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Offline trilobyteTopic starter

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FS: 2 x GVP-M TekMagic 2060 boards
« on: April 17, 2009, 03:58:18 PM »
Hi,

Please, I want these out of my life.

2 x GVP-m / TekMagic 2060 boards for A2000.  Bought new in '98.  Thought I'd upgrade my A2000 and take it to college with me.  That decision would leave me altered forever.

The first board I could never get to work correctly.  It could have been SO MANY DIFFERENT THINGS I was doing wrong that I don't, to this day, know if it was the board, or me, or the RAM, or my Amiga, or my power supply, or my incorrect combination of ECS/OCS chips on my motherboard, or the GVP-m Jeff Boyer 68060 libraries, or lack thereof... so many different things go into the setup of these boards that I just want them out of my life!

Anyway, that first board didn't get working for me, I was skipping classes at college, and the retailer (Dimensions, IIRC) sent me another board.  Something happened (did I trade my 64 MB SIMM for two 8 MB SIMMs?) and the board started working more reliably!  ...so long as I did not shift my Amiga at all.  The board did not sit in the CPU slot very well.

All in all I decided I needed a PowerMac to get my homework done without having to fiddle with hardware, I dropped out of college, and two years later bought a 4000T, which despite some time without a functioning power supply has been a great machine (knock on wood).

My experiment this week was to get another A2000 going with these TekMagic boards and I have decided I am too old for this nonsense.  The '2000 is going to stick with its GVP Combo '040 and I am going to sell you these TekMagic boards.  Please, meet my ex-girlfriends... :-P

Should I put them on eBay or AmiBay or what?  Do you want them both?  One has a slightly broken external SCSI connector.  

I can throw in some RAM.  Whether you can get the RAM to work or not is your problem!

Thanks
tim

 
Amiga user since \'96, when I could finally afford one
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Offline jkonstan

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Re: FS: 2 x GVP-M TekMagic 2060 boards
« Reply #1 on: April 17, 2009, 04:11:30 PM »
PMail Sent ..
 

Offline terminator4

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Re: FS: 2 x GVP-M TekMagic 2060 boards
« Reply #2 on: April 17, 2009, 09:09:02 PM »
pm send.
 

Offline OSS542

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Re: FS: 2 x GVP-M TekMagic 2060 boards
« Reply #3 on: April 18, 2009, 03:22:27 AM »
I'd be interested I think....how much would you want for them   both ?
 

Offline terminator4

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Re: FS: 2 x GVP-M TekMagic 2060 boards
« Reply #4 on: April 18, 2009, 04:12:28 AM »
What do you mean by:
"he first board I could never get to work correctly"
Photos would be nice.
 

Offline trilobyteTopic starter

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Re: FS: 2 x GVP-M TekMagic 2060 boards
« Reply #5 on: April 18, 2009, 05:38:09 PM »
Quote

OSS542 wrote:
I'd be interested I think....how much would you want for them   both ?


I am looking for $275 for one or $425 for both.  

Also I would consider some items for some trade equity, such as GVP SIMMs, a One Stop Music Shop board, an A600, a Live! board from A-Squared, uhmm... a Toccata board :)

- tim
Amiga user since \'96, when I could finally afford one
Commodore 8-bit since before I could tie my shoes
 

Offline trilobyteTopic starter

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Re: FS: 2 x GVP-M TekMagic 2060 boards
« Reply #6 on: April 18, 2009, 05:46:37 PM »
Quote

terminator4 wrote:
What do you mean by:
"he first board I could never get to work correctly"
Photos would be nice.


Well it's complicated.  I never was able to get the first board working 100% on my first try.  The problems are my fault though:  I was trying to use a single 64MB SIMM, and surely had the jumpers wrong.  I got little-to-no support from Michael at GVP-m.  The 68060 libraries included with the board are crap and don't work with a lot of software.  (plus, I was 18 years old, ignorant, and trying to start my freshman year of college!)

The second board I did get working, but by that time I had other RAM to use with it, had the jumpers correctly set, and began to use Carsten Schlote's 68060 libraries.  Eventually I used the Phase5 libraries and had even more success.

By this time I had some success and more of an idea of what it took to get the boards working, so I took the "spare" board and put it in a rev 4.2/4.3 mobo and used it with my Toaster.  It worked OK but that machine only has OS 2.04 so it wasn't the best environment for an '060.

Look up the "Unofficial" support pages for these boards and see what some users have had to do to get them working.  They are *BLAZING* fast, especially with the right RAM configuration, but it takes some work to get them set up.  For me, the variables are too many, and my "need for speed" is not strong anymore since I have my 4000T w/060...   also I am trying to get this system going "from scratch" with a base 3.1 setup, and not go to 3.5bb2 which is the latest OS I legally own, which means I can't use my already-set-up partition from my old dead Quantum Fireball SCSI drive... and I haven't got the time or patience to get all the patches, libs, etc., going, to use 3.1 with an '060 in a '2000.  I'd rather just stick with the Combo 040 which works well.  3.5bb2 really makes this board easier to use...

I will certainly put up some pictures today... I wouldn't expect anyone to buy these without pictures anyway  :-P    Just sorta getting the feelers out first... and there's been enough interest that it is now definitely time to get some pictures up.

/edit:  these boards should be considered "working", just whether you are going to be able to get them working in your configuration is really a test of your own cajones.  One of them I did use for many years in my primary Amiga and the only trouble it gave me was after I moved the computer... I would usually have to take the machine apart and reseat the board.

thanks
tim

Amiga user since \'96, when I could finally afford one
Commodore 8-bit since before I could tie my shoes
 

Offline trilobyteTopic starter

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Re: FS: 2 x GVP-M TekMagic 2060 boards
« Reply #7 on: April 18, 2009, 06:28:44 PM »
the boards in context with my girlfriend's dog and the a2000:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/settlement/3452505369/" title="amigas and jack by settlement, on Flickr">http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3578/3452505369_c9c9bf2a92.jpg" width="500" height="375" alt="amigas and jack" />

the boards themselves:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/settlement/3453318860/" title="tekmagic 2060 boards by settlement, on Flickr">http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3614/3453318860_07c0eec253.jpg" width="500" height="375" alt="tekmagic 2060 boards" />

now i suppose you probably want me to take a shot of a screen with the tekmagics in the a2000 with the output of showconfig even though (1) showconfig in OS 3.1 only goes up to an '040 and (2) i happily have the gvp combo board in this a2000 and disassembling it again would make me very unhappy   :evil:     :boohoo:

thank you
tim
Amiga user since \'96, when I could finally afford one
Commodore 8-bit since before I could tie my shoes
 

Offline trilobyteTopic starter

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Re: FS: 2 x GVP-M TekMagic 2060 boards
« Reply #8 on: April 18, 2009, 06:38:44 PM »
SCSI connector on the original board.  this broke within days of me having it and was part of the reason they sent me another one.  in 1998.

if i recall, the connector still *works*, but i suppose there would be a chance of some cross-conductance happening!

http://www.flickr.com/photos/settlement/3452546687/" title="tekmagic 2060 scsi by settlement, on Flickr">http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3375/3452546687_fc81855ce0.jpg" width="500" height="375" alt="tekmagic 2060 scsi" />

Amiga user since \'96, when I could finally afford one
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Offline X-ray

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Re: FS: 2 x GVP-M TekMagic 2060 boards
« Reply #9 on: April 19, 2009, 09:33:00 AM »
"...edit: these boards should be considered "working", just whether you are going to be able to get them working in your configuration is really a test of your own cajones..."
----------------------------------------------------------

Well, one is considered working and the other has to be sold as-is, because you've never had it working.
 

Offline trilobyteTopic starter

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Re: FS: 2 x GVP-M TekMagic 2060 boards
« Reply #10 on: April 19, 2009, 05:04:53 PM »
Quote

X-ray wrote:
"...edit: these boards should be considered "working", just whether you are going to be able to get them working in your configuration is really a test of your own cajones..."
----------------------------------------------------------

Well, one is considered working and the other has to be sold as-is, because you've never had it working.


Yes, I did have it working, in a rev 4.3 motherboard A2000.  Also it works to a point in this A2000 but the system is not as stable as with the other board.  That could be, though, because I had (a) a bad hard drive and (b) the wrong 68060 lib installed.  I didn't discover (b) until I put in the other board for testing.

I suppose calling the second board "as-is" is not a bad call, but to say it's not working is not entirely correct either.

- t
Amiga user since \'96, when I could finally afford one
Commodore 8-bit since before I could tie my shoes
 

Offline Damion

Re: FS: 2 x GVP-M TekMagic 2060 boards
« Reply #11 on: April 19, 2009, 07:39:08 PM »
Quote
The first board I could never get to work correctly. It could have been SO MANY DIFFERENT THINGS I was doing wrong that I don't, to this day, know if it was the board, or me, or the RAM, or my Amiga, or my power supply, or my incorrect combination of ECS/OCS chips on my motherboard, or the GVP-m Jeff Boyer 68060 libraries, or lack thereof... so many different things go into the setup of these boards that I just want them out of my life!



These boards seem to be a bit fussy.

I spent a large amount of time, and did various things to get mine relatively stable (software wasn't a problem for me).  Only issue left is that certain WHDLoad games crap out in a predictable/repeatable way after about 30 minutes of operation. If I shoot the bottom FPGA on the card with some component cooler, it will run a while before getting flaky again. :roll: I'm going to contact GVP-M about the possibility of getting a replacement chip, but I'm not really expecting anything.

I think it can be a solid card if you get a good one, have a *lot* of spare time to fiddle, and have a motherboard it likes.

 
 

Offline trilobyteTopic starter

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Re: FS: 2 x GVP-M TekMagic 2060 boards
« Reply #12 on: April 20, 2009, 03:46:14 PM »
Quote

These boards seem to be a bit fussy.

I spent a large amount of time, and did various things to get mine relatively stable (software wasn't a problem for me).  Only issue left is that certain WHDLoad games crap out in a predictable/repeatable way after about 30 minutes of operation. If I shoot the bottom FPGA on the card with some component cooler, it will run a while before getting flaky again. :roll: I'm going to contact GVP-M about the possibility of getting a replacement chip, but I'm not really expecting anything.

I think it can be a solid card if you get a good one, have a *lot* of spare time to fiddle, and have a motherboard it likes.

 


Agreed.  As I just sent in a PM, I just got the boards working by disabling Burst Mode ... turning JR1 off.  It's a bummer, because it reduces memory bandwidth by 1/2.  I wonder if this is what you're running into, because that FPGA is probably the one mentioned on this page:

http://s.guillard.free.fr/GForce/GVP-m.htm

Do you have Burst Mode enabled?  Have you tried without?  Very interesting that by cooling the FPGA you can get it to perform again.

I just noticed on my more-used board that the jumper for "ROM Type" was missing, and I really have *no idea* how long it has been missing... I replaced it to match the other board, so maybe that will help with stability (yeah right)

Also I noticed that the ROM remapper on the original TekMagic disk claims to not only remap Kickstart ROM, but also do a "datacachefix"... which I wonder -- could this be the same data cache fix which is mentioned as being a problem on earlier 68060s, in the documentation for the Phase5 util "cpu060"?  I wonder if these TekMagic board are subject to this 68060 flaw, and running the TekMagic ROM remapper actually fixes it, as would running cpu060 with "NOSTOREBYPASS"... as it says in Cpu060.doc:

"o NOSTOREBYPASS
  Some old 060 bugs can be "fixed" by using this arg."

anyway, this has turned into a ramble.  I'm sorry.

-t
Amiga user since \'96, when I could finally afford one
Commodore 8-bit since before I could tie my shoes
 

Offline Damion

Re: FS: 2 x GVP-M TekMagic 2060 boards
« Reply #13 on: April 21, 2009, 06:52:06 PM »
On the software end, I suggest using Thor's mmulib package. The processor library works fantastic with the TekMagic, and then you have a nice set of tools that all work together... you can do away with the supplied software entirely. (For example, I use mufastrom instead of ksremap, and mumaprom for testing kickstart images before burning.)

On the hardware side of things I've had a lot of problems.

First of all, lots of random lockups and freezes not attributable to software. My "BigFoot" PSU was full of cheap quality (and 10 years old) JPCon capacitors, so those were all replaced.

This helped significantly, but I was still encountering periodic freezes while the WB blanker was running. Same symptoms I encounter on accelerated A600/A1200's when the caps have failed. (Funny side note -- "blanker" seems to be a good hardware test, as my TekMagic would easily fly through hours of CPU intensive benchmarks (like AmigaMark), yet lock after 15 minutes of blanker, LOL.) I replaced all motherboard caps, afterward, no more freezing.

Third hardware related problem. :) After 30 minutes or so, some WHDLoad games exit back to WB, returning similar errors. Pinball Dreams in particular - just let a table run, and eventually it quits to WB, more frequently as the machine warms, until it exits almost immediately. This was directly related to the +5v rail and the lower FPGA on the TekMagic.

4.95v - Pinball crashes almost immediately, warm or cold. WB is stable for hours.

5.0v - From cold, Pinball runs for 30 minutes before the errors become more and more frequent. Cool the FPGA (cooler spray), and the errors disappear for 15 minutes or so. Point a huge fan at the FPGA, and no problems at all.

At 5.15v, and a large sink on the FPGA, the errors are almost eliminated. Solder joints are all fine, and the chip barely gets warm, so it seems to be some sort of flaky component. :/ I'm confident that another small voltage increase would solve it completely, but then the unregulated +12v line becomes a little too high for my liking.

On the plus side, GVP has offered to replace both FPGAs, though I'll need to send in the card since they require programing on the board. Waiting to hear details, but I'm happy it's able to be fixed. :)

Quote
Do you have Burst Mode enabled?


I do, and I don't recall a difference with it off, but I haven't tried disabling it recently. I'll give it a shot and let you know if it makes any difference.
 

Offline trilobyteTopic starter

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Re: FS: 2 x GVP-M TekMagic 2060 boards
« Reply #14 on: April 23, 2009, 10:08:23 PM »
Quote

-D- wrote:
On the software end, I suggest using Thor's mmulib package. The processor library works fantastic with the TekMagic, and then you have a nice set of tools that all work together... you can do away with the supplied software entirely. (For example, I use mufastrom instead of ksremap, and mumaprom for testing kickstart images before burning.)


I've been using the Phase5 software with great results, because I was scared of some possible conflicts with MuLib and Picasso96.  One thing I guess that needs to be looked out for is that some 68060 libraries will enable the FPU/MMU on 68EC060 chips, even if they are not supposed to be enabled (hence the EC designation).  Both of my TekMagic boards have XC68EC060RC60 chips on them, so I'm not sure how reliable the FPU/MMU could be on either.

Quote

On the hardware side of things I've had a lot of problems.

First of all, lots of random lockups and freezes not attributable to software. My "BigFoot" PSU was full of cheap quality (and 10 years old) JPCon capacitors, so those were all replaced.


Wish I could do that with my A2000 PSUs too... but I'm not an electronics guy :(

Quote

This helped significantly, but I was still encountering periodic freezes while the WB blanker was running. Same symptoms I encounter on accelerated A600/A1200's when the caps have failed. (Funny side note -- "blanker" seems to be a good hardware test, as my TekMagic would easily fly through hours of CPU intensive benchmarks (like AmigaMark), yet lock after 15 minutes of blanker, LOL.) I replaced all motherboard caps, afterward, no more freezing.

Third hardware related problem. :) After 30 minutes or so, some WHDLoad games exit back to WB, returning similar errors. Pinball Dreams in particular - just let a table run, and eventually it quits to WB, more frequently as the machine warms, until it exits almost immediately. This was directly related to the +5v rail and the lower FPGA on the TekMagic.


I'm amazed at the lengths you've gone to.  Far beyond anything I've done.  Thanks for sharing.  Sounds like you've definitely narrowed down the problem.  

Quote
On the plus side, GVP has offered to replace both FPGAs, though I'll need to send in the card since they require programing on the board. Waiting to hear details, but I'm happy it's able to be fixed. :)


I'm surprised GVP is still servicing these boards.  That's good news.

Quote
Quote
Do you have Burst Mode enabled?


I do, and I don't recall a difference with it off, but I haven't tried disabling it recently. I'll give it a shot and let you know if it makes any difference.


Since according to that webpage, the FPGA is what controls burst mode, and you have narrowed down your problems to that FPGA, I wonder still what will happen if you disable burst mode (JR1) altogether.

I found the following, while I was testing out these boards again after starting this thread (though I had sort of promised myself I was done with them
  :roll: )... neither board would allow the system to even POST with JR1 enabled and certain RAM installed.  (One of those boards would boot with JR1 enabled, and certain unmatched SIMMs installed (a pair of them), but it was such an anomaly I don't even consider it a success.)  Matched pairs, marked 60ns, some not marked 60ns... as soon as I took JR1 off, disabling burst mode, both boards would again boot.  

One of the boards (the one I used for many years) could not render SpaceFighters from LW3D 3.5 into a HAM6 anim without hard-locking the machine part way through.  The other board, with infinitely less hours on it, can render the same anim fine, with the same RAM and similar jumper settings (burst mode off, of course).  I say *similar* jumper settings because it wasn't until I had both boards next to each other again that I realized my more-used board has had the "ROM type" jumper set wrong for ... who knows how long.  As the machine seemed to lock when doing *disk access* while saving the ANIM frames out, I wonder if this ROM jumper could have had something to do with that board's problems, though I do doubt it.

Whether I'm going to do more testing to determine if this jumper was causing the locks during LW3D rendering disk saves, I don't know.  I'd rather just sell/trade the card.

Again, please do let me know if you find anything from changing the burst mode jumper...

thanks,
t
Amiga user since \'96, when I could finally afford one
Commodore 8-bit since before I could tie my shoes