wont be able to run AmigaOS4!!!

[Coder]

Eyetech are an entirly different entity to Amiga Inc. The AmigaOne is not Amiga Inc's board. It is Eyetechs board. They sell it to anyone , however they want!!!

I agree with Rodney. If we want the board only for Linux we can.

Coder

[Rodney]

AInc are becoming a real business and not just some little pseudo-amateur setup. First they eliminate the threat that XL posed, now they're doing the same to the pegasos. Well, thats just the way big business works. You have to be ruthless.

In my opinion, this move has just killed the pegasos project. There were many who liked the look of the pegasos hardware but wanted OS4 who will now have to buy A1 or Shark hardware. As for the actual future of the PegasOS (OS) - ah, well figure it out yourself. There aren't enough existing Amiga users to support the current market, so I don't see how less than a third of this market could survive on its own. Looks like there is a reason for RS's vicious paranoia after all.

Remember, this is my opinion and not the truth. Feel free to believe it or not, or try to convince me otherwise with good evidence. Flames from anonymous users will simply be ignored. Or made fun of. Preferably the latter.  

Thats a very good point! - Anyone who was planing on getting a pegasos to run AmigaOS4 will either, seperate themselfs from AmigaOS and stay with MorphOS or get the A1 and stay with AmigaOS.

On the other hand, i believe that AmigaOS will be bundled with a ROM. If this ROM could fit into a pegasos, well, those pegasos loving people might still have a change to play with AmigaOS.

Anyhow, some of this does sound a bit dodgy, but im sure this is the way companys like AInc and MS are goign tohave to go, pirating is getting way out of hand, infact, has been for a long long time. Its pretty much what killed the Amiga (i cant count how many games/utilities/apps we had copied :})